Flamers are gonna flame, pal.
Why the hate?
- Thread starter Ryu Yamato
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Flamers are gonna flame, pal.
Would you mind adjusting your skeptic glasses up the bridge of your nose and tell me where I mentioned the younger generations of any console? Is that what you think of when you hear the term "gamers"? Because that's the term I used.
Oh, and I'm fairly certain most gamers know who Pac-Man and Sonic are. Pac-Man is synonymous with gaming---it's one of the first games most people have actually played. And Sonic...well, most of the fanbase consists solely of old-school fans or kids...people from older and younger generations. That probably has something to do with SEGA featuring the character in over 50 games. (versus the...you know, FOUR games in the Devil May Cry series...) . Captain Commando and Ghouls N' Ghosts haven't had much in the way of games over the years, so it's no surprise that their protagonists haven't reached the fame of more recognizable characters.
Again...tell me where I referred to Dante as an "insignificant character that nobody knows about." You do enjoy conjuring up things I haven't said, don't you? You should consider politics in your spare time...you'd blend in perfectly in the ranks of babbling men clad in suits thicker and sturdier than the paper-thin arguments they spew about like confetti.
Capcom placing Dante in promotional art, cross-over games, and as additional costumes in other software doesn't make Dante iconic. Look at half of the obscurity dug out of Namco's intellectual properties in Project X Zone, or the Skies of Arcadia character and stage that appeared in Sega All-Stars Racing.
Gather around and cling to your striped pajamas and bedposet as I reveal this exciting new scrap of information to you: when a company has a number of intellectual properties, even unused and obscure ones, they're bound to be utilized for the sake of expansion or variety. Do you think Pit from Kid Icarus or the Ice-Climbers were featured in Super Smash Bros. because they're iconic? Is Mitsurugi's 2P costume in Soulcalibur II a nod to Samurai Shodown because the series is iconic? Do you think characters like Nariko, Sir Daniel, Parappa the Rapper were featured in Playstation All-Stars because they're iconic?
If a character is dragged out of his/her respective franchise to be in something else, it isn't because he or she is iconic. Companies utilize their internally-owned properties for a quick buck all the time, even if they have to dig into the crevice of their less popular and more obscure ones. Either that, or there's some reference or irony to be had by their appearance that companies hope gamers will detect (i.e., a Devil Hunter like Dante appearing in a game called Monster Hunter, ignoring the fact that they're both Capcom-owned franchises).
Dante and the Devil May Cry series is not "iconic" by any stretch of the imagination. I'm not saying that either one has absolutely no purpose or contribution to gaming as a whole, but neither have had the wide-spread appeal, mainstream popularity, or impactful legacy to warrant instant and universal recognition amongst gamers.
None of your examples has anything to do with advertisements. Dante is one of faces on many Capcom's advertisment programs serving as "Icon", Archetype of his own franchise. He's one of the most representative characters in Capcom palette, which you blatantly ignore. Fact that they make archetype based on him (costumes etc) is already enough proof that he grown into icon in Capcom's game franchises. And i don't talk abut spaghetti westerns like Smash bros. or All-Stars., where most characters added to big pot. The fact that they use his "look" for promotion is undeniable, hense all your points has no ground and don't even matter to reality, unless you keep doing it out of obvious spite.
To go on @The Final Offer 's suggestion of it being a PS4 launch title instead of being released in the waning years of the Ps3/xbox360 console life, that would have helped as it could have received a kick in sales due to launch title buzz.
It might have had the possibility to work out the kinks with the game's story structure. Their story is ambitious and intricate but the linear 20 mission structure doesn't really help that so most of it felt shallow or unsure of itself (as one youtuber put it) a more open or non-linear structure might have helped smooth it out by giving a little extra room to world-build/character build outside of a cut-scene.
But it probably wouldn't have helped with the game's core problem which was people weren't on board with NT's take because they thought of it as a in-name only adaptation on par with Dragon Ball Evolution and major disrespect towards the franchise based off their first impression of the tgs 10 trailer.
That mixed in with the first year from tgs10-11 where capcom and NT didn't exactly do a good job explaining their take to alleviate fan fears was the biggest contention. Thats not to say they didn't eventually figure out how, its just that it was too late because people already wrote it off.
The only plausible thing that could have helped would have been too push back the game's announcement to next year rather than tgs10 (either captivate, e3 or tgs11) as that would have given NT time to actually work on the game fully rather than juggling it with Enslaved plus it would given capcom time to actually work on a effective pr strategy rather than fly by the seat of their pants like what they did with DmC's PR.
