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All about Dragon Ball/Z/GT/Super

ef9dante_oSsshea

Well-known Member
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Xen-Omni 2020
Wonder how the vegeta vs jiren fight will go down

Vegeta is stubborn and will probably take quite a bearing before he is forced to give in

Seens he is doing better than ssjb goku and hit without kaoiken x20 or the time powers though
 

Morgan

Well-known Member
Premium
Xen-Ace 2021

I'm a fan of this channel and curious about this video.

This is a pretty interesting video. It mentioned more of the manga's history than I expected; I had no idea about the one-shot chapter to pilot the concept, or anything beyond DB being based in Journey to the West. The mention of the character design is thought-provoking. All in all, 16 minutes well spent.

Wonder how the vegeta vs jiren fight will go down

Vegeta is stubborn and will probably take quite a bearing before he is forced to give in

Seens he is doing better than ssjb goku and hit without kaoiken x20 or the time powers though

Vegeta always takes a beating. It's the one thing he knows how to do well in his entire run from DBZ onwards, haha. But I still liked him this episode, although they have do make more use of Vegeta being able to counter Jiren and see through his attacks. There's something he did there that merits more than a one-and-done scene for the novelty.
 

Morgan

Well-known Member
Premium
Xen-Ace 2021
Vegeta Fans: "Vegeta is so going to beat up Jiran! All hail Ultra Instinct, Super Saiyan Blue awesome-sauce Super Vegeta!"

Wait, you forgot,

Vegeta Fans: "OMG I hate Kefla!!! She's so arrogant, and she got this power-up out of nowhere!!!" (Vegeta shows up for 2 seconds against Toppo) "I LOVE VEGETA! He's so badass, and I hope he gets Ultra Instinct right now in this very tournament, even though he's nowhere near Goku's level!!!"
 

Dark Drakan

Well-known Member
Admin
Moderator
I was actually impressed with how they handled Vegeta for a change. He wasn’t totally slapped down & actually landed some decent hits & even dodged some attack’s showing off his combat knowledge and strategy. His power boost isn’t totally unexpected as he did train in the time chamber before setting off on the tournament & with every beat down he receives in the tournament he gets stronger (like all saiyans). Yeah he was bettered as expected but he’s still in there & seems he will play a big part in the coming episodes & actually work
with Goku to figure out a strategy for taking Jiren down.
 

Morgan

Well-known Member
Premium
Xen-Ace 2021
pE4BzGk.jpg


Toppo about to drop the hardest Gohan + No.17 diss of all time!

But no, seriously.

The best highlights of this episode are:
Anything to do with Vegeta-- +1 on the above commentary. But it looks like the motivation for this powerup making him surpass his limits is "he's fighting for Cabba's sake/to restore Universe 6", as opposed to his "Yup, I'm arrogant" powered up blast that Jiren tanked last episode. It means the show's forgotten that Vegeta's fought for the sake of other people outside of himself since the Majin Buu saga... what is continuity...
Goku using actual strategy and doing what he does best, which is copying other people's moves for his own benefit. It's a nice taste of his Dragonball "martial arts savant" characterization.
17 just being himself. He's been consistently good, IMO.
Confirmation that Goku and Vegeta can't coordinate to save their lives and continue to fight around each other, which works out surprisingly well for them right now.
Upcoming Frieza vs Low-Rent Beerus-- uh I mean Dyspo.
Justice Dab!

Low points include:
The characters in the sidelines repeating the things we just looked at, but to be fair that's been going on for a while now so it's whatever.
Some intelligence points being taken away from Gohan to give to Goku, because they can't both be smart in the same episode apparently. He's supposed to be the strategist of the group, but it eluded him that he can't coordinate with a fighter he's never spent time with.
We were completely spoiled last episode with Yuya Takahashi's supervision in terms of animation/art, so this episode's quality seems kinda meh in comparison. It looks like consistent high quality is unsustainable with their time constraints. The animation team needs a RoSaT/HTC to work in, at this rate.
 

