Just another combo move of this game that may or may not interest you...

[Chancey289]

Honestly the game does lack depth to it. However it's not as much compared to what people originally think. (But it's still a considerable amount)

Lemme break things down. (For starters, I'll be using DMC4 mainly for comparison)



In DMC4, there are a whole list of advanced mechanics that actually deepen the gameplay. While some of these mechanics are kinda questionable and don't add too much in terms of combat, they create another layer of depth that increases the skill gap between a newcomer and a veteran DMC player. Not only this, but some techniques in DMC4 are incredibly hard to do due to the technical requirements needed to perform each technique.

However in DmC, there's not a lot of mechanics that the game has to offer that expands the combat system compared to DMC4. There are a lot of weapons that were added in DmC that gave the combat system more variety, but it still didn't give technical depth in the gameplay. And most of the mechanics that are in DmC are also in DMC4 or have been replaced with something different (E&I cancelling replacing DMC4's Guard Cancelling for certain moves). And when it comes to technical skill, I feel as if the game's difficulty of input execution comes from relearning the controls that DmC has, rather than actually pulling off complex maneuvers that require good execution.


When it comes to new mechanics, this is what DmC has to offer (from what I remember):

E&I (Ebony & Ivory) Cancelling: Equivalent to Guard Cancelling but with less uses. Cancels certain attacks with E&I (moves like Trillion Stabs and Prop Shreddar) This was also apparent in DMC3 and DMC4 but DmC enables you to certain moves much faster. It's not really a new mechanic

Reverse Rainstorm Double Jump Cancelling: Cancelling reverse rainstorm with a double jump to create an extremely short hop.

Gun Charge Stacking: Charging two guns at once.

Auto Gun Charge: Enabling you to charge guns without holding down the gun button.

Arbiter Drop Cancelling: Cancelling the start up animation of Drop by using it very close on the ground.

Rapid Slash Cancelling: Cancelling Vergil's Rapid slash with a jump

Doppelganger De-sync: De-syncing Vergil's doppelganger with charged moves

Airstand: Enabling you to attack in midair with a ground attack.

Airdodging: Being able to dodge in midair. Creates movement options.


From all of this, there's no actual depth to some of these mechanics since they don't offer that much when it comes expanding the combat system. The main thing that IS good is the Doppelganger De-sync and the Gun Charge Stacking since the De-sync can enable you to control both characters at once (similar to Ice Climbers in Smash Bros.) and with Gun Charge Stacking, you can use two charged shots in succession, creating some different setups. Not to mention that since older mechanics were taken out of DmC, this makes the game lack even more depth compared to what the originals had to offer. (Again, mainly talking about DMC4) I would also list the mechanics of DMC4 but that would kinda be too much since there's a lot to cover seeing how the metagame for it has been developing for years.

People aren't close minded for claiming DmC lacks depth. It actually does lack quite a bit of depth. And the people who actually analyze combat mechanics in various games can see it more easily compared to someone who's just getting into DmC for the first time without prior knowledge of the past DMC games.

Just wanted to shed light on this since a lot of people still think that DmC is superior to past games, when honestly it isn't.



Also long time no see to some of you. It's been awhile.

 

[TWOxACROSS]

Let's just let it be, okay?

---------------

Also totally forgot to comment about the video, as was my initial intention before seeing how the discussion degraded.

Love me some michellegun and love me some Zircon. Thanks for sharing the vid!

 

[Chancey289]

This is why we can't have nice things.

Always with these silly debates.

 

[TWOxACROSS]

And nice things are expensive, and we're dirt poor, cheap-ass bastards. Or cheap ass-bastards (hyphens are fun!).

 

[Demi-fiend]

Oh. My. F**king. God. This.

Always with these silly debates.

Especially since they never leave you alone, even long after you've left the conversation and tried to ignore them.

Let's just let it be, okay?

NEVAR.

Seriously though, although I'll try to avoid the matter in the future, it'll be a HELL of a long time before I forget this.

 

[Exejpgwmv]

However in DmC, there's not a lot of mechanics that the game has to offer that expands the combat system compared to DMC4.

http://devilmaycry.org/threads/how-much-of-dmcs-gameplay-is-in-dmc.17235/
There's no need to lie to try and support your stand point.

And I don't want to be rude(especially sense I'm a fan of your videos), but what you said is just ridiculous.

 

[Exejpgwmv]

But...aren't you doing the same thing?

No, he didn't.
No where did he say DmC was "obviously" better than any other game.

 

[Demi-fiend]

http://devilmaycry.org/threads/how-much-of-dmcs-gameplay-is-in-dmc.17235/
There's no need to lie to try and support your stand point.

Yes, there is. That's the only way his theory could ever stand on its own to begin with. Thanks for posting that link, btw.