The problem of the Take would still be there but they would have had a stronger foundation to stand on (which is what they lacked) to pitch the idea. No one said you had to take a risk stupidly which is what they did because even by their own admission, they had step one done at tgs 10's debut so wouldnt it made sense to atleast step 2 or 3 before jumping in the deep end of the pool.
It might have had the possibility to work out the kinks with the game's story structure. Their story is ambitious and intricate but the linear 20 mission structure doesn't really help that so most of it felt shallow or unsure of itself (as one youtuber put it) a more open or non-linear structure might have helped smooth it out by giving a little extra room to world-build/character build outside of a cut-scene.
But it probably wouldn't have helped with the game's core problem which was people weren't on board with NT's take because they thought of it as a in-name only adaptation on par with Dragon Ball Evolution and major disrespect towards the franchise based off their first impression of the tgs 10 trailer.
That mixed in with the first year from tgs10-11 where capcom and NT didn't exactly do a good job explaining their take to alleviate fan fears was the biggest contention. Thats not to say they didn't eventually figure out how, its just that it was too late because people already wrote it off.
The only plausible thing that could have helped would have been too push back the game's announcement to next year rather than tgs10 (either captivate, e3 or tgs11) as that would have given NT time to actually work on the game fully rather than juggling it with Enslaved plus it would given capcom time to actually work on a effective pr strategy rather than fly by the seat of their pants like what they did with DmC's PR.
The problem of the Take would still be there but they would have had a stronger foundation to stand on (which is what they lacked) to pitch the idea. No one said you had to take a risk stupidly which is what they did because even by their own admission, they had step one done at tgs 10's debut so wouldnt it made sense to atleast step 2 or 3 before jumping in the deep end of the pool.
I thought we were talking about "iconic" in gaming, not "iconic" in Capcom's field of characters. But, whatever. I'm not even going to pretend you read a word of my post...that may seem like to excruciating of an endeavor.
Iconic is such a troublesome term. Dante was certainly iconic for hack and slash genre, as in you can't really talk about it without mentioning DMC at least briefly, he is also one of Capcom's most recognizable characters, the rest depends on your point of view.
I read your post, but like I said using his outfit to promote game isn't the same as putting duck hunt characters in Smas bros. Overall it's pretty much what Sunny said. If you like this genre you must have heard of him. If not...well honestly I also has no clue what F-Zero means, since I never owned nintendo console aside from Wii or NES and not into racing either.
In the end it's pretty much what @Sunny said
And that's not just your imagination talking: Sonic made it into the Thanksgiving parade back in '93 right? So, what makes anyone think that Dante would ever achieve that sort of recognition to begin with??
http://sonic.wikia.com/wiki/Sonic_Parade_Balloon
"The only other video game character to ever be in the parade was Pikachu 8 years later."
Exactly. Iconic in terms of the hack n' slash genre, absolutely---in gaming as a whole, I don't think Dante has reached that level of fame and recognition. When something has so little a lifespan and legacy to imprint on gaming as a whole, it's extremely hard to label it as "iconic."
That's all I'm saying.
Dante is on the short bus of gaming icons. His legacy really sits most with the people who have played the games, but he's not some household name. Hell, I've seen the forum talk about how Devil May Cry as a whole has just been knocked off the radar. If it was really as iconic as they think it is, then that wouldn't happen.
Iconic characters like Mario, Sonic, etc. have been embedded in the cultural conscious where everyone and their grandma knows who they are. I can go ask anyone who Mario is, and they will know. Dante, not so much.
Dante has faded away over time among the gaming community as a whole. Doesn't help that the hack n slash genre is just also an ailing one. That's part of the reason why I can see why a reboot for the franchise was considered in the first place. A new generation of gamers (which does exist) were never even introduced to Dante.
Iconic characters like Mario, Sonic, etc. have been embedded in the cultural conscious where everyone and their grandma knows who they are. I can go ask anyone who Mario is, and they will know. Dante, not so much.
Dante has faded away over time among the gaming community as a whole. Doesn't help that the hack n slash genre is just also an ailing one. That's part of the reason why I can see why a reboot for the franchise was considered in the first place. A new generation of gamers (which does exist) were never even introduced to Dante.
