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DmC: Devil May Cry vs. Devil May Cry... (keep it civil, or else).

Classic Dante v. Rebooted Dante (The Old and the New)


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This is another argument I tend to find from defenders and certain reviewers/columnists who praise this game. They always assume that anyone making valid criticisms about the game are "haters" who've "never played the game."

Right, DmC sold less than DMC1, 2, 3, 4, and only sold 500k units more than the HD remake entirely because everyone one of the core/majority fans didn't actually play the game.

Cmon' now man, fix your vibe.
Do you see the word 'hater' anywhere in the post you quoted? No. It's a legitimate question. All you have to do is answer yes or no.

And stop going on about core fans. I've played DMC since I was a kid, but I had fun with DmC so don't fling your rubbish about not being a 'core fan' at people on here.
You're making 'core fans' sound like anonymous. Some kind of secret group with a special membership.
If the 'core fans' were really so bothered, don't you think they'd be on here too, trying to converts us away from the evil of DmC?

In fact, what is a core fan to you? Someone who only plays DMC1 to 4, someone who knows the whole scrips off by heart, someone who has SSS ranked every mission on every difficulty, someone who cosplays, someone who mods the game, someone who likes to play on turbo mode, or someone who has totally mastered the move sets jump cancelling and buffering?
 
I like how you avoided the question.

But seriously, chill. You come across as hostile and the mods don't play that around here.
No, let's just stick with that. I clearly didn't play the game, there's no possible way I could genuinely not like this game compared to the previous games, based on having experienced it for myself. I'm just another one of those "haters" who doesn't know what he's talking about.

So because of "haters" like myself who've "lol never played the game," talking mess about a game that we've "lol never played," all the core/majority fans of DMC decided to not pick this game up, without even forming their own opinion based on the facts.

This kind of mindset is yet another reason the core/majority fans didn't go along with this game.
 
No, let's just stick with that. I clearly didn't play the game, there's no possible way I could genuinely not like this game compared to the previous games, based on having experienced it for myself. I'm just another one of those "haters" who doesn't know what he's talking about.

So because of "haters" like myself who've "lol never played the game," talking mess about a game that we've "lol never played," all the core/majority fans of DMC decided to not pick this game up, without even forming their own opinion based on the facts.

This kind of mindset is yet another reason the core/majority fans didn't go along with this game.
No one here has called you hater.

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I seriosuly think we are being trolled now. It's the same thing over and over while avoiding questions.
 
No, let's just stick with that. I clearly didn't play the game, there's no possible way I could genuinely not like this game compared to the previous games, based on having experienced it for myself. I'm just another one of those "haters" who doesn't know what he's talking about.

So because of "haters" like myself who've "lol never played the game," talking mess about a game that we've "lol never played," all the core/majority fans of DMC decided to not pick this game up, without even forming their own opinion based on the facts.

This kind of mindset is yet another reason the core/majority fans didn't go along with this game.

I never said you didn't play it, I pointed out that

1. You avoided the question

2. You came across as hostile in many of your posts

3. The mods here really crack down on people who act like that.

So, let me ask a brief, but loaded question.

Seeing as this part of the site is cut off from the main series, and you obviously and so vehemently dislike it, why are you in the DmC section instead of the main series section?
 
No, let's just stick with that. I clearly didn't play the game, there's no possible way I could genuinely not like this game compared to the previous games, based on having experienced it for myself. I'm just another one of those "haters" who doesn't know what he's talking about.

So because of "haters" like myself who've "lol never played the game," talking mess about a game that we've "lol never played," all the core/majority fans of DMC decided to not pick this game up, without even forming their own opinion based on the facts.

This kind of mindset is yet another reason the core/majority fans didn't go along with this game.


If you've truly never played DmC, then...this is your credibility...
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You might as well answer truthfully. Not hypothetically, no metaphorically, just a simple "Yes" or "No."