Sparda's rejected son

For Edenoi!
Premium
Supporter 2014
Well Vegeta ended up getting a new form. To early to say if it is merely a "Super Saiyan Rage Trunks" thing or a actual form that will continue to appear. I guess I have to give this one to the Vegeta fans because he has had a good showing lately.
 

Dark Drakan

Well-known Member
Admin
Moderator
Quite enjoyed the last episode & good to see Vegeta getting some of the spotlight and also gaining a different type of power than Goku rather than simply playing catch up and getting Ultra Instinct too. Good to see Vegeta showing respect towards a fellow warrior but also letting some of his arrogance slide in favour of simply being confident he can find a way to win even though he feels outmatched. Also nice to see how he felt about his promise to Cabba & how much his word means. Great moment when he reached his new level and immediately went on the front foot before Goku and seeing them actually work together was a great moment as well as Goku using some great techniques & tactics in his battle.
 

Lain

Earthbound Immortal
Premium
Something I've been thinking about recently was about the contestants in the Tournament of Power and how it would have been cool to see some Humans from other Universes sorta like how the Saiyans from Universe 6 were similar yet different counterparts to Goku & Vegeta.

I dunno, just with Krillin, Tien and Master Roshi going out so early it felt like the Human characters got the shaft again.
 

berto

I Saw the Devil
Moderator
I hate Dragon Ball Super. It becomes so repetitive after the second arc, and it’s so hokie. I know I say this about a lot of things but the manga is so much better. The fights are more interesting, the plot is way more condensed and it doesn’t all just deteriorate to basically the same fight again and again.
The only problem, though, is that the manga is a monthly thing while the anime is weekly. Pretty much the only place to get a fix is the anime.
 

Morgan

Well-known Member
Premium
Xen-Ace 2021
This episode, Gohan got sent out the best way possible given his lack of training and character status. Couldn't have thought of anything better that didn't result in a powerup out of nowhere on the level of 17 or Frieza. And he's personally responsible for taking out the last fighters of a few universes, therefore eliminating them, so that's good. Certainly better than friggin' Cabba, haha.

High points of this episode:
Gohan took out Dyspo the same way Goku took out Raditz, along with forming an uneasy truce with a former enemy. Like father, like son.
The next arc is gonna involve Frieza training Pan and harnessing her latent anger issues. :p
Gohan more or less proved why he's leader of Universe 7. If it weren't for him, it'd have been 3v4 instead of 2v4. Frieza would've gotten his ass beat otherwise. Even if Toppo doesn't get taken out in the next episode or two, if they can count on outlasting Jiren etc. until the remaining minutes are up, they win.
Dyspo no longer being a cheap copy of Beerus. But considering he got took out like Raditz, his new name is Rabbitz.
The upcoming compilation of ATATATATATATATATATATATATA fight noises.

Low points include:
Gohan's strategy was just a rehash of 17's strat against Toppo ("I'll limit his movements and you knock us both out"). What worked is that he was physically restraining a weakened opponent as opposed to taking a beating from him, and Frieza was "ruthless enough" to use his ki blast instead of hesitating. Gohan wouldn't (and didn't, IMO) have the heart to do it himself in a reverse-case scenario.
Gohan never once thought about Videl or Pan in this tournament, which is a travesty. He's supposed to be the family man that doesn't like to fight for fighting's sake, but goes all out when the people he loves are in danger. For the last episode he was gonna fight in, they should've shown his family as his motivation, and didn't. That was the lowest hanging fruit ever.
What was the point of Goku and Vegeta in this episode? I could've gone the whole <25 minutes without ever seeing them once. They should've focused more on Gohan and Frieza, especially Gohan, see the above point.
Didn't Frieza train to get rid of his stamina issue? Plus, he's already dead. That really shouldn't be an issue. Maybe Toyotaro has his own version of this to address it, though I wouldn't count on it.
Reused animation and jarring art styles. The visuals were poor and it hurt the presentation. IMO that's the last thing this series needs considering it's going on hiatus in March.

