Why didn't Dante leave Vergil behind?

[McdD]

At end of DMC 3 after the amulets were separeted Vergil told Dante "The portal to human world is closing", and Dante replied "I have to stop you, even if it means killing you".

Dante had his amulet, and Vergil his. Vergil also had Sparda's sword. Vergil's goal to get his hands on Sparda's power had failed, he can't do that without both amulets.

So i don't understand why Dante went after finishing Vergil off. Because Dante's thoughts are not visible in the story.
All i can come up my by myself is that Dante did not want Vergil to stay behind in underworld hence why he said he has to stop him from taking such decision even if he might end up killing him.

 

[V]

Dante said he would kill him to stop him, but I don't believe he meant he would do so in cold blood, rather that Vergil was forcing him to - all the signs indicate Dante did not mean exactly what he said... his running toward him at the end, reaching out, even shedding tears after.

I think he meant he wanted to stop Vergil from unleashing and gaining Sparda's power - Dante apparently believes that the power is too much for Vergil (or anyone), and that having it wouldn't do him or the world any good. In DMC4 Dante also states that he doesn't want demonic weapons and power floating about in the wrong hands, and would rather keep guard over them himself, because he, Dante, does not want to use them for the purposes of conquering or gaining anything.

At the end, there's that scene where Dante tries to grab Vergil and Vergil stops him by slashing his hand with Yamato. This implies to me that Vergil wanted Dante to back off and not save him (which was why he edged to the cliff so that he fall deeper into Hell and knew Dante wouldn't follow him), or that Dante was the only one wasting time now, and from Dante's final reaction to it, it seems that he accepts that that was Vergil's decision and there was nothing he could (or should) do about it. As long as Vergil couldn't use the power (and had lost the Force Edge), there was no need to stop him doing what he wanted to do with his own life.

(Although some people have suggested Dante ran forward at the end to get Vergil's amulet - gaining all of Sparda's potential power for himself, the other amulet and the sword and so having the means to control the entrance to the Underworld - but I don't think that could be the case since Dante isn't so much preoccupied with the acquisition of Sparda's stuff than he is with making sure nobody else uses it.)

I figure - they fought, Vergil lost, and Dante tried to stop him falling out of pure instinctual reaction, since Vergil was no longer a threat, and he still cared about him. Rather than him wanting to stop him from entering Hell on his own, I reckon he just wanted Vergil disarmed. From their brief conversation before the final battle, Dante seems to think that Vergil is being silly and that all that power was ultimately meaningless - he was trying to convince him to give up his quest for power and return to normality, and he was serious about it because he did it without any banter or playing around. He didn't leave him behind because, I guess, at the end he was trying to help Vergil.

 

[McdD]

Dante said he would kill him to stop him, but I don't believe he meant he would do so in cold blood, rather that Vergil was forcing him to - all the signs indicate Dante did not mean exactly what he said... his running toward him at the end, reaching out, even shedding tears after.
I am aware of that. I know he didn't mean it in a cold blooded way.

I think he meant he wanted to stop Vergil from unleashing and gaining Sparda's power - Dante apparently believes that the power is too much for Vergil (or anyone), and that having it wouldn't do him or the world any good. In DMC4 Dante also states that he doesn't want demonic weapons and power floating about in the wrong hands, and would rather keep guard over them himself, because he, Dante, does not want to use them for the purposes of conquering or gaining anything.
But that's the thing though, Vergil told Dante indirectly to get back to human world. And to access Sparda's full power you need both amulets. And at the time Dante had his amulet, and Vergil seemed to gave up the idea of fighting for Dante's amulet.

At the end, there's that scene where Dante tries to grab Vergil and Vergil stops him by slashing his hand with Yamato. This implies to me that Vergil either wanted Dante to back off and not save him (which was why he edged to the cliff so that he fall deeper into Hell and knew Dante wouldn't follow him) and from Dante's final reaction to it, it seems that he accepts that that was Vergil's decision and there was nothing he could (or should) do about it. As long as Vergil couldn't use the power (and had lost the Force Edge), there was no need to stop him doing what he wanted to do with his own life.

