How to bring the heavenly realm to DMC 5 : God and angels

[Domingo]

I have my own idea on this topic ( I've made a fanfic in french^^).

Maybe we can introduce God and angels in a remake of the first DMC.

You know Mallet island, right ? Who build this castle ?

Imagine :

Six hundred years ago, a young teuton knight join the Inquisition ( i don't know the english word who means the christian order that burned witches ?). During his quest of heretics, he found a mysterious cube and manuscript : the NECRONOMICON.

Instead of give those artefacts to the vatican, he choose to keep them. A strange fascination forced him to keep those relics ; with them he felt stronger, more determinated, he was able to watch them during many hours.... the beginning of obscession.

Dozen of years have pasted since he found the relics, he's older and have to resign. Comeback to his home in Germany (Schwarzwald), he began to live a normal life as a aristocrat. But soon, scaries nightmares haunted him. The only peaceful moment he had is when he watch the cube.
Memories of witches in the blaze appear on his mind every night... the beginning of insanity

Finally, in a crisis of insanity he killed all of his subjects and member of his family. At the end of the mayhem, he was covered of blood and a voice came out from the cube :
"You serve me well Schneider... reward time has come."

Suddenly he wakes up ! A nightmare again...
Until this day, he was obscessed by a plan : build a castle on the Mallet island. How did he know the existence of this place ? He had no idea but he knew what he had to do.

His family and subjects were no really dead or alive, they became a sort of puppet.For other human they were still normal but in fact they were cursed. Schneider (the teuton knight)had really killed them but an antic evil force keep them "alive" as puppet.

Finally, the obscession of Schneider come true : the castle was build on Mallet island. During a dark ceremony (orgy, sacrifice, torture) Schneider opened the cube : an archidiable was locked in.
"Time of reward has come Schneider!"
"I give you immortality, this is a precious gift for a precious slave."
At this moment, the archidiable take the appearence of Schneider and Schneider is transformed in a senile old man.

(sorry for my bad english level. I have to stop here because i have to make a break)

 

[Devil Bane]

Just saying,what about SuperDante's idea about DMC 5?It certainly kept some of us busy and it was fine.

 

[Meg]

Considering where the series is going and what's been established so far I don't know if God would work in DMC. As an important character I mean. BUT! Angels would work I think. Perhaps in the next game real angels will come in because they're mad about regular people trying to become angels in 4. Uh...I can't think of how it will go from there.

 

[moseslmpg]

Fred, you have a pretty good idea there. It does explain why we haven't seen them so far fairly decently. And Supernatural is a show that DMC would do well to model itself after, in terms of the integration of the whole mythos into the plot of each episode.

As for my question, I only meant the definition of God in this thread. God could be seen as simply a powerful light being opposite to the Devil, or he could be seen as the creator of both light and dark, etc. Likewise, angels could be seen merely as light beings, or as servants of God, or opposites of demons, etc. For instance, would it be acceptable if the angels were also evil, or if God was evil? Those are key aspects of my idea so I need to know if they are allowed here.

I'm not sure how the Heavenly would play out in the games, because presumably one would want to refrain from making the angels just like demons, except made of light and feathers rather than darkness and scales.

Edit: If they did introduce the Heavenly into the games, I think they should keep it vague and not go for any one tradition. So I don't think they should have some guy named Michael as THE Michael. I also think that any angelic beings should have a passive role in the series, seeing as how they haven't done anything so far and really have no reason to start getting involved. IMO, the Heavenly should be relegated to the philosophical aspect of DMC, and not the active, gameplay aspect of it.

 

[Freddy777]

Thanks moses.
I'm still cautious about defining anything, but if I had to define God then he would be light and good, and from there it is up to your imagination. As with the angels it be the same light and good, from there they could be passively or actively involved. Personally, I'd like to see at least one active angel in the gameplay or at least active in the cutscenes.
Also, I don't like the idea that God and angels could be evil. I mean, the demon world is full of darkness and the human world is both light and dark (good and evil), why wouldn't the heavenly realm be full of Light and Good. It would balance the DMC world.
But, if you can pull it off, like God of War, then go for it. Although I never liked how GOW ended, with all the gods dead and Kratos committing suicide. So lame!
But, anyways, calling an angel in the game Michael wouldn't be like going for tradition, it's up to us to decide what Michael could do in the game. But, if it is the name that bothers, then we could come with some other cool name.

