Y'know what? I can't accept this.

[Chancey289]

I agree that there was things i and others in fanbase did that were not right.
But what we did not do is send death threats or sign up a petition for white house to cancel the game.

I highly doubt many did that, and by many i mean practically none.

Let us first agree to number of total dmc fans ok? Let's say 300K, even though i am positive it's much more.

There have been no attempts of killing Tameem. Infact NT have not shown the material they received. And without us having seen them, how can we conclude if they really received a death threat as serious as it can be?
There hasn't been mentioned a investigation of the material either. Because if someone sends a death threat to a developer, i sure as hell would expect game journalists to report on investigation of the threat.
Something along the lines of "TAmeem: We have contacted the police and the material is now in their hands".

Yes, i know people may have made "death threats" on a social media but that's questionable. First of all, writing a message with a alias on a social media is less serious than actually sending a death threat to a company' or person's adress. Who would be so dumb to post a serious death threat on a social media? They can be tracked...
Even if someone says "I'll kill you!" to Tameem, what makes you think they are serious? I saw a comment that was a reaction to Bayo 2 exclusivity that went along the lines of "I'll kill myself now".

Let's put these problems away, and believe that they received death threats. In that case how many? one, 5 or 10 threats? If they received 5 or 10 death threats, surely we would have heard of a investigation?
Ok, let's settle with two death threats.
Do you remember how many dmc fans we agreed to might be? 300K.
That means two of 300,000 fans sent death threats, while 299,998 fans did not send death threats.
So...when did dmc fanbase send death threats? Because what i possibly see is just few individuals sending death threats, so few in number that it doesn't even register on the radar of representing the dmc fans as a whole.

Let's move on to the dumb whitehouse petition. First of all, it was a futile petition because the game had nothing to do with US.
Second it seems the people who "signed" used aliases.
Here is what Escapist writer had to say about it:
Now, ignoring that the grammar of the request suggests it was typed by a 5th grader, let's all take a moment to appreciate the absurdity of the request. Is it a joke? I honestly can't tell. It's worded in such a way that the person who wrote it - one "R.J." from Franklin, Vermont - really seems to believe that the quality of the game is somehow a violation of human rights.
Plus i believe the amount of people who signed it was between 30-70 (i dont remember).
That number is again not even barely enuff to represent dmc fanbase.
Also, how can we even determine if all of the people who signed it was dmc fans? If there are people who are crazy (and stupid) to make white house petitions asking for a game to be stopped or send death threats, then we might as well believe that there could be dmc reboot fans that would do things to make dmc fans look bad.

I haven't seen death threats. Even if they have received death threats, i did not send one, and most of dmc fans did not either.
The petition is very stupid and again neither does the total number of people who i think signed it qualify to say dmc fans send death threats.
Because dmc fans is the majority not the minority.

Let's be honest, when people say "dmc fans sent death threats" they dont think of two or three individuals, but they think of the fanbase as a whole.
People generalize.

EDIT:
Tameem's statement about the threats is quite revealing:
“So I was half prepared for it, although I have to say that it has been pretty eye opening to see some of the creative ways in which people have chosen to vent their hatred. We didn’t expect death threats in comic book form or anti-DmC death metal songs!”

Do you see it? No? Let me highlight it:
“So I was half prepared for it, although I have to say that it has been pretty eye opening to see some of the creative ways in which people have chosen to vent their hatred. We didn’t expect death threats in comic book form or anti-DmC death metal songs!”

How can anti-Dmc death metal songs be death threats? It's not threatning Tameem nor Ninja theory's other employees but the death of a game they worked on.

Plus i have seen this song and it is a anti dmc metal song that mentions something must die:

With your arbitrary formulas and stupid logic and how you literally contribute nothing worthy to discussions......

 

[Chancey289]

I agree I love the older series way more and its always coma be that way I'm sure and its human nature to compare but I like the reboot a lot and have a lot of appreciation and respect for it and its fans one of which I am I prefer classic DMC and classic Dante but don't feel the need to hate on new Dante

We need more fans like you friend.

I grow really tired of not being able to enjoy both versions of Devil May Cry because the people who are all pro DMC are like, "you're either with us or against us."

