darkslayer13
Enma Katana no Kami
interesting, but how would Vergil have ended up in the Chimera Seed?
and i heard somewhere that the demon that attacked Nero was an Assault
new theories about Nero
- Thread starter darkslayer13
- Start date
interesting, but how would Vergil have ended up in the Chimera Seed?
and i heard somewhere that the demon that attacked Nero was an Assault
Darkstar Darin
The Badass In Black
Maybe it was the Assault-type?
darkslayer13
Enma Katana no Kami
Vergil possessing an Assault wouldn't make any less sense that him possessing a Chimera. and no matter what it was there would still need to be an explanation for how Vergil got in it.
my theory for how Vergil's soul ended up in the Assault is that it came in contact with a piece of Nelo's armor that contained Vergil's soul and then Vergil was able to possess the Assault long enough to force it to attack Nero so Vergil's soul could move into Nero's Arm.
and that leaves only two questions.
1. how did Nelo's armor (and Yamato) end up in Fortuna.
2. what does Vergil plan to do now.
my theory for how Vergil's soul ended up in the Assault is that it came in contact with a piece of Nelo's armor that contained Vergil's soul and then Vergil was able to possess the Assault long enough to force it to attack Nero so Vergil's soul could move into Nero's Arm.
and that leaves only two questions.
1. how did Nelo's armor (and Yamato) end up in Fortuna.
2. what does Vergil plan to do now.
Actually, the demon that attacked Nero is unknown as it was never specified in the game's manual, which contains the report of the event, though the DMC4 novel stated it was an Assault but the novel's not canon.
Now to your answer question, it doesn't matter how Vergil's soul ended up in a Chimera Seed because you can assume that the same method other Devils take to possess a Seed, his soul must've ended up using as well. But to point out something, you must keep in mind the nature of Nelo Angelo's armor. In DMC4, The Blanco Angelos were pieces of demon- possessed armor with a piece of Nelo Angelo's armor being the bond between the armor and the demon's soul. This is a referrence to the fact that Nelo Angelo's body is nothing more than a corpse that was meant to holster a soul. With that said, Vergil's soul escaped from the corpse, so it no longer had any soul within it. Same goes for its pieces. That's why none of the Angelos look like Vergil or Nelo Angelo (outside of being armored), there's no part of Vergil within them. With that said, the pieces of Nelo Angelo's armor have little, if any, effect on whoever touches them or becomes bonded with them.
As for the other questions:
1. The Order must have found his pieces and Yamato in Mallet Island during a mission. They are Devil Hunters after all, so of course they had to end up there at some point considering what happened.
2. We don't know, it's hard to tell whether he still has a will of his own or he's completely in control of Nero. Though it can be assumed that, because of Nero's story, Vergil had willingly gave up control of his soul to Nero in exchange for Nero gradually giving him power (or at least that was, seemingly, his plan).
Darkstar Darin
The Badass In Black
Rather, the "Devil" sold his soul to Nero.
Darkstar Darin
The Badass In Black
Ohhh...wow
darkslayer13
Enma Katana no Kami
1.if the DMC4 novel is the only place that says that it was an assault then i guess we can ignore that part since this thread is focused on a different theory than the one the novel supports
2.when has anything anywhere said that Demons regularly possess Chimera Seeds. the Chimera Seeds are Echidna's children not normal seeds possessed by demons.
3. we don't know where Vergil's soul is. at no point in any of the games has anything been said about what happened to Vergil after DMC1. the idea of his soul remaining in one of the pieces of Nelo's armor makes sense, does not contradict any canon information and fit's my theory about how Vergil's soul would end up in Nero.
4. the Bianco Angelo's don't look like Vergil because the armor they possess is the normal armor used by the Order which has probably looked exactly the same since long before Vergil was born.
ROCKMAN X
Keyser Söze
nah he is devil's son he doesn't need to sell his soul he just got his arm and super human abilites from the blood of "Sparda" which is the most annoying part in the whole DMC story that he has to be either a son of sparda which is impossible for that his mother has to be someone who can live long like sparda or he's vergil's son which is also impossible only thing which they can fit nero in is by making him a "Descendant of sparda who was born in a test-tube"
1. Of course.
2. Check her boss file: "Echidna: Master of a forest home to many demonic mysteries, Echidna scatters its seeds to act as hosts for further demons."