Neutral points include:
the hiatus. DBS is doing well in Japan merchandise wise (because this particular show's always been aimed toward children, not 30+ year olds that still think they're the primary audience) and Goku is legitimately the ambassador for the 2020 Tokyo Olympics. Dragonball is doing great. So while Super is ending, that says nothing about the Dragonball series itself. It'll probably come back under a new title (and a new timeslot, maybe?) sometime after the movie they have planned for Dec 2018 or something. I dunno, Dragonball Super GT, or Dragonball SuperZ or Dragonball Ultra or something. Anyway, big shrug to the hiatus. It's not the worst one I've experienced as a fan of something.
 

Sparda's rejected son

For Edenoi!
Premium
Supporter 2014
I hate Dragon Ball Super. It becomes so repetitive after the second arc, and it’s so hokie. I know I say this about a lot of things but the manga is so much better. The fights are more interesting, the plot is way more condensed and it doesn’t all just deteriorate to basically the same fight again and again.
The only problem, though, is that the manga is a monthly thing while the anime is weekly. Pretty much the only place to get a fix is the anime.

You'd fit in perfectly at Kanzenshuu with words like this. I've come to view both mediums as two sides of the same coin. Everything that happens in the Manga happened in the Anime and vice-versa. Yes I'm aware that such things aren't possible but then again I like Dragon Ball Evolution so my sanity is questionable at best.
 

Morgan

Well-known Member
Premium
Xen-Ace 2021
This episode of Sonic the Hedgehog looked amazing. Robotnik is effing shredded.

But no, in all seriousness, this was a fantastic episode, if for the sole fact that Frieza lost his damn mind and isn't 100% smug anymore. Toppo has done what only Goku, Vegeta, and Future Trunks were able to do.

High points of this episode:
Frieza, and the callback to the scene in Namek after the Spirit Bomb.
17. In general. Even if he gets eliminated next episode, he's been the MVP this whole tournament and has eight eliminations under his belt (Vikal, Kakunsa, Rozie, Damon, Anilaza - Koitsukai, Panchia, Bollarator, Paparoni). Even if his power jump was weird, the fact that he wasn't dumbed down to create "tension" in his fights with opponents is much appreciated.
Jiren face-tanking a Final Flash. Just about every "major antagonist" in the series has some level of hopelessness to them, via their feats. Piccolo Sr. destroyed Shenron and killed Master Roshi and Chiaotzu; Vegeta survived a Kamehameha + Kaioken x4 and a Spirit Bomb; Frieza murdered Dende within the first minute of debuting his Final Form, and also survived a Spirit Bomb; Cell achieved Perfect Form, regenerated from a Final Flash, survived his own self-destruction, became Super Perfect and learned Instant Transmission and also decommissioned one of Gohan's arms; Buu could be blown up, cut up, turned to dust, broken into little pieces with each piece individually blasted, and could also destroy whole planets with himself still on it, but had crazy regeneration, and could also absorb fighters to become stronger. Like basically the most hopeless parts of Cell's design but in bubblegum pink. And Super had Beerus outclassing Goku even with the God form. All the antagonists have performed either tactically or with some "OP" feat that people watching serially (and presumably aren't disillusioned by the storytelling) are meant to wonder, "Well, how are the heroes actually going to win this?" But Jiren is that times 1000. Even Ultra Instinct was only making him try just a little bit harder. If the heroes do win, it has to be a tactical win and not a "my power is bigger than yours" deal. Jiren's already invalidated that method. On that note it's amusing to see the same side of the fandom complaining about Goku winning his battles "implausibly"/"with a random powerup" ready to cry foul if he doesn't actually win against Jiren via overpowering him.
Goku and Vegeta getting a relevant scene in the episode, if only for the above point.