 

[ef9dante_oSsshea]

just being honest

 

[IncarnatedDemon]

ef9 people don't hate on reboot guy because he is a different character.
For one Tameem made him, and people dislike Tameem.

But if we look past that Tameem made it, then we come to the fundamental issue:
Reboot lessens chance of Dante and DMC games to be made.
How long was it since a DMC game with Dante in it? 6 years. And DmC's creation contributed to that. And honestly if DmC sold 3M, i bet it would have been enough incentive for Capcom to put DMC on the shelves for a good while.

Why am i pointing this out to you EF? Because people don't "feel the need" to hate on DmC and it's character, there are reasons why they don't like it.

 

[ef9dante_oSsshea]

I just cant warm to reboot dante as a character dude not cause he is replacing the original or because im anti DmC I simply just don't like him he bugs me so does vergil but that's no reflection on the game gameplay or anything else DmC related as I like the game a lot its similar to gow for me like the game don't like kratos that much its nothing personal

 

[Chancey289]

I just cant warm to reboot dante as a character dude not cause he is replacing the original or because im anti DmC I simply just don't like him he bugs me so does vergil but that's no reflection on the game gameplay or anything else DmC related as I like the game a lot its similar to gow for me like the game don't like kratos that much its nothing personal

I enjoyed the first GoW game for PS2 but I'm totally with you on Kratos. He's really just a straight up asshole. I can understand his vendetta in the first game and wearing your family as permanent face paint is definitely something that would understandably p!ss you off but, afterwards going on just a murderous rampage because you're throwing a godlike hissy fit makes you just a flat out major a$4 who just needs some major chill pills. He doesn't even speak words. He's just ARGHGHHGGGHH.

 

[Demi-fiend]

I am not that ****ty either.

I beg to differ.

I dislike Tameem but i would never wish for his death.

I'm pretty sure you've wished it (in the back of your mind) at least once during this whole ordeal...

 

[TWOxACROSS]

...

The plot of the God of War series...

GoW1 - Kratos is angry at Ares tricking him into killing his own family, wants to kill the God of War
GoW2 - Kratos is angry at being stripped of his powers as the God of War and wants to kill the gods
GoW3 - Kratos is angry because he has no more gods to kill, goes back in time to kill them again

...series summation; Kratos is angry *sigh*

 

[Sunaka Marién]

Reboot lessens chance of Dante and DMC games to be made.
How long was it since a DMC game with Dante in it? 6 years. And DmC's creation contributed to that.

Actually, it's very questionable if we had seen any more DMC games with Dante in even if the reboot hadn't been made, since it seems they were actually planning on making Nero the new and only main character. I mean, that was already their initial plan with DMC4.

Also on a side note, much respect to el9 o shea and Rebel Dynasty for their attitude towards DmC and its fans <3

 

[IncarnatedDemon]

Actually, it's very questionable if we had seen any more DMC games with Dante in even if the reboot hadn't been made, since it seems they were actually planning on making Nero the new and only main character. I mean, that was already their initial plan with DMC4.

Also on a side note, much respect to el9 o shea and Rebel Dynasty for their attitude towards DmC and its fans <3

Your right, they did say that they did not know what to do if it wasn't for NT accepting their offer. That they might not have done a DMC5.
But how does that disprove what i said? That DmC might have replaced DMC if it had sold enough to please Capcom.

 

[Sunaka Marién]

Your right, they did say that they did not know what to do if it wasn't for NT accepting their offer. That they might not have done a DMC5.
But how does that disprove what i said? That DmC might have replaced DMC if it had sold enough to please Capcom.

Oh it doesn't disprove that Capcom might have dropped the original series if DmC had sold enough, and I wasn't trying to disprove that anyway (because honestly, who are we kidding? Why even make a reboot in the first place if you're just gonna go back to the original series afterwards even though the reboot sold well enough? That'd be kinda dumb, imo.).
What I wanted to say was that it's kinda illogical to say "I dislike the reboot because that way there won't be any new DMC games with Dante as a playable character" because Dante would have most likely not been playable in a potential DMC5 to begin with.

