Vergil - Portrait of a Warrior

[Foxtrot94]

It's ironic, since me and my friend have been studying his behavior and appearance, searching for hidden meanings, since in Japanese culture everything has a hidden meaning, even the silliest things.
This guy was carefully designed to be a "Dragon", the noblest creature in Asia. He sets himself as a Emperor, even his coat is apparently made of silk, inspired in those Asian Emperor's coats.

Things always fall apart when you read into things way too much and more than you should.

 

[Gel]

Things always fall apart when you read into things way too much and more than you should.

Sure, but I'm even more guilty of expecting great things from lazy and uncreative people.I expect too much from others, the same way I expect too much from myself.

 

[Veloran]

Hmmm, let us see...
The first time Vergil is said to be honorable is in DMC1 by Dante, who likes V attitude without knowing who the guy is, but DMC1 novel shows V as being a total scum who is totally perverse, to the point of killing an defenseless old lady with a shotgun that belongs to her.
In DMC3 manga, Dante seems to think about V as having no honor saying " A man like you reduced to a demon's spawn! How sad!", so Dante does not hold V in high regard anymore.
The only thing people seem to associated with honor is the fact V doesn't like to use guns, but he used it anyway, even if it was once. A lot of thieves and murders do the same, they prefer physical confrontation over a cowardly approach...
Unless this character is badly written ( which he is), definitively he has no honor.He is prideful, but not honorable.Now, in the speculation field, if V will do what I think he will in DMC4 SE, any honor he could still have will go down the drain.
Am I wrong?

Vergil was honorable in the same way an ancient samurai would be honorable.

That is to say a huge dickbag to a normal person, but still staunchly following their own code no matter what. Even as a mind-controlled pawn of Mundus he still stubbornly did things his own way.

That's why I said the " I need power because bad demons killed momma" justification is too empty.It leaves a bitter taste in my mouth.

I think there's more to it than that, even if that was his leading motivation. Vergil saw himself as too weak to protect her, and so became obsessed with the Demonic power and legacy of his father. He wanted to live up to the version of Sparda he had idealized in his own mind, and become the next "Legendary Dark Knight". Ironically though, Vergil never really came to understand what made Sparda so powerful, never realized that all that strength was secondary to actually having something good to fight for. Dante and even Nero recognized this, but Vergil was always too blinded by his own vision.

That's why I like Vergil so much really. Despite all these allusions to being the Dragon, the Emperor, the First Son, he was never truly aware of what it meant to actually inherit the will of his father.

 

[Foxtrot94]

Sure, but I'm even more guilty of expecting great things from lazy and uncreative people.I expect too much from others, the same way I expect too much from myself.

Exactly, your fault. Condemned to clean all of Temen Ni Gru from Leviathan's sh!t. I'll exclude the top floor just because you admitted it (and because rain will wash it away anyway LOL).

 

[Viper]

Exactly, your fault. Condemned to clean all of Temen Ni Gru from Leviathan's sh!t. I'll exclude the top floor just because you admitted it (and because rain will wash it away anyway LOL).

Not much of a gentleman, are you? She admitted, therefore half is forgiven. So pick up that mop and bucket and get going, your half of tower is waiting. XD

 

[Gel]

Exactly, your fault. Condemned to clean all of Temen Ni Gru from Leviathan's sh!t. I'll exclude the top floor just because you admitted it (and because rain will wash it away anyway LOL).

@Foxtrot94 , that's too raunchy to say to a lady! You need a good spanking!

@Veloran , I agree with most you said, but I expect even more, I need more.

 

[Foxtrot94]

Not much of a gentleman, are you? She admitted, therefore half is forgiven. So pick up that mop and bucket and get going, your half of tower is waiting. XD

Gentleman? That's human stuff.

Besides, you don't ask a Predator to be a cleaner... if you know what I mean...

 

[Viper]

Gentleman? That's human stuff.

Besides, you don't ask a Predator to be a cleaner... if you know what I mean...

If you're Predator, I'm Dante. So... *presents Pandora* Wanna see how fast you can run, Skippy?

 

[Foxtrot94]

If you're Predator, I'm Dante. So... *presents Pandora* Wanna see how fast you can run, Skippy?

Nope, Dante's not female. And Pandora is a pretty slow weapon anyway, the prep time takes ages.

Now, if you were Vergil... but you can't be, so...

 

[Viper]

Nope, Dante's not female. And Pandora is a pretty slow weapon anyway, the prep time takes ages.