3. If we don't know where Vergil's soul is then why is it in Nero's arm?
4. Hmmm.... Nero's arm contains Vergil's soul => Devil Trigger share similarities with Nelo Angelo and Vergil. Bianco Angelos with pieces of Nelo Angelo's armor => No sign of Vergil's soul in them... at all.
darkslayer13
Enma Katana no Kami
2.okay than I guess the vergil was in a chimera seed idea does make sense
3.vergil's soul in nero's arm is a theory. there is no canon information about what happened to vergil's soul after dmc1
4.my theory is that vergil's soul stayed in one piece of the armor not all of them.
2. Glad you see my point.
3.
4. But if his soul is in one piece of armor then it has to be in the others, otherwise you're going to have to explain how his soul was just stuck in one.
darkslayer13
Enma Katana no Kami
We don't really know how demonic armor designed to imprison and control a soul would work so there is no way to know what would happen if you break it with a soul inside, but if you really think I need to explain than I guess that I will have to think of something:
Maybe Vergil's soul was only stored in one part of the armor. It would make sense for living armor to have some form of core to hold the soul. It would be odd if it didn't have something like that.
Seemingly, it was some kind of corpse, but either way that's pretty good explanation. Nice theory.
DragonMaster2010
Don't Let the Fall of America be Your Fall
You know what I hope isn't Capcom's final solution to Nero's origin:
=
Nero ending up being the reincarnation of Sparda.
But there's no wat Cpacom would do fans like that...right?:ermm:
But there's no wat Cpacom would do fans like that...right?:ermm:
Darkstar Darin
The Badass In Black
as a fan: no. HELL no. pics r awesome tho ^_^You know what I hope isn't Capcom's final solution to Nero's origin:
=Nero ending up being the reincarnation of Sparda.
But there's no wat Cpacom would do fans like that...right?:ermm:
DarkSlayerZero
DMC1 Dante>>>>>>2-4
I was listening to "Yamato Awakens" and it got me thinking,
That maybe the Devil Bringer and Yamato are halves of Vergil's Soul and Yamato only awakened and fixed not because of Nero but because it(Vergils soul) wanted to reunite with the other half so Vergil briefly possessed Nero tin order to complete himself .
That maybe the Devil Bringer and Yamato are halves of Vergil's Soul and Yamato only awakened and fixed not because of Nero but because it(Vergils soul) wanted to reunite with the other half so Vergil briefly possessed Nero tin order to complete himself .
Cranberry
Maker of cookies
I know this thread is old but I have seriously been wanting to get this theory out there for awhile, so I'm gonna take a shot and hope someone reads this. My boyfriend and I are super fans of this game and together we came up with a solution that could work as Vergil being Nero's father. Remember, we know little to nothing of Vergil's past and Dante's for that matter. I know it is a lot to post at once but I really, really think it makes sense. I have checked and re-checked all of my facts, I own all of the games, animes, mangas (except Deadly Fortune and we all know why but I have seen tidbits of it and from it.) That being said, I did create a backstory for Vergil since one essentially does not exist, but I used what material we do have to match up a timeline, I also made sure to reference Dante's Inferno by Dante Alighieri since names were taken from that book and given to the characters we know and love (i.e Vergil, Dante). So now that I have said all that, I'm gonna start my theory (and outline for a fanfiction that I will one day type.)
First, I'm going to start with a timeline and ages of Vergil through each event so it will match up with Nero's age, then explain the characters:
Vergil: 17-18 meets Camilla, has Nero
-Camilla dies, Vergil flees
Vergil: 25-27 the events of DMC 3
-after being defeated by Mundus, Vergil is transformed by Mundus into Nelo Angelo
Vergil: 35 the events of DMC 4
- After the defeat of Mundus, Vergil is no longer trapped as Nelo Angelo but is severely injured from his fight with Dante
Vergil: 37 ‘DMC 5’
-Vergil returns more powerful and more hateful than ever and endeavors to destroy the world
and anyone who gets in his way
So now, the long theory...sorry again it is so long, but really, it makes sense. Note that the beginning is a little shaky, I just changed it not even two days ago, you'll be able to tell when it gets more solid and those parts I have been working on since DMC 4 was released:
For anyone saying "Vergil can't do that, it's not in his character." I'm calling BS; because we don't know Vergil's background.My theory (and fanfic) starts out that Eva tried to hide the boys separately so as to make finding them both more difficult because everything Sparda created comes in pairs. His swords for Dante and Vergil, his amulets, and his boys. They are powerful alone, but together they are unstoppable and if Mundus had a hold of both of the boys in their youth, sheer chaos and destruction would ensue. Sad but cruel truth is, I think she knew with Sparda being gone, and her death most likely to follow, she knew that hiding them together was not possible. After Eva was killed, Vergil disappeared. We know this from the manga. My theory is that Vergil went after the demons that killed his mother, that is why Dante was all alone when he comes out of hiding and why he believes Vergil is gone too and Vergil believes that the demons took Dante because he can't find his brother. Meanwhile, Vergil is chasing after the demons and he is ambushed. Being only 8 at the time, he wouldn't stand a chance but (this is where it gets a little shaky...) he is rescued by very skilled swordsman and demon hunter. The devil hunter, is silent, stoic, and powerful. He reminds Vergil of his father. Vergil begs him to help him find his brother, the swordsman agrees. Vergil is broken-hearted to find that his brother is gone. The swordsman offers to take him to an orphanage but Vergil refuses, stating that he can defend himself, his Yamato clutched in his hand and covered in mud. The swordsman doubts him and again says that he has to take Vergil to an orphanage, instead Vergil wagers that if he can prove his worth to the swordsman, using the little training Sparda gave him before he disappeared, that the swordsman must take him on as a pupil and teach him to fight so he can find his brother. Doubtful still, the swordsman agrees and provides him shelter for the night, the next morning, Vergil shows the swordsman some of the skills his father taught him. The swordsman is impressed and agrees to take Vergil on as a pupil.