So, the million dollar question: did you play DmC...?
 
No, I didn't play the game at all for myself. Nope. I went straight to youtube, watched a few videos, and literally pulled every last thing I just said out of my ass. That's exactly what happened. Every last logical, reasonable argument that I've managed to get you all to respond to was just a bunch of nothing.

And yet somehow, someway, the experience-free opinion that I've shared with the core/majority of fans managed to cause them enough grief, without any of them playing the game for themselves even, to spread like wildfire and make the game sell less than previous versions.

You guys found me out, might as well just delete my posts and call it a day.
 
No, I didn't play the game at all for myself. Nope. I went straight to youtube, watched a few videos, and literally pulled every last thing I just said out of my ass. That's exactly what happened. Every last logical, reasonable argument that I've managed to get you all to respond to was just a bunch of nothing.

And yet somehow, someway, the experience-free opinion that I've shared with the core/majority of fans managed to cause them enough grief, without any of them playing the game for themselves even, to spread like wildfire and make the game sell less than previous versions.

You guys found me out, might as well just delete my posts and call it a day.

Wow, sarcasm. How original.

It's almost like you're going out of your way to **** people off. Seriously, just chill out.
 
These things were around just the same for the past games, especially DMC4. Didn't stop them from selling well. And finally, if a fanbase truly believes in something they'll support it. Hence the reason they are fans in the first place. So DmC not selling well is entirely because it wasn't the game the majority of us wanted. Simple as that.

And if person were to try and claim that fans got tired of DMC after 4 (which sold over 2 million units), then they'd have to explain why the HD remake managed to sell well. The majority of us fans just don't appreciate Capcom rebooting the series, and giving it to NT of all people-who don't have a record of amazing gameplay or story in their games.

So it was a truly foolish decision that's costing them, and will continue to cost them until they make it right.
As far as that's concerned you could also try looking at the economy difference. How willing are people to buy now compared to then? It's not just one factor of some fans being against the game. And supporting a franchise is entirely different from telling people, "This game is crap, don't buy it." Or, "If you like this game you don't know what a good game is." You've said in this thread that the people who like the reboot aren't actual fans of the original. Have any idea of what you sound like? Why not let people decide for themselves and leave them alone. Just because fans of the original are also fans of the reboot doesn't change the fact that they are core fans. It just means they had fun with all the games.

I do believe that Twox gave a reason for some of DMCHD's sales. DmC bringing in new fans to try the original series. And I'm sure DMC4 was also riding on some of the success of 3, just like 2 was with the first game. It doesn't mean much.

NT is just starting out. You almost sound like you expect a good company to have an immediate success instead of learning from each project which is what NT is doing. If I could I'd buy their previous games, just to see how far they've come.

And Capcom has made a lot of mistakes which are costing them. This is the least of them, I'm sure. The DMC fanbase isn't as big as the one for RE, and I doubt it ever will be.

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Sorry. Well said, puppeh EllDawn!




Ho now! Nobody likes aliens in their reboots, if the outrage from Michael Bay's Ninja Turtles is any indication.

Even though the context of aliens in the movie was totally misinterpreted >_<
lol. Puppeh EllDawn isn't going to be my new name, is it? I have more nicknames than I can remember. And thank you, by the way. I almost forgot.
 
That's fine, hey it's their money to lose. They can do whatever they want with DMC, I'll just avoid it along with the majority of DMC fans.

And this can be said about Square Enix, EA, Ubisoft, Activision, Nintendo, and pretty much any developer, studio, film maker, publisher, etc. in the world. Just replace "DMC" with something like "Mario", "Final Fantasy", "Battlefield", "Mirror's Edge", "Street Fighter", "Ninja Gaiden", or "Sonic".

Note: This post isn't personally directed at anyone.