 

[IncarnatedDemon]

Glad to see you have a logical sense. Not that i am saying you did not have one, it's just that i see so few people agree to my speculation on Capcom attempting to replace original.
No, i don't think DmC would have any impact on the original other than it being put on a shelf for years.
5 years, 10 years...who knows.
And let's be honest, if DMC and DmC could coexist, then DMC 5 would have been made shortly after or during DmC development, or even now.
There are alot of reasons why i dislike reboot, and what we just agreed upon is one of them.

 

[ef9dante_oSsshea]

Actually, it's very questionable if we had seen any more DMC games with Dante in even if the reboot hadn't been made, since it seems they were actually planning on making Nero the new and only main character. I mean, that was already their initial plan with DMC4.

Also on a side note, much respect to el9 o shea and Rebel Dynasty for their attitude towards DmC and its fans <3

thankyou I appreciate that

 

[Rebel Dynasty]

Actually, it's very questionable if we had seen any more DMC games with Dante in even if the reboot hadn't been made, since it seems they were actually planning on making Nero the new and only main character. I mean, that was already their initial plan with DMC4.

True, I'd heard similarly that they originally intended to make Nero the next main protagonist in line. But, the final product for DMC4 suggests differently. They decided to still give Dante some time in the lime light-though admittedly a lot less in comparison to Nero, who got the majority of the missions. I think I would have been sad to see Dante never return if there were to be a DMC5, though the sort of "passing of the torch" feeling I get from Nero and Dante's final exchange would make it somewhat bearable.

For me, anyway. I'd still miss Dante. T_T

Also on a side note, much respect to el9 o shea and Rebel Dynasty for their attitude towards DmC and its fans <3

No worries.

 

[Caiden]

I like Nero but I don't think Dante should just get cut out of the picture. I think they should do another joint game but actually finish it this time. Give them both around 20 missions that are different. They can overlap a bit and share a few bosses but don't make us do the game again backwards.

I think expanding on Nere's gameplay can help the series but getting rid of Dante would defiantly not.

 

[TWOxACROSS]

True, I'd heard similarly that they originally intended to make Nero the next main protagonist in line. But, the final product for DMC4 suggests differently. They decided to still give Dante some time in the lime light-though admittedly a lot less in comparison to Nero, who got the majority of the missions.

It's quite interesting when you think about it, because Nero was solely a product of Itsuno and his team, a blank slate, and they did so much differently with him in comparison to Dante; slightly different controls, a grapple feature, a different DT ignition, a different weapon mechanic (Exceed)...it's possible that DMC4 was supposed to be the passing of the torch from Dante to the new kid, and then things go silent for so long, probably because the suits at Capcom didn't think another DMC was viable because it wasn't selling "CoD numbers (*sigh*)". However, when given the chance with DmC, we see a lot more of the other plans that Itsuno might have had for the franchise, and now we see a whole lot of Nero in Dante's playstyle (different controls, a grapple feature, a different DT ignition, different weapon mechanics...).

Eshiro said that they wanted to even do away with the lock on back in DMC3 because they felt it was a bit too constrictive (although there's plenty of ways to do lock-on better than DMC's :tongue, but couldn't figure it out, so it looks like even with Nero they were attempting to streamline the controls in comparison to Dante, and then come DmC they're given a lot more freedom to rework the controls. Plus, Itsuno had done a fantastic job with Dragon's Dogma, so there was a lot he could take from his time there, too. Although, I do love Ninja Theory's contributions as well, because I love the weapon stance system. I found a lot more freedom in it, as (to me) a modifier is always better than one or two buttons relegated to types of attacks.

I've always sorta figured this, but never thought about it enough until now.

 

[IncarnatedDemon]

Even if they made Nero the protaganist, Nero would operate in same universe as Dante, so we would see him.
And a break from the character (Dante) can't be bad.
You can view a character like a food, eat alot of it and you will grow sick of it.

 

[ToCool74]

You can view a character like a food, eat alot of it and you will grow sick of it.

Not sure about anyone else, but I'm personally not tired of characters like Mario,Sonic, Link,Master Chief, and other iconic characters who have been around for a long time in their respective games.

Doubt I will be getting tired of Dante anytime soon since I hold him on the same level as the iconic characters I listed above.