 

[moseslmpg]

Alright, I just needed to clarify, and this means my idea won't work because my God is evil/not light based. I think it is entirely possible for God to be evil, because contrary to popular belief, in DMC, the human world is the world of light. You should read the Genesis account in the manga.

Anyway, with these requirements, I'd probably go with your idea about angels not being able to help the humans world so much because it is so corrupted.

As for it being introduced in gameplay, I just don't see how it would be any different to introduce a Paladin type human character than to introduce an angel. I suppose you could argue that the Paladin is an angelic vessel, but I don't think it is necessary.

That said, this character should rely more on magic attacks than anything IMO. I believe they should have attacks specifically designed to counteract demonic powers, so maybe being able to cancel out DT or Air Hike while battling against them. I don't know how I feel about an AT, but maybe they could just develop a white aura or have an angelic ghost come behind them like Nero. We had actually developed a character like this for a fangame, named Abel. He was all decked out in armor and red crosses and stuff, but we couldn't decide if he was gruff and old or young.

 

[Freddy777]

Well, going with the storytelling, I have another idea expanding on my others, (I'll give a complete story of my idea later). Somthing related to Sparda, and forgive if it goes contrary to some manga, novel, or canon story.
How about, God was involved from the beginnning. He sent an angel named Nathaniel to visit Sparda in the Human world, and agreed that Sparda would seal the demon world and defeat Mundus to be trapped for 2000 years. In the animated series a dark devil talked to Dante saying that Sparda, the dark devil and his brother the white devil agreed they they follow their ambitions. Maybe the angel Nathaniel awakened Sparda's good ambition of protecting the human world.
As for the gameplay, maybe having the human vessel Christian allows the Angel to do physical attacks as well as elemental attacks such as fire. And when Christian is in his "Angel state" Michael could have a summoned shield the blocks all demon attacks.
Anyways, ideas, comments anyone.

 

[darkslayer13]

i actually had a few idea's about this type of thing. basicly it's an expansion on the original explanation in the manga.

in the manga it says that originally there was just the world of darkness and then the world of light ( aka the human world) formed. in my idea the world of light orginally was something like Heaven. living in this world would be angels. then at some point a group of these angels decide to join the demons in order to gain power. with the help of the demons these fallen angels defeat the angels and the world of light is corrupted. the decendents of these fallen angels continue to live in the world of darkness and the souls of the angels are diluted and become the souls of humans. ( note: this applys to all humans so no one is special)

this idea dosen't directly affect the current events of devil may cry by its self but it provides some room for things to expand.

 

[Freddy777]

Cool idea. So these defeated good angels whose souls became the souls of all humans, can these humans regain their angelic powers or even their angelic state?

 

[darkslayer13]

Cool idea. So these defeated good angels whose souls became the souls of all humans, can these humans regain their angelic powers or even their angelic state?

i suppose it would be possible. not all magic is demonic so it would be technicly possible to connect to the power of the world of light and regain the angels' power. a half-demon wouldn't be able to do it ( unless they were a decendent of one of the Fallen but even then it would be 1000 times more difficult than a human trying it) but a normal human that was very skilled in holy magic could possibly pull it off with enough effort.

 

[bobek388]

Alright friends, its getting late, so let me switch from storytelling to gameplay.
If there is going to be a Christian/Archangel Michael playable character, I'd like for the human vessel Christian to look like a mix between a drifter and the Assassin's creed guy. He'd have "Krav Maga" martial arts skills and a stylish longsword with dual M&P15-22 pistols, similar to Lady's in DMC 3. He'd have a Trickster/Swordmaster style mix. And instead of a Devil trigger he'd have a sort of "Angel trigger" where Archangel Michael would reveal himself as an armored angel of light. When Michael unleashes his power it consumes the longsword in fire and the two pistols are consumed in spheres of light that shoots rapid bursts of light. All his abilities are enhanced just like in Devil trigger mode.
Anyways, this is just a start. I'm no artist though it would hard for me to paint it for you guys.