As time passes, Vergil becomes an excellent student under the strict training of his master. The swordsman even believes that Vergil may have very well exceeded his abilities. By this time, Vergil is about 17. Vergil feels he is ready to move on in his life, believing his brother is still alive, as master and student prepare to part ways, demons suddenly pour into the human world through a hellgate. The swordsman and Vergil set out to stop the demons, a great battle ensues when Vergil is pulled in through the gate by a horde of demons and his master chases after them. They don't make it very far into the demon world, but the demons impale Vergil on a headstone with multiple swords (I used the scene in the manga of DMC 3 where Vergil has what seems like a flashback to a younger version of himself impaled on a tombstone.) The demons mock him for protecting humans, stating that humans are worse than demons because they lie and tarnish anything that is pure, where demons covet purity and do not lie about their intentions, they do not lie about what they are (I paraphrased this from the manga.) The swordsman catches up to them in time, but being a human, the demon world is destroying his body. He quickly frees Vergil and reveals that he has known all along he was the son of Sparda and apologies to Vergil for not arriving in time to save his mother as she had asked him to protect her. He pushes Vergil out of the hellgate and tells him to head to Fortuna, that the demons are trying to escape through another hellgate there. The gate closes, trapping the swordsman in the demon world. Determined to fullfil his master's final wish, he goes to Fortuna to protect the people there.
(I know that part is a little shaky still but it gets more solid now.)
Upon Vergil's arrival to Fortuna, being the man of few words he is, he popped in on Sanctus, said a few things, then disappeared (this is mentioned in the DMC 4 manga.) So I think after his little visit to Sanctus, I think Vergil tried to blend in, keeping an eye on the hellgate.
He was on Fortuna for a few months and at the fountain outside of the church of Sparda when boom, he meets his lady for the first time. She questions him, seeing as Fortuna is a small island, she would know everyone, but Vergil. I think she tried to make him feel comfortable but Vergil, being the awkward turtle that he is, was well awkward. I have named his lady Camilla since Devil May Cry has allusions to Dante's Inferno, so I will now refer to his lady as Camilla (the Virgil in Dante's Inferno spoke quite often of a virgin warrior named Camilla so I think it makes sense.) I think Camilla tried to introduce him to life on Fortuna and like Nero, I think that the whole worshiping Sparda thing was humorous to him (seeing as Sparda was his father) but he kept that to himself and played along. I would see Camilla as a songstress type person, like Kyrie, who was very close the church and I think nasty Sanctus was keeping an eye on Camilla and her new found friend from afar, realiing that her new buddy is the man who popped into his room and I think he, being the demon obsessed weirdo he is, is starting to make connections between this stranger and Sparda. I also think that ill nasty Sanctus lusted after Camilla but could not act upon his intentions, lest he reveal his true self to the people of Fortuna.
Now I think Camilla was a very caring, kind-hearted, well known woman on Fortuna. I think everyone looked up to her for her charity and acceptance of everyone. That's why Vergil (and Sanctus) fell in love with her, because of how sweet and innocent she was. I think Vergil knew that if Camilla ever found out about his past, she would not judge him.