 

[Rebel Dynasty]

It's quite interesting when you think about it, because Nero was solely a product of Itsuno and his team, a blank slate, and they did so much differently with him in comparison to Dante; slightly different controls, a grapple feature, a different DT ignition, a different weapon mechanic (Exceed)...it's possible that DMC4 was supposed to be the passing of the torch from Dante to the new kid, and then things go silent for so long, probably because the suits at Capcom didn't think another DMC was viable because it wasn't selling "CoD numbers (*sigh*)". However, when given the chance with DmC, we see a lot more of the other plans that Itsuno might have had for the franchise, and now we see a whole lot of Nero in Dante's playstyle (different controls, a grapple feature, a different DT ignition, different weapon mechanics...).

I'm not sure why they would ever bother to compare their sales to CoD. There are far too many first-person shooters out there as is; yeah, they sell particularly well, but those aren't the only kinds of games people want. Silly Capcom, they should have known better.

I hadn't known that Nero was strictly a product of Itsuno and his team; that's very interesting. Despite how differently they play, Nero and Dante still retain some similarities as well. DMC4 was actually the first DMC I was able to play (I found the HD collection some months later), and like most people, after using Nero, I needed to adapt to Dante. But, once I unlocked all of his abilities (and started playing DMC1 and 3) I got a better feel for him. He plays differently in all of the games, really; or at least, he feels different. Once I started playing 1 and 3, I realized he felt a lot smoother and more responsive in DMC4 in comparison; and in comparison to him, Nero feels even more fluid.

I have no trouble playing as either character now, since I've more than gotten a feel for them. That being said-do you think perhaps they had a different team working on DMC4 Dante's attacks from whatever team worked on Nero's?

Eshiro said that they wanted to even do away with the lock on back in DMC3 because they felt it was a bit too constrictive (although there's plenty of ways to do lock-on better than DMC's :tongue, but couldn't figure it out, so it looks like even with Nero they were attempting to streamline the controls in comparison to Dante, and then come DmC they're given a lot more freedom to rework the controls.

The only issue I've ever had with the lock-on is, sometimes it gives priority to a specific opponent when I'm trying to focus on something else (such as the spoked wheels in DMC3, when you try to lower the Hell's auras).

Seriously though, I didn't know about half of this. Of course, I didn't delve into the games' creation overly much, which would probably be why. ^^;

 

[TWOxACROSS]

I'm not sure why they would ever bother to compare their sales to CoD.

Because those suits only think of the business side of things...and they see the money CoD makes and wonder why as beloved as their games are they aren't selling as much. Misguided idiocy, really :tongue:

I hadn't known that Nero was strictly a product of Itsuno and his team; that's very interesting. Despite how differently they play, Nero and Dante still retain some similarities as well. DMC4 was actually the first DMC I was able to play (I found the HD collection some months later), and like most people, after using Nero, I needed to adapt to Dante. But, once I unlocked all of his abilities (and started playing DMC1 and 3) I got a better feel for him. He plays differently in all of the games, really; or at least, he feels different. Once I started playing 1 and 3, I realized he felt a lot smoother and more responsive in DMC4 in comparison; and in comparison to him, Nero feels even more fluid.

Yeah, that makes me think that Nero may have also been another way to get the less than skilled into the game. There's all that talk about how DMC4 was made for the female fans, and I wonder if they felt that they needed a character who wasn't as complicated as Dante for those fans to play.

I have no trouble playing as either character now, since I've more than gotten a feel for them. That being said-do you think perhaps they had a different team working on DMC4 Dante's attacks from whatever team worked on Nero's?

I'm not sure, the common idea is that Nero was going to be the only character in the game originally, and then they crammed Dante in late in development >.< I think they probably had the same team working on both, but Nero also plays a little bit more fluidly than Dante simply by virtue of his controls being a bit more refined.

The only issue I've ever had with the lock-on is, sometimes it gives priority to a specific opponent when I'm trying to focus on something else (such as the spoked wheels in DMC3, when you try to lower the Hell's auras).

This was a problem I often had in DMC3, too. However, in DMC4 they had a lock-on option for giving priority to whomever you tilted the left stick towards (the same system that is in use in DmC, actually). That stick-modifying option allows for players to change direction really easily, and to ensure your target more easily.