No, he didn't.
No where did he say DmC was "obviously" better than any other game.

That's right. I've said over and over, that it's only my opinion.

It's my opinion that I think DmC has really enjoyable and stellar gameplay. It's my opinion that I don't want to go back to the older titles because I'm into DmC way more than I'll ever be into the old series.

 

[Exejpgwmv]

It does, actually. He presented evidence, while you just covered your ears and presented a few videos with no clarification on its relevance to the argument. I'm not sure if you are being evasive, bating or trolling. The irony is thick when the person blaming close-mindedness on those who believe DmC isn't deep enough, is close minded himself. Also, he never stated that his opinion holds more weight.
Perhaps you need a dictionary: o·pen-mind·ed - willing to consider new ideas.


I love it when someone avoids arguments like that, don't you think? From the beginning I knew having a civil discussion with you isn't feasible.


Funny as you're the one being aggressive here. ChaserTech was being as civil as it gets, but of course you called people close-minded for not having your viewpoint of DmCs depth, dismissing Chaser's argument because, in a nutshell, "tl;dr" and falsely reported him based on the assumption that he's "flame-bating". Good job.

Yes because saying, "I literally came here to laugh at you." and, "Saying something is not superior is not saying something else is superior. It's actually the opposite.", is such a civil and mature thing to say.
(His second statement is actually logically false by the way.)

 

[Exejpgwmv]

So I assume those videos posted in response to Chaser served as eye candy?


Good to see insults blazing from someone that blames close-mindedness upon those who disagree with your viewpoint. See ya

He didn't insult you though.
At worst he was just being smarmy.

 

[Exejpgwmv]

Here's the issue, the main reason why people don't consider this game deep enough is because games of larger depth exist (such as bayonneta and DMC4). Since this is part of the DMC series, DmC is often compared to the previous installments, in this case DMC4. All he did was tell you why people don't classify DmC as deep, because games like DMC4 exist.

If I'm wrong, Chaser, enlighten me of your intentions.

1)Bayonneta and DMC4 having more depth is debatable.
2)"All he did was tell you why people don't classify DmC as deep, because games like DMC4 exist."
Again debatable, and he wasn't trying to explain why OTHER people think DmC lacks depth only why from his standpoint it does.
You can see this in his first statement: "Honestly the game does lack depth to it. However it's not as much compared to what people originally think. (But it's still a considerable amount)

Lemme break things down. (For starters, I'll be using DMC4 mainly for comparison)"

He makes no attempt to speak for anyone else but himself.

 

[Exejpgwmv]

Ok considering how long it took me to master guard flying , sky running , inertia side raves reverse raves star raves and switching and double switching guns styles and devil arms on the fly while also buffering moves and working it all into combos on DMC4 for xbox and pc after already mastering jc on DMC3 i know exactly where chasertech is coming from.

DmC has a brilliant combo system but it is not as punishing on timing or inputs as DMC4 is and has less available cancel exploits as a whole.

This takes nothing away from the game it is a great game but if like me and others you want to wreck your hands pulling off mind boggling stuff then DmC is a let down in comparison to DMC4 but not an inferior game because of it

Agreed, but don't feel a little relieved that you no longer have to risk getting a finger cramp trying to pull off an advanced combo?

 

[Exejpgwmv]

This is why we can't have nice things.

Always with these silly debates.

But having an argument once in a while isn't exactly a bad thing.

 

[Innsmouth]

I'm starting to think closing this topic was best way out.

 

[SSSSwagmasterMLGDmCplaya]

ALLOW ME TO CLAIM THAT NOBODY CARES
Even though I took my time to make a post about his post....

Yes because saying, "I literally came here to laugh at you."

I suggest you read the thread again, Chaser never said that.

"Saying something is not superior is not saying something else is superior. It's actually the opposite."

wut

He didn't insult you though

"And thank God your stay is brief. Honestly, some people."
Nope, definitely not an insult :facepalm:
He even insulted others.

1)Bayonneta and DMC4 having more depth is debatable

Its been debated time and time again. Unless the person representing DMC4 clueless of it's combat system, DMC4 always gets the upper hand. I will agree, however, that Bayonneta being deeper is debatable since not many discussion is done about it.

and he wasn't trying to explain why OTHER people think DmC lacks depth only why from his standpoint it does.
He makes no attempt to speak for anyone else but himself.

When I said "All he did was tell you why people don't classify DmC as deep", ChaserTech confirmed it. He was talking on behalf of others. I and a few others on this thread agree that this is why we believe DmC isn't deep enough. Of course, he didn't speak for everyone, I'm certain someone out there has a different reasoning behind DmC not being deep enough for him, but he spoke for most. How many times have you heard people say "DmC was a good hack n' slash, but a bad DMC game"?

