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What Halo 4 can learn from the Devil May Cry reboot

Dark Drakan said:
It was the quote by the studio boss that I quoted above that was the reason he wrote the article being that he isnt afraid to break from Halo lore like Ninja Theory and breaking from DMC lore. I believe that is the only reason for the comparison.
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Ok I understand now.

But I doubt that Microsoft would let him make "drastic" changes like DmC.

Unlike the DMC series, the halo series is still pretty darn profitable for Microsoft and has a HUGE established fanbase already.

As much as I love the DMC series, our fanbase is not nearly as big as the Halo fanbase not to mention the halo franchise far outsells the DMC franchise I bet.

So I doubt that this Frank would be dumb enough to ruin/change a already perfect thing "to much".
 
ToCool74 said:
Ok I understand now.

But I doubt that Microsoft would let him make "drastic" changes like DmC.

Unlike the DMC series, the halo series is still pretty darn profitable for Microsoft and has a HUGE established fanbase already.

As much as I love the DMC series, our fanbase is not nearly as big as the Halo fanbase not to mention the halo franchise far outsells the DMC franchise I bet.

So I doubt that this Frank would be dumb enough to ruin/change a already perfect thing "to much".
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Oh course not, not HUGE changes but it still really annoys people when new developers stray slightly away from the lore of the series. So its a big risk to take and at the risk of a backlash, wont quite be to the scale of DmC changes and backlash but along the same idea.

If Ninja Theory werent afraid to drastically change a much loved franchise then other developers shouldnt be afraid to change things either (be it on less of a scale).
 
Dark Drakan said:
Oh course not, not HUGE changes but it still really annoys people when new developers stray slightly away from the lore of the series. So its a big risk to take and at the risk of a backlash, wont quite be to the scale of DmC changes and backlash but along the same idea.
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The difference between DMC fanbase and the halo fanbase is that the Halo fanbase has been pretty pleased with the halo product.

So I doubt a "minor" change would spark up to much of a stir amongst the fans like DmC has.

Halo 3 for example made minor changes to the established style of Halo 2 such as the ability to not be able to equip 2 Needler guns. Sure some fans where initially like "wtf" but it did not cause a stir amongst the fans.

And as I said earlier, yea there is a new team working on this and its not bungie, but, the fact remains that alot of the guys who actually where a part of the Bungie team and helped make Halo what it is are still a part of this new team so the situation between the Fans and Ninja Theory isn't really a accurate comparison since NT has never worked on a DMC game.

And also unlike DmC this game will still be continuing the established story of Halo rather than just putting it on the shelf or throwing it away in favor of something "new".

As you pointed out there are a "few" similar circumstances such as "new team" and "Changing lore" but I don't think the change to halo will be all that negative as it has been with the DMC fanbase.
 
I'd be interested to know just how far from the Halo lore they plan to stray, if they indeed do at all. Having been an avid reader of the books and played all the games multiple times, I would be a little ticked off if they made changes that rendered certain other things that were important aspects of the Halo universe useless. If it was a reboot or whatever the buzz word is these days, then I wouldn't be too fussed but it would probably give me cause to have a little moan about the bits I don't like ;)
 
ToCool74 said:
As you pointed out there are a "few" similar circumstances such as "new team" and "Changing lore" but I don't think the change to halo will be all that negative as it has been with the DMC fanbase.
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Halo ODST though classed as a spin off was a big risk and lots of fans werent that happy with that but yeah I see what your saying.
 
Saying that the Halo team should step out on a limb and ignore Gamer's feedback and expectations of the game and try a reboot like DMC is doing is ignorance. Who's to say this Reboot doesn't hurt DMC? it is a huge possablity it will be another DMC2. although i do not decide to give it such little hope. I;m just saying after there failure with DMC2 i fail to see how after to game's doing great they find the confidence to do a reboot. I do not recommend a reboot for halo. Game's are like old movie's. There are some that directors should just leave the **** alone because it's never gonna be as good any different.

(I guess though if they just left stuff alone, there would be noting intresting for member's of forum's to nag about, am i right?)
 
Kyo said:
Saying that the Halo team should step out on a limb and ignore Gamer's feedback and expectations of the game and try a reboot like DMC is doing is ignorance.
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That isnt what he said or what any of us implied, he just said he thinks more (in this case) 'Alternate' developers should take risks even if that means straying away from the source material a little.
 
Certain risk should be taken, i agree there. but when it come's to dramaticaly changing a game, i do not agree.
 
Kyo said:
Certain risk should be taken, i agree there. but when it come's to dramaticaly changing a game, i do not agree.
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No-one does really, its got to have some parts that remain faithful to the franchise or its simply a new game with the old games title slapped on to boost sales.
 
kind remind anyone of our beloved devilmaycry? Dante with black hair? his white hair is a signature.
 
The Darkness II (which I just pre-ordered) is a good example of risks. I loved the original by Starbreeze Studios and im a Starbreeze fan and the sequel has been designed by a totally new team, Digital Extremes. They changed the look and the style of the game from the dark and gritty realistic look to a more comic styled one and the voice of its main character which everyone praised from the original and also messed with the lore of The Darkness a little with a new co-op mode where players wield weapons which harness The Darkness energy.