Single low point:
Toppo about to Hakai the holy hell out of Frieza with absolutely no fear of being disqualified for killing his opponent. The episode kept going on about eliminations and whatnot, so that was just weird.[/QUOTE]
 

Sparda's rejected son

For Edenoi!
Premium
Supporter 2014
I know the Super Manga established Toppo as a candidate for the Destroyer position but did the Anime ever establish that? I don't remember. (I personally see the Manga and Anime as both happening at the same time so even if the Anime didn't mention that fact I can still accept it.) However if the Anime didn't establish this fact then talk about "Hakai ex-machine" am I right folks? Ooooh Freeza got owned, I guess he can handle a Destruction Ball but not a mustached man covered in destructive energy huh?
So folks think that Goku and the gang upon winning (if they indeed do) will wish back Universe 6 and/or all of them. But! Both Omni Kings were intent on getting rid of Universes so if anyone brings a universe back they will be defying the Omni Kings and thus incurring their wrath. So here are two ways around this, the Super Dragon Balls may be able to remove the kings from resistance and/or Son Goku does something that pacifes the pair and thus they let the Universes wished back remain. Thoughts, comments?
 

Dark Drakan

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Admin
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I know the Super Manga established Toppo as a candidate for the Destroyer position but did the Anime ever establish that? I don't remember. (I personally see the Manga and Anime as both happening at the same time so even if the Anime didn't mention that fact I can still accept it.) However if the Anime didn't establish this fact then talk about "Hakai ex-machine" am I right folks? Ooooh Freeza got owned, I guess he can handle a Destruction Ball but not a mustached man covered in destructive energy huh?
So folks think that Goku and the gang upon winning (if they indeed do) will wish back Universe 6 and/or all of them. But! Both Omni Kings were intent on getting rid of Universes so if anyone brings a universe back they will be defying the Omni Kings and thus incurring their wrath. So here are two ways around this, the Super Dragon Balls may be able to remove the kings from resistance and/or Son Goku does something that pacifes the pair and thus they let the Universes wished back remain. Thoughts, comments?

Was funny seeing Frieza get his ass handed to him unexpectedly but ive actually quite liked him in this arc after being skeptical of his heavy involvement at first. He is at his most dangerous and unpredictable when cornered however and still not entirely sure what his end game goal is, hes still a wildcard factor in the whole tournament despite how little time is left.

Unsure at the moment how it will end but got to be more to the universe erasure than has been said so far and got to be a more sinister undercurrent. Though Jiren is currently the 'enemy', quite a lot of fans have liked his character and seems as if it was intended that he come across this way and although fans are willing Goku & Vegeta to defeat him they want to see him continue in the series. I would like to know more about his character and his backstory but with him being almost too powerful I dont know how they could keep him involved after this arc. Finding a proper villain that is stronger than him etc to give us a reason to see him again seems ludicrous unless there is a significant time jump when this arc ends to it returning in 2019 (rumoured).
 

Sparda's rejected son

For Edenoi!
Premium
Supporter 2014
Was funny seeing Frieza get his ass handed to him unexpectedly but ive actually quite liked him in this arc after being skeptical of his heavy involvement at first. He is at his most dangerous and unpredictable when cornered however and still not entirely sure what his end game goal is, hes still a wildcard factor in the whole tournament despite how little time is left.

Unsure at the moment how it will end but got to be more to the universe erasure than has been said so far and got to be a more sinister undercurrent. Though Jiren is currently the 'enemy', quite a lot of fans have liked his character and seems as if it was intended that he come across this way and although fans are willing Goku & Vegeta to defeat him they want to see him continue in the series. I would like to know more about his character and his backstory but with him being almost too powerful I dont know how they could keep him involved after this arc. Finding a proper villain that is stronger than him etc to give us a reason to see him again seems ludicrous unless there is a significant time jump when this arc ends to it returning in 2019 (rumoured).

Perhaps Freeza wishes for the Omni-King's removal. A sort of mirror opposite of what happened on Namek where 100% Form Freeza flew over towards Purunga and said his wish only to find the dragon accepts wishes in Namekian. Hell Freeza is unaware of Super Shenron's "god language" so maybe Freeza will try something only to get a Namek repeat for himself. Toriyama loves his gags after all.
 