Apart from financial issues, I think legal issues would be involved too. For one, Platinum Games isn't as wealthy as Capcom. Why do you think they went after an third-party to fund some of their games? Even though Capcom might have financial issues, they still have franchises selling. Monster Hunter is a popular franchise in Japan and I believe has a growing community overseas. Monster Hunter 4 is about to be released and will probably sell well. That said, they have games such as DmC, Resident Evil 6, and Dragon's Dogma currently on the market and even if they're not at their original MSRP prices, they're still selling and every penny counts. DLC also adds to the equation. Platinum Games only has 7 games currently on the market: Madworld, Infinite Space, Bayonetta, Vanquish, Anarchy Reigns, Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance, and The Wonderful 101. The last two are the most recent games and one was collaborated with Kojima Productions and Konami meaning some of the profits are probably split, and the other is restricted to one platform: the Wii U. The other games aside from Bayonetta are not well-known. That said, Bayonetta is still part of an unpopular genre. Had they been given digital releases, maybe more money could go to Platinum Games, but from local stores - as in not Amazon or Newegg - those games are kind of rare to see.

Legally, Capcom owns Okami, Devil May Cry, Megaman, Godhand, Street Fighter, etc. That means no one can make any of those games without Capcom's permission. Speaking of which, they haven't been focusing on many old and usually requested franchises. Megaman is one big example. Even though it's a beloved franchise, Capcom decided not to do anything with it. Nobody knows why when obviously people would pour money down Capcom's bank accounts. So, Mighty No. 9 was conceived as an answer to Megaman's fans. It's a spiritual successor by Keiji Inafune who was involved with the original Megaman's development team. He could not legally make a Megaman game without having to deal with legal protocols, instead he made a game similar to it. Judging by how well Mighty No. 9 is doing with its goals, yeah, people want another Megaman game. Likewise, Resident Evil's current track with Capcom has been iffy. The Evil Within, by Shinji Mikami, the creator of Resident Evil - ooo, a trend - seems to be a spiritual successor to Resident Evil. Personally, it seems to early to say that even if both games have "Evil" in their titles.

What does this have to do with DMC? Well, Hideki Kamiya was the creator of Devil May Cry, but he was not involved with Devil May Cry 2, 3, 4, and obviously not DmC: Devil May Cry. He, like Inafune, cannot legally make another DMC game. Actually he could make a "DMC" game. GOW, anyone? It's either God of War or Gears of War... How original. One's singular and the other's plural. Anyway, I digress. Kamiya can't make another Devil May Cry game, but he did "make" another Devil May Cry. It's called Bayonetta and the sequel comes out in 2014. Bayonetta is considered the spiritual sequel to Devil May Cry as Dark Souls is to Demon's Souls, and Mighty No. 9 is to Megaman. The only issue is that hack n' slash isn't a popular genre like the plague that is the shooter genre. To make it worse, Platinum Games isn't that well-known compared to Santa Monica or Capcom. For games of that caliber, or any games since the cost of game development is so high nowadays - a 2D game like Shantae: Half-Genie Hero needs $400,000 while Mighty No. 9 needs about $900,000 as a bare minimum, yes, 2D games - another Bayonetta needed serious funding. Platinum Games went with Nintendo, which is a risky deal. That means the game will be locked to one platform and a platform, though, only being on the market for one year, isn't selling or in demand like the anticipated, next-generation consoles.

Also, developers who leave usually don't have good relations with their former employers; rocky relations probably, but hopefully not "I want you dead" relations. Patrice Desilets, one of the original developers for Assassin's Creed, is arguing about his rights to 1666 with Ubisoft. Had he stayed, maybe 1666 could have been made after the 100th anniversary of Assassin's Creed. On the other hand, leaving and gaining the rights to 1666 would mean the game comes to light much sooner and under his full control. I think Hideki Kamiya had some issues with Capcom, Keiji Inafune was dissatisfied, and I don't know about Shinji Mikami. Nobuo Uematsu is probably respected by Square Enix, but that doesn't mean he'll be returning soon for a ton of games. He'll be here and there, but not always there. Same thing with Hironobu Sakaguchi, the man who made Lost Odyssey, Blue Dragon, The Last Story, Parasite Eve, The Bouncer, and a ton of other games.