I was a little sceptical to say the least and werent happy that Starbreeze werent developing it or that Digital Extremes were changing so much about it but after playing the demo I really enjoyed it and at its heart its the same game underneath despite so many changes so ive preordered. It has kept a lot of things I liked about the original and the other things grow on you and seem to work even though I thought they wouldnt. If the full game continues improve on the impression the demo left on me I shall be happy to hold my hands up and say that the risks Digital Extremes have taken have paid off. If they were to have made the game to much like the original I dont think they could have possibly bettered Starbreeze at it.
 
Dark Drakan said:
Hes a long time fan of DMC and also he doesnt mention anything about success or failure just that maybe 343 studios shouldnt simply play it safe and churn out another Halo with a number attached to it. Try something different, excite and split the fans and take some risks and maybe you will open the Halo games up to a whole new fanbase rather than aiming to simply please the fans you already have by making another updated title in the franchise.
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But he talked about Ninja theory ignoring fans etc. because fans want the same old thing?

That's not the case. Fans want same old with new stuff added to it. But clearly Ninja theory has gone their own way and ignore fans totally.
And Capcom has been behind their back with a sign "Think of the sales".

It's pretty hypocritical to make a complete different game but at same time tell the old fans "Hey come play our game". If your gonna make a new game - MAKE a new game and talk about it as a new game.


Again fans never want the same old thing. THEY NEVER DO.


And you know what's really **** off? People always talk about DMC fans as if they want the same old ****. And that's really, really ignorant.

People want the same PLUUUUUS new stuff.
And i fail to see how Ninja theory are revolutionary in anyway because they have ****ed off fans and done things their way completely because they are self centered. We pretty much know Capcom is forcing Ninja theory to think of the sales, that is why Devil trigger became a crap way of showing "DMC" DAnte in NT's Dante.

And you know what's really disrespectful? Gaming shows and Tameem Antoniades summarizing the issues with NT's Dante as "There will be white hair".



If Halo story is exhausted - it should die, and whoever are given task to make next Halo game should make a Halo game that's about gameplay, and not a story that's already and possibly stretched out.


And all the old DMC fans are mostly a target group that Capcom knows will buy the game. The real "fans" they want is the new fanbase they are appealing to.
 
I think that all fanbases are generally like this. That with new changes there will be a group of hardcore fanboys/girls who rage about it. That's just how the gaming community is, I guess.
 
i'm not against the article but i do think 343 should do reasearch on the lore and fanbase to get a good idea of what they are doing.
Plus they should not fall in the pr traps that NT did.

@zwei- All fanbases are like that so all you can do is back yor decisions to the wire.
No pain, no gain.
 
You don't have to be a hardcore fan to be annoyed by changes in a well-loved series. It's how you choose to express that disappointment that makes the difference, imo.

If they make a drastic change but explain it well then I have less of an issue with noticeable alterations to a game series. But they cannot just rely on interviews to explain the change - not everyone reads/watches those things so it should make sense within the game itself as to why such and such is different. I would consider it to be very lazy if Halo 4 made some big changes and then relied solely on a handful of explanatory interviews to tell people why. If Master Chief suddenly turned into a woman, for example, then I would want to know what the motherfudge happened and hope that the gameplay would explicitly cover that issue, leaving nothing to speculation and avoiding all ambiguity.

If they didn't cover it and all I got in response was "well in an interview with blahblahblah, the studio mentioned XYZ", I'd be utterly hacked off and feel cheated by the lack of integrity in keeping fans in the loop with such a massive change. This is why I'm hoping DmC will explain within the game itself some of the things that have been bugging people - let's be honest, there is a lot of lore there that could be seriously messed up if they tried to include some bits but not others without any clarification or explanation as to why or how.
 
CoolDemon said:
But he talked about Ninja theory ignoring fans etc. because fans want the same old thing?

That's not the case. Fans want same old with new stuff added to it. But clearly Ninja theory has gone their own way and ignore fans totally.
And Capcom has been behind their back with a sign "Think of the sales".

It's pretty hypocritical to make a complete different game but at same time tell the old fans "Hey come play our game". If your gonna make a new game - MAKE a new game and talk about it as a new game.


Again fans never want the same old thing.

fans are mostly a target group that Capcom knows will buy the game. The real "fans" they want is the new fanbase they are appealing to.
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People don't Want the same old crap? Call of duty begs to differ
 
mrrandomlulz said:
People don't Want the same old crap? Call of duty begs to differ
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thats call of duty , and many of them seems to be kids.

When you speak of "fans want the same old crap" you speak of what fans?

Because there is TONS of fans.

And are Cod fans different than other games fans? Probably.

And look at Call of Duty - it's gameplay type of game.

GAAAAAAAAMEPLAY


You can change the theme of Call of Duty (sci fi theme instead of modern realistic), but it still will have the same gameplay. So they have perfected the gameplay pretty much.


They could try to come up with new gameplay for Call of Duty, but it will MOST LIKELY lead to something similar to what they have in most of the games now.

I'm pretty sure the story/campaign of Call of Duty games ain't "same old crap".
 
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