Morgan

Well-known Member
Premium
Xen-Ace 2021
I know the Super Manga established Toppo as a candidate for the Destroyer position but did the Anime ever establish that? I don't remember.

It was most likely in the preliminary U6 v U7 tournament before this one, which episodewise feels like forever ago. I'd guess it was during the part where Toppo declared Goku as "Evil" and Goku was just like "Evil, huh? IDC man, I just want a good fight."

Ooooh Freeza got owned, I guess he can handle a Destruction Ball but not a mustached man covered in destructive energy huh?

One big detail about it was that he could handle a Destruction Ball, yes, but that ball was delivered in a sneak-attack via a minion that was given a bit of the power from God of Destruction Sidra, and split that power into three parts to catch Frieza off guard. That was only a small portion that admittedly, Frieza handled and only pretended to be hurt by, while Goku couldn't get himself out of (in Base Form) and Beerus casually blew it away later.

A small portion that Sidra (and his minions) thought could take out an opponent that they vastly underestimated, is way different from a greater, Spirit-Bomb sized portion of destruction power that's actively being charged up by an opponent that's right there with a more accurate gauge of Frieza's durability. Some of the audience and Frieza were counting on the two situations being exactly the same and relying on his prior experience with a little bit of destruction power to mean the situations would play out the exact same way, and that's not what happened.

But yeah like @Dark Drakan said, it was funny seeing Frieza get beat after so long being smug. It felt good to watch, but also it felt bad to watch, if that makes sense. He's grown on me.

So folks think that Goku and the gang upon winning (if they indeed do) will wish back Universe 6 and/or all of them. But! Both Omni Kings were intent on getting rid of Universes so if anyone brings a universe back they will be defying the Omni Kings and thus incurring their wrath. So here are two ways around this, the Super Dragon Balls may be able to remove the kings from resistance and/or Son Goku does something that pacifes the pair and thus they let the Universes wished back remain. Thoughts, comments?

You're forgetting one thing.

Zen-Oh is a child and decides on the spot what's acceptable and what isn't, based solely on how entertained he is. Both Zen-Ohs were intent on getting rid of the universes because it would be less work to manage what was left, but they've been excited by this tournament so far, with all the transformations and tricks the contestants have pulled. They even voted for Master Roshi's Mafuba being "Safe" because "it looked cool" despite it [being/not being] against clearly established rules. So it could be that they like the whole "Goku is going bwaah!! Bwaah!!" and got enough "Wakuwaku!" "Dokidoki!" from 48 minutes of fighting that they're willing to have all the universes be wished back. That means another opportunity for the contestants to get even stronger, and more "Bwaah!" to happen the next time.

Or the universes get wished back into existence inside Universe 7, so Planet Sadal takes the place of where Planet Vegeta used to be, the Namekians of U6 and U7 can mingle (and not fuse), all the other planets coexist in some part of the galaxy, and Universe 7's Mortal Level (we still have no idea what exactly that is) gets raised up enough to compete with the exempt universes that were left out of this ToP, and we get more diverse contestants to represent U7 instead of "Everyone is from Earth except Frieza who came from Hell".

OR, the universes get wished back to existence inside U7, and all this is is an excuse to reinvent Dragonball GT by having Goku travel space into some actually decent planets with strong people in it.

Unsure at the moment how it will end but got to be more to the universe erasure than has been said so far and got to be a more sinister undercurrent. Though Jiren is currently the 'enemy', quite a lot of fans have liked his character and seems as if it was intended that he come across this way and although fans are willing Goku & Vegeta to defeat him they want to see him continue in the series. I would like to know more about his character and his backstory but with him being almost too powerful I don't know how they could keep him involved after this arc. Finding a proper villain that is stronger than him etc to give us a reason to see him again seems ludicrous unless there is a significant time jump when this arc ends to it returning in 2019 (rumoured).

Well, from what characterization Jiren got in the manga, he refused to participate in the tournament because he didn't want to be responsible for erasing other people's universes as a consequence. He didn't even care about his own universe being erased, he simply refused, and only got in when he was told about the wish-granting. That explains his lack of participation thus far; too much blood on his hands if he went around knocking everyone out. He also believes in "purity" or "righteousness". He's like a Superman-figure.