Now, if you were Vergil... but you can't be, so...

What does my RL gender have with it? You're not extraterrestrial, after all.
Doesn't matter about Pandora being slow, Dante makes up for it with his own speed and strength. Besides, if Predator could be beaten by a middle-aged detective, then Dante can do it while eating pizza and listening to Trish nag about leaving the toilet seat up.

 

[Foxtrot94]

Besides, if Predator could be beaten by a middle-aged detective, then Dante can do it while eating pizza and listening to Trish nag about leaving the toilet seat up.

We'll deal with Dante in due time. We are the hunters on this planet now. Hunters of demons and humans alike.

 

[Veloran]

I agree with most you said, but I expect even more, I need more.

In what way?

 

[Gel]

In what way?

Let us say I'm expecting Capcom presents us with deeper motives than " Momma's dead and I have a inferiority complex".
I want to believe this character can have more layers than those Capcom gives us. Just that.

 

[Foxtrot94]

Let us say I'm expecting Capcom presents us with deeper motives than " Momma's dead and I have a inferiority complex".
I want to believe this character can have more layers than those Capcom gives us. Just that.

Well actually that's already a pretty deep motivation, because of the personal nature of it. Plus it ties to his vision of Sparda, which Veloran explained earlier.

 

[Gel]

Well actually that's already a pretty deep motivation, because of the personal nature of it. Plus it ties to his vision of Sparda, which Veloran explained earlier.

Not enough for me, since it implies the guy just lives obsessed with the past.That is not a motivation, it's just a excuse to cause destruction. It can be better than that.

 

[Foxtrot94]

Not enough for me, since it implies the guy just lives obsessed with the past.That is not a motivation, it's just a excuse to cause destruction. It can be better than that.

Disagreed.

 

[Gel]

So we agree in disagree.

Just a question:
When you talk about a code of honor related to samurais, is this the code you're talking about?
Because if it is, Vergil doesn't fit on it.

Seven Virtues of Bushidō (as envisioned by Nitobe Inazo)
The Bushidō code is typified by seven virtues:

• Righteousness (義 gi?)
• Courage (勇 yū?)
• Benevolence (仁 jin?)
• Respect (礼 rei?)
• Sincerity (誠 makoto?)
• Honour (名誉 meiyo?)
• Loyalty (忠義 chūgi?)

Associated virtues

• Self-Control (jisei?)
• Filial piety (孝 kō?)
• Wisdom (智 chi?)
• Fraternal Respect (悌 tei?)

 

[AgentRedgrave]

So we agree in disagree.

Just a question:
When you talk about a code of honor related to samurais, is this the code you're talking about?
Because if it is, Vergil doesn't fit on it.

Seven Virtues of Bushidō (as envisioned by Nitobe Inazo)
The Bushidō code is typified by seven virtues:

• Righteousness (義 gi?)
• Courage (勇 yū?)
• Benevolence (仁 jin?)
• Respect (礼 rei?)
• Sincerity (誠 makoto?)
• Honour (名誉 meiyo?)
• Loyalty (忠義 chūgi?)

Associated virtues

• Self-Control (jisei?)
• Filial piety (孝 kō?)
• Wisdom (智 chi?)
• Fraternal Respect (悌 tei?)

No one called him a follower of Bushido.

 

[Gel]

So, is there another Samurai code? Which code I must know to understand Vergil's concept of honor?

 

[Chancey289]

Vergil is always just presented as this petty one dimensional Saturday morning cartoon villain. This is Capcom we're talking about here after all. That's pretty much their forte. Hell, look at their games. I believe myself, and other writers here can do better than they could ever do.

In the hands of a better writer, Vergil could be a more interesting character. Instead, he's there to fulfill a very trite archetype and nothing more. The original games could never even keep a consistent character arc. At least the latest game has an arc for these characters. It establishes things. Is it the best I've ever seen? F#ck no. There's a lot of things I would have personally done differently. But it's competent at the very least and does its job in a game like this.

And yea, Vergil in DMC 3 still isn't honorable. He's just a selfish, petty, d!ckhead. He has complete disregard for anyone he deems inferior and is willing to sacrifice anything for means to an end. If you look up the word honorable in the dictionary, Vergil sure as hell doesn't live up to that quota. To put it bluntly, some people here seriously have no idea what they're talking about when it comes to defending this accusation. Gel, I wouldn't even worry about it.