Anyway, I think that one day, some demons popped up and started attacking the people of Fortuna. Vergil, being the hero that he secretly is, saved the people from the demons. Everyone is praising him and that's when I think that wrinkly prune Sanctus appears and calls upon Vergil and asks him to protect the people of Fortuna from a growing demon problem. He asks Vergil to train soldiers, as he can clearly see that Vergil is a warrior. He makes Vergil Captain of the Order of the Holy Knights. He trained the soldiers how to fight demons, using the training that his father and his mentor gave him. I think Sanctus tried manipulating Vergil into believing he was a good guy, who whole heartedly wanted nothing but good for Fortuna but I think Vergil was always a little creeped out, but he did as Sanctus asked so he could prove to himself that he was more than a half-demon but a human like those who surrounded him and looked up to him, with nothing but good intentions. I think everyone began to honor Vergil, look up to him as the new Savior of Fortuna. And I think he and Camilla intended to marry and he reveals to her his true identity and being the kind person she is, she believes him and accepts him (this where they bang and make Nero.) Welp, I think while all this is going on, Sanctus is having Agnus look more into Vergil's past and Sparda when bam, he makes the connection and reveals this to Sanctus. Now Sanctus has Vergil in check. He knows his identity, and plans to use this to his advantage in more ways than one.
I think Sanctus's plan is to use Vergil for his "angel" research, and use not only his demonic lineage as blackmail, lying to the people and telling them that even if Vergil tells them he is the son of Sparda, that because he is a stranger and Sanctus is the pope, ringleader, what have you, he will tell them that Vergil is nothing but a lying demon and demand he is killed, and since he is aware of Vergil and Camilla's relationship, he will also use Camilla as leverage.
So I think Sanctus will sabotage Vergil, have Agnus summon some demons, powerful ones, and they will kill some of Vergil's knights and make it seem like he is the one who sent the demons to kill his own men but make it obvious enough to Vergil that Sanctus is behind it. I think Vergil will go looking for Sanctus, just like Sanctus wants him to, to reveal to Sanctus his hidden power to put to rest any doubt that Vergil may not be the son of Sparda. Vergil goes to attack Sanctus but he uses Camilla as a hostage to get Vergil to back down. Sanctus reveals to Vergil that he knows who he is and that he also has a tidbit that Vergil doesn't know. Sanctus will reveal to Vergil that Camilla is pregnant, something she had been waiting for the right time to tell him and threatens to harm her if Vergil does not cooperate (though this is only a bluff, any descendant of Sparda is useful and if Vergil doesn't work, his child would.) Vergil, defeated, complies, and is subjected to painful testing. While this is going on, Sanctus decides to tell the people that Vergil is an evil demon anyways and Camilla is a concubine who was manipulated by the evil Vergil to lure demons to attack Fortuna. Ensuring that the people would come to hate them and would not believe them if they ever tried to tell the truth about Sanctus and Sanctus will attempt to cover everything up, like taking Camilla and Vergil's names from any records in Fortuna, so it would seem as if they never existed.
While Vergil is being tortured for Agnus's research, Camilla is locked away. All this time, Vergil grows to despise humans. Coming to accept what the demons in the hellgate all those years ago said as truth: that all humans lie, deceive, and manipulate to get what they want and don't care who they hurt but come off as innocent, helpless, weak creatures and will believe anything they are told like weak-minded sheep; where as demons are honest with what they are and don't try to hide it. He now hates all humans for what they have done to him, Camilla, and their unborn child, forgetting any sentiments he may have had for humans.
Meanwhile something is wrong with Camilla, she is distraught, blaming herself for what has happened but her poor little body can't handle the power that her unborn child holds and it is wearing her out. !!!Caution: it gets sad now...!!!
Nero is born, but the delivery of the powerful child takes it's toll on Camilla. She loses too much blood. in her final moments with her son, cradling him in her arms, she makes a wish that father and son are united and she hopes her son will teach his father to have hope and forgive the people who hurt them and they live in peace. Then she passes.
Sanctus sees this unfortunate event as an opportunity to weaken Vergil's spirits further. He sends someone to lie to Vergil and tell him that Camilla was tried and found guilty of treason and executed and the boy she gave birth to was an abomination and put to rest out of mercy. So it will make Vergil hopeless, depressed, like he has nothing to live for so he may as well do what Sanctus asks, even if that means Vergil must die. Well this plan goes wrong. Vergil is heartbroken and violently angered that they would turn on Camilla, believing lies that Sanctus fed them and even more enraged that they killed his son. He is so angry and sad that all these emotions cause him to activate his Devil Trigger and he busts out of the prison they are holding him in. The transformation is so violent, it sets everything near him on fire. The whole city is shaken by Vergil's Devil Trigger and they all come out to witness Vergil's prison break. Vergil, with Camilla in his arms, is hovering above Fortuna and promises to have his revenge upon humanity for what they have done to him. Meanwhile, I think one loyal friend of Camilla's, who believes she and Vergil are innocent but cannot speak out lest she be tried for treason, whisks Nero away while everyone is distracted by Vergil. Feeling guilty for not speaking up sooner, she decides to raise the boy to make up for that, but Sanctus comes hunting for her so she leaves him to Credo and Kyrie's family. Credo's father was a loyal soldier to Vergil and their mother was close to Camilla. They recognize him as Vergil's son but lie to him and everyone around him about his heritage so Sanctus will always be suspicious but so long as he is under the care of upright, devote Sparda worshipers, he will never act upon his suspicions, until they pass before the events of DMC 4. But by then, Sanctus finds out Dante is alive and intends to lure Dante to Fortuna as a better subject for his plans for the Savior.