Common consensus is that he's way stronger than Toppo, but since Toppo is a GoD candidate and not Jiren, Jiren must have refused. Add to that the remark about the "path that [Toppo] chose to take", means Jiren wants something that GoD status can't give him or could possibly corrupt. Who Jiren is and what GoD is are mutually exclusive and incompatible. He most likely is one that holds to his principles, unlike Toppo who clearly said that "Justice was worthless" and that decision opened him up to using his GoD power.

So basically: Jiren doesn't like destroying innocent people. We still don't know what his wish is, but it was enough to make him do the bare minimum-- participate in the tournament, even though his elimination count is just Hit, halfway through the tournament (24 mins into it). I can't remember who else he eliminated.

He's also extremely powerful, so I don't consider it likely that U7 will actually win against U11 in terms of power but numbers of opponents left in the match, unless Goku's improvement with Ultra Instinct is so vast in the last four or five minutes that he, uh... yeah, I don't see it. At best he might actually tie with Jiren without overcoming him, but I feel like expecting Goku to pull a win with UI would be missing a significant side-effect of UI, which is more something I mentioned up top: it'll impress Zen-Oh. It's flashy, it's powerful, it requires Goku to be active to use its full extent. Jiren can just glare stuff away, which is also powerful, but it's also pretty boring for a spectator when it means Jiren will just go back to meditating. Zen-Oh prioritizes activity: they didn't mimic Jiren sitting with his legs crossed, one of them mimicked him when he defeated Vegeta and went "Warrior. Sleep." because it involved him actually doing/saying something badass.

So if U7 does win, that's good, but even if they don't, Zen-Oh would probably think twice about erasing U7 on the sole fact that Goku's been a big source of his entertainment. Goku and Jiren being alive means more fun and more chances for Jiren to do/say something cool after acknowledging a worthy opponent.

I'd personally prefer Goku and Vegeta not overcoming Jiren on brute strength. It would give them something to work toward, as Jiren's "glare a Final Flash away" powers are ridiculous. And even then I don't consider them individually to have gotten on Beerus's 100% level, much less on Whis's level, much less on the Grand Priest's level, much less on Zen-Oh's level. They have a really long way to go in order to become "the strongest".
 
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Morgan

Well-known Member
Premium
Xen-Ace 2021
vegeta_full_power_vs_toppo_by_maniaxoi-dc1xk7s.jpg

Vegeta full power Vs Toppo by Maniaxoi

Some awesome fanart to commemorate this episode!

Highest points:
Vegeta's hair-- er, I mean, flashbacks to his family when up against a figurative corner.
The framing of Toppo as a villainous-type character, in terms of, well, his character. A God of Destruction is meant to be above notions of good and evil and so he'd be neutral on a technical moral alignment chart as a GoD. However, as a person, someone who comes up against legitimate adversity and whose solution against it is to throw away an intrinsic part of themselves, abandon their friends, all the good they've done, and everything they've ever fought for, someone who does a 180 in their personality to attain more power, someone who laughs at the concept of promises made and held between people, and yet still achieves nothing, is pathetic. Doing all that is a coward's move and a symptom of unrealistic expectations. This is amusingly the least subtle moral of the episode, if this episode were to have a moral at all.
EpicLegendX's comment on Reddit, "The Lorax stopped fighting for the trees, and got his ass whooped by a screaming vegetable."
Vegeta's character development is, I feel, complete. He understands that he doesn’t have to cast aside his goodness nor his family to become more powerful, and that holding onto these things doesn't mean tossing out his pride. And he doesn't need to die over it either! I'd say that was the point of the flashback to the Self-Destruct. I mean, aside from making my jaw drop and my eyes get teary because I actually thought he was gonna "throw [his] life away" like Goku said in the last NEP. Also, he learns the value in murking an opponent when he can instead of dicking around in an out-and-out fist fight/ki battle (as opposed to Goku's and Gohan's missteps throughout Z, see: Perfect Cell and Fat Buu). Anyway, jeez. Vegeta's been through one hell of a journey from the beginning of Z up until now. It's hard not to appreciate that.
On that note, more characterization from Jiren. He very much doesn't believe in sacrificing his principles to become strong, and doesn't tolerate that level of b.s. even with his own boss. This combined with the look he gave Toppo when Toppo first went GoD (he didn't exactly praise Toppo for it) further says that being GoD is something he straight-up disapproves of, and from Belmod's (in the manga) and Beerus's (in the BoG movie) example, being GoD confers great power, luxury, and forcible respect (read: fear) from pretty much everything in the universe that should know what's good for it. Jiren might actually be closer to heroic than any of the other hero characters so far. More justice-driven than Toppo, more pacifistic than Gohan, but stronger and more adherent to self-improvement by one's own means than Goku or Vegeta by far.