(Although some people have suggested Dante ran forward at the end to get Vergil's amulet - gaining all of Sparda's potential power for himself, the other amulet and the sword and so having the means to control the entrance to Hell - but I don't think that could be the case since Dante isn't so much preoccupied with the acquisition of Sparda's stuff than he is with making sure nobody else uses it.)

I figure - they fought, Vergil lost, and Dante tried to stop him falling out of pure instinctual reaction, since Vergil was no longer a threat, and he still cared about him. Rather than him wanting to stop him from entering Hell on his own, I reckon he just wanted Vergil disarmed. From their brief conversation before the final battle, Dante seems to think that Vergil is being silly and that all that power was ultimately meaningless - he was trying to convince him to give up his quest for power and return to normality, and he was serious about it because he did it without any banter or playing around. He didn't leave him behind because, I guess, at the end he was trying to help Vergil.
The first fight between Vergil and Dante in the demon place was for the power of Sparda. And Dante beat Vergil. The cutscene fight at end though seemed to be Vergil telling Dante "I am staying in demon world,you go back to human world", and Dante replied "I won't let you do that even if i end up killing you in the process".

 

[V]

At that point, Vergil wasn't defeated though, he still had some fight left in there and he still had Force Edge. So the battle wasn't over at that point and Dante wanted it finished. If anything, I think Vergil was warning Dante about it because he knew Dante wouldn't want to stay there, whereas he knew he was staying. He didn't declare that he was staying in the Demon World though until after being properly defeated, so I'm not convinced that's the reason Dante wanted to make that finishing strike. I think he said it because he had to get that Force Edge back from Vergil, and the only way to do it was to defeat him fully and take it from him.

That's all I can assume. If Dante *really* wanted to stop him from staying there, he could have tried harder to get him before he fell. (Maybe just yanked Yamato by the blade or used Quicksilver, lolol).

 

[McdD]

At that point, Vergil wasn't defeated though, he still had some fight left in there and he still had Force Edge. So the battle wasn't over at that point and Dante wanted it finished. If anything, I think Vergil was warning Dante about it because he knew Dante wouldn't want to stay there, whereas he knew he was staying. He didn't declare that he was staying in the Demon World though until after being properly defeated, so I'm not convinced that's the reason Dante wanted to make that finishing strike. I think he said it because he had to get that Force Edge back from Vergil, and the only way to do it was to defeat him fully and take it from him.
I will need to look at cutscenes again.

That's all I can assume. If Dante *really* wanted to stop him from staying there, he could have tried harder to get him before he fell. (Maybe just yanked Yamato by the blade or used Quicksilver, lolol).
Story and gameplay is two different things. Plus Vergil slashed Dante's hand so.

 

[V]

It was a joke.

 

[darkdeamon92/dmc3/]

lexy i agree with everything you said....but i have a question if vergil at the end had sparda's power would he have gone back to the human world or would he have stayed in the demon world??

 

[V]

lexy i agree with everything you said....but i have a question if vergil at the end had sparda's power would he have gone back to the human world or would he have stayed in the demon world??

That's a tough one. It's actually really hard to say or speculate on that question! But I'll have a try.

...Dante suggests that Vergil was trying to emulate Sparda. He knows Vergil best in the story so we have to imagine he knows what Vergil is trying to do, or at least has a bit of a clue as to his motivations. And Sparda was a ruler of the human world (incognito). And we know from that game and from other sources that have contributed information to Vergil's character (manga/DMC4 novel/UMvC3) that Vergil already seems to think himself far beyond the level of any human opponent, AND that he seems more than willing to fight people who might actually be a challenge to him.