Anyways, I think this is enough of me posting in this thread. I dont want to derail this thread any further, especially with Captain Xin being calm and politely asking us to stop.

 

[Exejpgwmv]

I'm starting to think closing this topic was best way out.

 

[Exejpgwmv]

Nope, definitely not an insult :facepalm:
He even insulted others.

Where in there is an insult?
You may have his attitude toward you insulting but in now way did he actually insult you.

Its been debated time and time again. Unless the person representing DMC4 clueless of it's combat system, DMC4 always gets the upper hand.

That actually only proves most are bad at arguing for DmC.
You didn't show why it isn't debatable.

ChaserTech confirmed it

Then he needs to learn how to use proper grammar.
Because any sane person would come to the conclusion that he was talking on behalf of himself not others.

 

[ChaserTech]

http://devilmaycry.org/threads/how-much-of-dmcs-gameplay-is-in-dmc.17235/
There's no need to lie to try and support your stand point.

And I don't want to be rude(especially sense I'm a fan of your videos), but what you said is just ridiculous.

If you really would like to debate about DmC lacking more depth than DMC4, I'm definitely up for the discussion. As of now, I believe DMC4 is slowly reaching it's peak when it comes to combat mechanics. Tons and tons of players have been advancing Dante's metagame to a point where it has kinda plateaued as of now. And there are a lot of hidden mechanics that most people don't know about.

However, as proven in this thread, I don't think it's wise to do it here. Due to overreaction and aggression.

Admittedly, Frosty goes too far sometimes, but it's also amusing to see some people who don't seem to get that he doesn't always stand behind half the sh!t he says, and it's all for shiggles. My favorite is when people take him for some unabashed lover of DmC and DmC-hater-killer spoilershisfavoriteisDMC3

I'm...not sure if behavior like that should go unmonitored. I say this because whenever I get responses like this:

Should've stayed gone, tick.

Also, saying one thing is "obviously" better than another is indeed flame-baiting. Sorry to break it to you, but you've got to learn sometime, right?

Goodbye.

. . . I feel as if it is being somewhat hostile. And to be honest, it seems like he's baiting for attention. Even if he's doing it for "fun".




As for everything else that's going on in the thread, I'ma just play it safe and leave everything alone.
However I STRONGLY suggest you some of you guys to not to get too offended if someone wants to discuss combat mechanics. It's just a discussion. No insults are being thrown around so you really shouldn't get upset.

 

[ef9dante_oSsshea]

Agreed, but don't feel a little relieved that you no longer have to risk getting a finger cramp trying to pull off an advanced combo?

to be honest not really because my fingers are used to it and i prefer it that way but it was easier which isn't a bad thing

 

[Dark Drakan]

First of all, that video on the first post is pretty cool I think. Very impressive, I wish to be as good as that someday.

However, reading along the discussion it seems that the discussion didn't quite go well just because someone had a different opinion regarding the depth of DmC versus the older titles. I haven't played them enough to say my opinion is as solid as anyone here but from the amount I've played I find it that the older games do have more mechanics to play around with, or at least that's what I've read about, and that is no way negative.

That being said, it's also seems pretty weird that a lot of the posters in this thread are getting worked up/infuriated about someone bringing up game mechanics. As I've said, I'm no long-time member here but I don't think that warrants a report off-the-bat. Nor does it warrant obviously aggressive responses.

Nice to see some sense prevailing in this thread. :thumbsup:

Please don't, I'd rather it polite then being locked like one of those troll threads.

The thread had good intentions and if everyone would climb back down off those high horses they are currently on I see no reason the thread cant continue in a MATURE manner.

I would like to request that this thread be locked.

It seems as though a few new members joined just post on this specific thread, therefore, in order to prevent any more arguing, I think lockdown is the best solution.

Please do NOT request thread closures as it is a staff members decision if a thread should be closed. Only thread creators can request the closure of their threads. Link to rules.

I literally came here to laugh at you.

Comment was uncalled for and added nothing to the thread besides a negative tone and flame bait. Warning shall be added next time. Link to rules also enclosed.

No trolling, harassing or insulting others, or otherwise behaving like a self-absorbed idiot.​

These add nothing to a thread and could be considered spam (goes for everyone else too).

Where in there is an insult?
You may have his attitude toward you insulting but in now way did he actually insult you.


That actually only proves most are bad at arguing for DmC.
You didn't show why it isn't debatable.


Then he needs to learn how to use proper grammar.
Because any sane person would come to the conclusion that he was talking on behalf of himself not others.

From the rules also:

Double-posting or reviving 'dead' topics is only allowed under very specific conditions. Use common sense to determine whether or not you have a legitimate reason to engage in either. Also posts that add nothing to a thread (constant meme pics etc) can be considered spam.​

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