Lowest point:
We all know Frieza wasn't knocked out of the stage yet. Stop trying to play us, Toei.
 

Morgan

Well-known Member
Premium
Xen-Ace 2021
fM4nwux.jpg


ANDROID 17 IS MVP FROM CRADLE TO GRAVE

Honestly other than that I don't know what to say about this episode. I'll type as I go. High points:
- Android 17. In general. Like I said, he's been the true MVP throughout this entire tournament and put in work for the team, running interference on opponents when necessary, helping 18 and Gohan and Goku and Vegeta and Frieza and ... you get what I mean. Sad to see him go, but he went out in the best way. From being built to destroy Goku and the world as part of Dr. Gero's revenge, to saving Goku and potentially the whole universe. That's progression.
- Frieza's the Mr. Satan to Jiren's Perfect Cell.
- Jiren of the Sharingan is both Batman and Superman, and he ran into Belmod ( Joker ) in his quest for justice. ( I'm waiting for the plot twist where Belmod is responsible for what happened to him, but that's just me. ) Jiren also told Belmod to stay in his place ( not with those exact words, but that's what he meant ). Is there anything he can't do!? Except apparently block a ki blast point blank by an undetectable fighter, when it was previously said that Jiren has no openings/blind spots.

Low points:
- Didn't the Androids get the bombs wished out of them?
- The entire episode was one minute, so how fast was Belmod talking in order to tell everyone about Jiren's past?
- Old Kai should've kept his mouth shut.
- Krillin what are you doing go sit next to 18!!!!!!!!!!!
- Animation error: Arack and one other GoD ( along with their Supreme Kais ) is seen sitting in the stands when it should be just Belmod, Beerus, their Supreme Kais, and the remaining Angels with them.

Neutral points:
- Jiren's teacher wore the vertical cloth and the round-the-waist sash of the Angels, with only one circle on it. Significant?
- No one can sense 17 via his not having that type of Ki, whereas the energy he uses to fire beams comes from somewhere else ( his augmentations from Dr. Gero ). He wasn't shown being eliminated by Zeno, and even the Grand Priest said to assume 17 was eliminated/dead. And he just figured out that Jiren is vulnerable to surprise attacks which sadly wasn't implemented by anyone else henceforth ( they all tried beaming Jiren from blockable distances ). No body, nobody died. #denial
- Confirmed: Belmod knows enough about Jiren's past to speak of it, which would take more involvement into the lives of mortals than GoDs usually/are required to show, which is none; Jiren doesn't trust people anymore, so it's doubtful he would have actively told others about his past; Jiren has also disrespected Belmod directly on two occasions and does not refer to him with honorifics; becoming GoD involves severing mortal ties; Jiren disapproved of Toppo doing the latter because he has no love for the former. Theory: Belmod is responsible for Jiren's past in an effort to make him strong and lonely enough to become GoD, but instead Jiren overshot and has become the mortal that even a GoD can't beat, gaining notoriety for Universe 11 on that trait alone. As Jiren can outpower Belmod, Belmod had to go to the second most powerful, Toppo, and make him the candidate.
 
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