He doesn't strike me as the sort who would attain Sparda's power and then return to the human world and try to control it. Humans don't seem to interest him much, neither killing them nor lording it over them (except that one reference he makes in the manga - which is semi-canon at least, about making everyone fear him). But he DOES strike me as the type who would attain the power and then go and try it out on some more worthy/powerful opponents - like higher demons. He would probably find the best demons to fight in the Underworld, and so that I would think would be his first port of call.

There's even a suggestion in the novel that Vergil wants to outdo Sparda's legacy and I wouldn't say such a sentiment would be unlike him. What would he do with all that power - as Dante asks? Fight. Beat the crap out of anyone that dared to challenge him, or perhaps he would go and challenge anyone who was anybody down there. Not sure if he ever intended to find Mundus at this point, but he recognises Mundus on sight - so he knows who's the Big Bad in Hell and I figure eventually Mundus would have been his ultimate target. Certainly for revenge, and definitely for the thrill.

Maybe he'd have moved between the Underworld and the Human World, since his plan would have given him both Sparda's power and the key to the Demon World. He might have come back and attempted to set himself up as some kind of human ruler. But knowing what we know about him, I figure that would have bored him.

It makes me wonder if he had defeated everybody weaker than him, would he have been finally satisfied to realize himself the most powerful creature in the world, or would he have only engineered his own misery in boredom. Perhaps both. To me Vergil walks a path that can only end in some form of dissatisfaction, but is irresistibly compelled by a need to do it to affirm his existence. He will always be dissatisfied.

 

[darkdeamon92/dmc3/]

Maybe he'd have moved between the Underworld and the Human World

first of all thank you for that thought and if he moved between the two worlds why didnt mundus catch him then?? or did mundus think hes not match for vergil and wanted to catch him when his weak.... your thought??

 

[V]

I would assume he would do so after defeating Mundus. . .

 

[darkdeamon92/dmc3/]

I would assume he would do so after defeating Mundus. . .

do what?:/

 

[V]

Go back to the human world, I mean.

I don't think there was much reason for him to return before he'd done what he wanted to do in the Underworld. But, if he did, well... Mundus did seem to be 'located' physically in the deepest parts of Hell (in both DMC1 and 3) so... he could have probably avoided those areas and returned to the human world whenever. (DMC1 suggests that a gate can be opened in any place, or that there's at least some flexibility where the portal appears or is made... and in DMC3 the tower was built to create a portal, so... I guess he could have made one himself with the amulets easily enough).

What's weird is that Mundus appeared in DMC1 in the sky in the human world, and destroyed Griffon. That doesn't make any sense to me, since he could have blasted Dante to bits as well as Griffon, and didn't. Unless his power extends only over other demons in the human world, or that, what actually killed Griffon was Mundus withdrawing his power from the demon's body, and he wasn't actually physically 'there'. That at least makes a bit more sense to me. But yeah, if Vergil was wandering around the Underworld, he might well have been in danger from Mundus the whole time (and so was Dante, while he was there). Mundus appears to manifest in voice and 'eyes' wherever he wants, but physically remains in once place. But would Mundus have noticed Vergil until he was close? I get the feeling Mundus isn't omnipotent and present everywhere at all times.

 

[berto]

At end of DMC 3 after the amulets were separeted Vergil told Dante "The portal to human world is closing", and Dante replied "I have to stop you, even if it means killing you".

Dante had his amulet, and Vergil his. Vergil also had Sparda's sword. Vergil's goal to get his hands on Sparda's power had failed, he can't do that without both amulets.

So i don't understand why Dante went after finishing Vergil off. Because Dante's thoughts are not visible in the story.
All i can come up my by myself is that Dante did not want Vergil to stay behind in underworld hence why he said he has to stop him from taking such decision even if he might end up killing him.

You don't have any brothers, do you?

Even if your brother's an assh**e you still wouldn't want any harm to come to him. Fist fights, querrels, or any form of alianation will never change the fact that brothers are brothers.

 

[darkdeamon92/dmc3/]

Go back to the human world, I mean.