After these events, this is why Vergil hates weakness and craves power, because he was too weak and naive to save Camilla and his son. This is why he scoffs at Arkham when he cannot kill Lady. I don't believe it is because he honestly wanted Lady dead, in fact Vergil did not ever ask Arkham to kill Lady, Arkham decided to do that on his own; Vergil is silent the whole time. He knew that Arkham was a mad man and didn't love his daughter and mocked him for some sudden fake fatherly love act. This would anger him because Vergil lost his opportunity to be a father and is disgusted by anyone who would not even be a father but also put on the air that they suddenly had the desire to be one and to make it even worse, Arkham killed the woman he loved so he could become a demon and that is why he kills Arkham because he is disgusted by this (or at least he thinks he kills Arkham.) So all the following events with Vergil are trying and failing to purge the world of humans, and his failure is making him more angry. After his fight with Dante as Nelo Angelo, his soul is returned to the Demon World, and he is there waiting, recovering, becoming even more angry, and even more powerful until he is recovered enough to return and Dante knows that if he doesn't stop him this time, it's over for everyone. No more hesitation because he is his brother, even if it means they both die.
I don't think Dante ever knew about Nero but I know that as soon as Dante saw Nero, he knew something was up and he wasn't his and to be honest, Sparda really serves no purpose in this storyline anymore, so I really do think Sparda is dead. Nor do I think Sparda would have cheated on Eva, now that is waaaay out of character. That being said, Dante also knew Nero wasn't his brother, seeing as Sparda would have been dead long before Nero was born, but he knew Nero had Sparda's blood in him somehow, and he probably took an educated guess that he was Vergil's son. He never told Nero but I think Nero would start to question Dante, trying to figure out why everyone knew more about him than he did. Maybe he found some lost letters between Kyrie's parents and the woman who rescued him, revealing Vergil and Camilla to be his parents. When Nero asked Dante if Vergil was his father the conversation would go something like:
“To be honest, I didn’t know for sure, but I took a pretty educated guess because I know for sure you’re not mine or my Pop’s, he died long before you were born. The second I fought you, I recognized it, your power, but I never had proof. I tried to prod you, see if you could confirm my guess. That’s why I said that the Yamato had to stay in the family. I was hoping for an answer like “well I am family.” And when you didn’t say that, I assumed you didn’t know yourself and I wasn’t prepared to carry the burden of being the one who told you who your father was. Do you really think you would have believed me if I said “hey, I’m your uncle, your father is my brother. Sorry, I don’t know why he ditched you.” I figured whatever answers you needed, you would find them in your own time.”
“So that is what you meant then, when you said you suspected I carried something different from those demons. You suspected I carried the blood of Sparda in my veins.”
“Yeah I can see it in you, alright. You have your father’s glare and the way you said you needed Yamato was like he was standing in front of me."
As for Nero's arm, I think it is just like Dante and Vergil's Devil Trigger. It was injured when he was protecting Kyrie from demons and since DT is activated by intense emotions, his fear and desire to save Kyrie triggered it. However, being only 1\4th demon, his human blood has diluted his abilities and I think it remains this way as a way to preserve his arm because it is possible that his arm was so injured that without it remaining in constant DT, he would lose it. So it's his body protecting itself.
So...that's my theory\fanfanction of Vergil's backstory. Sorry it is sooo long but I had a lot of information to fit in there so I could make sense of Vergil being Nero's father. I know it is a long shot, seeing as this thread is so old. but if anyone reads this, please give me some feedback. I need to know if this is acceptable to other DMC fans.
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Cranberry
Maker of cookies
Thank you, I really appreciate it. I'm so glad someone replied. Lol but yeah that first part my boyfriend and I seriously just came up with two days ago. He said my original theory didn't fit. My original theory was that Vergil was kidnapped by the demons that killed Eva but I could never figure or decide where they would have taken him from there. So I do like our new theory\fanfic, I just have to work on it some more. But again, thank you!