Everything but no Bible angels, PLEASE!!
Do you want Jesus to come and die for demons? xD

 

[Freddy777]

What do you suggest, bobek, would be a good name for an angel?
I myself never really liked Nero's name.

 

[bobek388]

What do you suggest, bobek, would be a good name for an angel?
I myself never really liked Nero's name.

Tyrael is a good name for an Archangel

 

[Freddy777]

Any name that has meaning to it and is connected to an event in the DMC is fine with me. So Tyrael sounds good.
If we are to name any angel it should end with "-el" b/c that means God and they are servants of God after all. For example, Daniel means "God is my Judge".
Did you get Tyrael from the Diablo game?

 

[bobek388]

Any name that has meaning to it and is connected to an event in the DMC is fine with me. So Tyrael sounds good.
If we are to name any angel it should end with "-el" b/c that means God and they are servants of God after all. For example, Daniel means "God is my Judge".
Did you get Tyrael from the Diablo game?

Yes, but that's the only good name I can think off

 

[DreadnoughtDT]

I was thinking something like "Dariel", but Tyrael works well too.

Also, would the angels look like humans, or like the ones in Bayonetta? Or like neither?

 

[Freddy777]

Ok! Here is a list of some names that could be used as names for Angels. You guys can use whichever name you want for your ideas. The meanings of the names are also meant to help with your ideas.

Adiel- He was adorned by God
Adriel- member of God's flock
Amiel- God of my people
Ariel- Lion of God
Asiel- created by God
Aviel- God is my father
Azriel- God is my aid
Daniel- God is my Judge
Emmanuel- God is with us
Exequiel or Otoniel or Uziel- God is my Strength
Ezekiel- Strength of God
Fanuel or Haziel- vision of God
Gabriel or Lemuel- devoted to God
Gamaliel- God is your reward
Gavriel- Man of God
Harel- mountain of God
Ishmael- God will hear
Izrael- Prince of God
Jesabel- oath of God
Joel- God is willing
Michael- Who is like God?
Nathaniel- Gift of God
Nuriel- Fire of the Lord
Oziel- He who has divine strength
Raphael- God has healed
Rauel- friend of God
Samuel- heard, asked of God
Tzuriel or Zuriel- God is my rock
Uriel- God is my light
Yechiel- God lives

 

[Freddy777]

Also, would the angels look like humans, or like the ones in Bayonetta? Or like neither?

Unfortunately I've never seen Bayonetta.
The angels can look like humans or animals. I mean, in Revelation there are four angels called the four "beasts" surrounding the throne of God. One is a bull, a lion, an eagle, and a man. Angels are not one kind like humans are. Angels are their own unnique kind. So each angel is different from another.
Also, in the Bible angels are "ministering spirits". It would make perfect sense to have a physical human vessel to interact in the human world since they are only spirits.

 

[Freddy777]

I know!!
And by the way what's this thing on your avatar? I've seen it so many times, it looks interesting but I don't even know what it is.

Its the world famous Eagle Nebula. Its a cluster of stars. I love stars, nebulas, supernovas, galaxies.
They call the Eagle Nebula the Pillars of Creation.

 

[moseslmpg]

Well, going with the storytelling, I have another idea expanding on my others, (I'll give a complete story of my idea later). Somthing related to Sparda, and forgive if it goes contrary to some manga, novel, or canon story.
How about, God was involved from the beginnning. He sent an angel named Nathaniel to visit Sparda in the Human world, and agreed that Sparda would seal the demon world and defeat Mundus to be trapped for 2000 years. In the animated series a dark devil talked to Dante saying that Sparda, the dark devil and his brother the white devil agreed they they follow their ambitions. Maybe the angel Nathaniel awakened Sparda's good ambition of protecting the human world.

I have a similar idea of Sparda's initial awakening, but I don't go so far as to say that a specific being initiated it. And of course my angels and God are evil.

DS13: That is similar to my framework. Did I send it to you? In any case, I think that would be one of the best ways to insinuate the Heavenly into the series, although it would render it basically impotent. I don't think humans should be descendents of fallen angels either, just regular angels.

Edit: The angels should not have Biblical names. Apocryphal names would be better, and names not ending in -el would be best. There are enough names out there to satisfy that criterion, believe me.