TWOxACROSS
Hot-blooded God of Guns
All I can think about with the mention of "iconic for Capcom because Dante's been in a lot of art regarding Capcom" is that I've seen many a piece of art featuring people like Regina and Arthur, who are by far way less iconic. Wolf isn't wrong, IP holders use whoever they got to fill spots, because it's easier that way, and also shows a legacy - just not necessarily what's iconic. More than anything, the constant use of someone like Dante in other material as a 'guest star' is to make him more relevant (or to retain waning relevance), to literally make him more iconic. Look at Marth and Roy - interest in Fire Emblem didn't exist in the West until Marth and Roy made an appearance in Super Smash Bros. Melee. Their relevance in a greater circle was specifically due to guest appearances.
However, that's not to say that Devil May Cry isn't something to people who know this hack 'n' slash genre, it's part of it after all, but even in those terms God of War is sadly more well-known because of what it did. Kratos is more iconic than Dante in general gaming culture.
However, that's not to say that Devil May Cry isn't something to people who know this hack 'n' slash genre, it's part of it after all, but even in those terms God of War is sadly more well-known because of what it did. Kratos is more iconic than Dante in general gaming culture.
Your example of Marth and Roy's appearance in Melee garnering more interest in the Fire Emblem series makes me wonder if Dante's appearence in Marvel vs. Capcom 3 didn't garner more publicity and relevance for the Devil May Cry series. That was certainly the case for most of my gaming friends...most of them didn't even know who Dante was before that game.
The part about Kratos is unfortunately true as well. I'm no fan of God of War, at the best of times, but the mountainous advertising, coverage, and budget Sony has poured into that series has contributed greatly to the series' outlandish popularity. That is marketing done right.
If Capcom advertised its franchises in the same explosive fashion it does with Street Fighter, Dead Space, and Resident Evil, more niche characters like Dante would be far more recognizable and iconic.
Games? I meant the movie franchise and comic book series obviously. The games for blade sucked.
And Dante may be popular in Capcom's little mincemeat circle, but outside of that, he really isn't breaking any boundaries in terms of popularity. Unlike Ryu or the street fighter cast, Dante is below the scale of popularity but is barely a float. even now with no news on the franchise's future, Devil May Cry as a whole is slowly fading away from the gaming world's view, and no amount of fangasming or defending your so-called "iconic" character is going to fix that unless Capcom get their sh!t together and do a damn game already.
Dude, Dante is a character from an M rated game. You really think they'd let him into a parade when he comes from a game with the word "DEVIL" in it?
yeah, f*ck me for having a voice, right? -_-
Small info taken from wikipedia, so if you need sources take your time and go Dante's page, since I won't be posting every single source here:
Source:
"Dante's confident and fearless attitude has gained him widespread popularity. When first introduced, Game Informer described him as "one of the most bad-ass characters around," citing the contrast between his character and those previously seen in theResident Evil series.[11] His design and personality received praise from numerous reviews, such as IGN, who referred to him as "a dark antihero kind of guy even a down-in-the-dumps, disgruntled teenager would love."[68] GameSpy described his appearance as "awe-inspiring to look at", feeling his attire was reminiscent of Vincent Price.[69] Empire also ranked Dante on their list of the 50 greatest video game characters as 38th, adding "Dante is surely one of the coolest mothers in the history of videogaming".[70]
And franchise's future has nothing to do with character reception. Go ask Megaman. It basically ended as PoP. Done reboot. Many hated it. Franchise shelved.
Take it or leave it. I don't really care :/
Yeah, cause I ALWAYS take Wikipedia's words to heart.
Well if he's SOOO popular as that said...
WHERE HE AT NOW?
WHERE DMC5 BE AT??
WHERE WAS HE AT THE VG AWARDS THIS YEAR???
WHY BAYO 2 RULING THE HACK N SLASH GAME????
Y'know, since he IS popular n' all.
Megaman is popular and Capcom hasn't released anything from the franchise lately. Capcom just doesn't know what to do with it's franchises, they are so desperate for big sale numbers that they can't take their time to invest in long term with games.
Dante is well known, but all those things on wikia aren't a little exaggerate?I mean, he is cool and all, but he can be describe basically as " Pirate Cobra with Prince Lotor (from Voltron ) personality ".
And yes, he is famous in internet, but surely he is even more infamous, being target to every kind of jokes. And they forget to mention Dante ranked high on a japanese poll of " Good looking, but highly disappointing characters".
So, for the better and the worst, he is a kinda of iconic.
And yes, he is famous in internet, but surely he is even more infamous, being target to every kind of jokes. And they forget to mention Dante ranked high on a japanese poll of " Good looking, but highly disappointing characters".
So, for the better and the worst, he is a kinda of iconic.
That name fits him well in both iterations.
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