I don't think there was much reason for him to return before he'd done what he wanted to do in the Underworld. But, if he did, well... Mundus did seem to be 'located' physically in the deepest parts of Hell (in both DMC1 and 3) so... he could have probably avoided those areas and returned to the human world whenever. (DMC1 suggests that a gate can be opened in any place, or that there's at least some flexibility where the portal appears or is made... and in DMC3 the tower was built to create a portal, so... I guess he could have made one himself with the amulets easily enough).

What's weird is that Mundus appeared in DMC1 in the sky in the human world, and destroyed Griffon. That doesn't make any sense to me, since he could have blasted Dante to bits as well as Griffon, and didn't. Unless his power extends only over other demons in the human world, or that, what actually killed Griffon was Mundus withdrawing his power from the demon's body, and he wasn't actually physically 'there'. That at least makes a bit more sense to me. But yeah, if Vergil was wandering around the Underworld, he might well have been in danger from Mundus the whole time (and so was Dante, while he was there). Mundus appears to manifest in voice and 'eyes' wherever he wants, but physically remains in once place. But would Mundus have noticed Vergil until he was close? I get the feeling Mundus isn't omnipotent and present everywhere at all times.

oh ok i see what you mean..and you make a gr8 point... and yeah i dont think he could be everywhere at once....but the thing is vergil doesnt fear anyone...and although he was weak he faced mundus and said if my father defeated you then so shall i.....so i cant imagine vergil going to the underworld and hide from him..... dont u think??

 

[V]

oh ok i see what you mean..and you make a gr8 point... and yeah i dont think he could be everywhere at once....but the thing is vergil doesnt fear anyone...and although he was weak he faced mundus and said if my father defeated you then so shall i.....so i cant imagine vergil going to the underworld and hide from him..... dont u think??

Absolutely. Vergil never shows fear of anyone, or anything. But he does betray a thrill-seeking streak and a knowledge of Mundus. I'd bet plenty he'd intended to depose or destroy Mundus if he was going to go there at all. Otherwise it'd be like... visiting Rome and not seeing Il Colosseo.

 

[darkdeamon92/dmc3/]

Absolutely. Vergil never shows fear of anyone, or anything. But he does betray a thrill-seeking streak and a knowledge of Mundus. I'd bet plenty he'd intended to depose or destroy Mundus if he was going to go there at all. Otherwise it'd be like... visiting Rome and not seeing Il Colosseo.

lol exactly well i dont know its alwayz a mystery within a mystery you know.....

 

[McdD]

You don't have any brothers, do you?

Even if your brother's an assh**e you still wouldn't want any harm to come to him. Fist fights, querrels, or any form of alianation will never change the fact that brothers are brothers.

I got many brothers (won't say spesific number). But i know Dante wasn't going to leave Vergil behind, just wondering if that was his point with "finish strike" to Vergil, to stop him from going to underworld.

 

[berto]

Your wording is odd. What do you man "if that was his point with "finish strike" to Vergil?"

 

[McdD]

Here you see after Vergil boss fight:
Vergil says the amulets havebeen separated and thus portal to human world isclosing.

Doesn't Vergil need both amulets to be able to obtain the full power of Sparda through the sword?

And Dante says "Let's finish this, i have to stop you even if i must kill you":
was Dante thinking "I won't let you stay in demon world, i will try stop you in anyway i can even if iend up killing you"?

Or was he thinking something else?

I think he thought what i thought. That he won't let his brother stay in demon realm.

 

[V]

I still suggest it was because Vergil had the Force Edge, and Dante didn't want it in Vergil's hands... because Vergil never tells Dante that he was going to stay in the demon world until he's about to throw himself off the cliff.

Possibly even that Dante wanted to take his amulet too, so that he'd had absolutely no influence for the worse. Because Vergil makes a point of telling him to the effect of: "you can have the sword, then, but you can't have this. It's mine."

I think the battle and the final strike was over those possessions, not much to do with the demon world itself.