I know lots of people, things, companies, etc. do stupid, terrible, and annoying things to consumers and usually they want them to suffer. Here's the thing: companies are made up of other human beings. Sure, you have your greed, narrow-mined, narrow-sighted, idiotic heads of companies, but you still have normal human beings employed there. Some of those employees love their jobs, just look at the paragraph above, those humans left to find a way to make videogames they and others will love. THQ and 38 Studios went bankrupt and were shut down. All the employees became unemployed. Fortunately, some of them like the former employees of Vigil Games were picked up by Crytek. I don't know about the employees from 38 Studios, but I hope they were picked up by some gaming studio. THQ was a large company, but not as large as Capcom (maybe), Nintendo, Sony, EA, Activision, etc. Imagine if one of those went down. Yes, the evil heads got what they deserved, but what about the other employees? Hell, some of the heads of gaming companies are awesome. Shigeru Miyamoto and Satoru Iwata from Nintendo come to mind as cool heads of gaming.

Fortunately, games come in many varieties. Capcom's not doing a good enough job with DMC and Resident Evil? Well, they have some neat games like Dragon's Dogma, Monster Hunter, and Street Fighter along with published games like Remember Me. Their past games are definitely good including collaborations like The Legend of Zelda: Oracles of Seasons & Ages, A Link to the Past (remake), Four Swords, and Minish Cap.
 
Kamiya did come back as a creative consultant on DMC3, but that was it. It's really been Itsuno's show for the longest time.
 
No, I didn't play the game at all for myself. Nope. I went straight to youtube, watched a few videos, and literally pulled every last thing I just said out of my ass. That's exactly what happened. Every last logical, reasonable argument that I've managed to get you all to respond to was just a bunch of nothing.

And yet somehow, someway, the experience-free opinion that I've shared with the core/majority of fans managed to cause them enough grief, without any of them playing the game for themselves even, to spread like wildfire and make the game sell less than previous versions.

You guys found me out, might as well just delete my posts and call it a day.
:lol: Okay, I have to know...but, are you a really good troll, because you're really working people up here.
Is this like the time where the guy pretented to be a pastor and wrote a huge post about how DMC made people into followers of the devil and how he was going to save us?:P

Wait...are you trying to save us from DmC and convert us back to the righteous path of classic DMC?:lol:

Wow...this is turning out to be a really funny night.
 
:lol: Okay, I have to know...but, are you a really good troll, because you're really working people up here.
Is this like the time where the guy pretented to be a pastor and wrote a huge post about how DMC made people into followers of the devil and how he was going to save us?:P

Wait...are you trying to save us from DmC and convert us back to the righteous path of classic DMC?:lol:

Wow...this is turning out to be a really funny night.

I know. It's proper snark bait.
 
No, I didn't play the game at all for myself. Nope. I went straight to youtube, watched a few videos, and literally pulled every last thing I just said out of my ass. That's exactly what happened. Every last logical, reasonable argument that I've managed to get you all to respond to was just a bunch of nothing.

And yet somehow, someway, the experience-free opinion that I've shared with the core/majority of fans managed to cause them enough grief, without any of them playing the game for themselves even, to spread like wildfire and make the game sell less than previous versions.

You guys found me out, might as well just delete my posts and call it a day.


Well then. If you've played the game. Give some valid criticisms of it that don't involve sales numbers. Because you're not making a compelling case for Us "None majority fans" to see your side of things.
 
I know. It's proper snark bait.
Meh, it's funny. Like a one man army...like the Black Knight from Monty Python getting his limbs hacked off until he is forced to fight with only the head.
Ohhh, maybe we are going to be headbutted into agreeing:troll:
 
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