Ugh... Kyrie. If they were following after the Orihime character, I can understand then why she was so silent most of the time, to make her look silent but mentally strong in her situation, like Orihime seems to be. But it just didn't work here. There's so much from Kyrie's position that could have been interesting to know of, mainly in how she's coping with the fact that her pope is suddenly using her as somesort of bait for her boyfriend.
Vergil's Downfall Story; So...huh?
- Thread starter EvilX-81
- Start date
Ugh... Kyrie. If they were following after the Orihime character, I can understand then why she was so silent most of the time, to make her look silent but mentally strong in her situation, like Orihime seems to be. But it just didn't work here. There's so much from Kyrie's position that could have been interesting to know of, mainly in how she's coping with the fact that her pope is suddenly using her as somesort of bait for her boyfriend.
IncarnatedDemon
Well-known Member
Yeah, i agree that that Capcom seemed to have influence on VD, or it may be that NT crew have read and watched Bleach. I am not japanese, and i read and watch Bleach.
And NT is known for ripping off ideas but implementing it different.
Same is Capcom.
What is funny is that both VD and DMC 4 was rushed project:
- the cartoon cutscenes
- the weak story (extremely generic) (DmC)
- DMC 4 was also very generic
And my theory is that rip offs is more prone to happen when you have a deadline on your head. Then you may WITHOUT REALIZING IT rip off things uve read, played or watched.
The contrast is when you rip off and you know you are.
Anyhow Capcom is known for taking ideas from Bleach. Though in Vergil's case they didn't exactly rip off Bleach, they merely were inspired by it. Look DMC 3 Vergils gameplay and Byakuya from Bleach:
http://static.zerochan.net/Kuchiki.Byakuya.full.1204777.jpg
http://fc00.deviantart.net/fs11/i/2006/191/5/a/Sword_Summoner_by_LunaticSupernova.jpg
On top of that both Byakuya and Vergil are very calm and collective and cold.
So i wouldnt calling the summon swords idea that DMC 3 implemented into Vergils gameplay a rip off, because:
1) It's implemented differently
2) Byakuya gameplay is not like Vergil's gameplay (if Byakuya bankai gameplay ever existed).
And then you have Komamura and Nero ability similarity (off the charts):
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20081017160821/bleach/en/images/0/04/Komamura_bankai.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-OBTh40-8zRk/Ty_Svhg64WI/AAAAAAAAARU/5rhzRTx-XRo/s1600/NDT_DMC4.jpg
Even their swords are somewhat similar in shape:
http://www.swords24.eu/images/products/en/Devil_May_Cry_Red_Queen_Sword_of_Nero_UC2596.jpg
http://salon.mieczy.pl/images/KomamuraSajinBankaiZanpakuto.jpg
In Zanpakuto arc in Bleach, Komamuras sword spirit was portrayed as a fire entity. And Nero's sword has a "fire" ability.
Anyhow it seems like Byakuya and Komamura abilities were ripped off by DMC 3 and DMC 4, but i wouldn't call it a rip off. They saw "This is awesome", and they implemented the abilities differently and into a game.
Dante Redgrave
Son of Sparda
In DMC4's case...it practucally played out like an episode of Bleach, right down to the lead male and female characters' VAs, guest starring Dante. Nero had a giant ass sword that's pretty strong, buit then replaces it with a more simplistic yet more POWERFUL katana while in pursuit of saving his girlfriend?...~look's at Ichigo~ Yeah...they may as well have made Nero a redhead and been honest about it
IncarnatedDemon
Well-known Member
Story wise they ripped off yeah. But for gameplay aspects i wouldn't call for example Nero's Devil trigger a rip off just because it resemblances Komamura's bankai/abilities.
Plus Komamura's attack is more heavy brute sword going down.
Nero's is more very slashy and fast attack.
But yeah that's what rushed projects do: it ****s up storys by rip offs.
Dante Redgrave
Son of Sparda
No, Nero is very brute force and smashy, DANTE is slashy and fast in his attacks. but Nero =/ Komamura, it's nero = Ichigo at the core of it
IncarnatedDemon
Well-known Member
That's up for discussion. I have great respect for your analyzing mind, and you have a point.
Devil trigger Nero = very fast
Bankai IChigo = very fast
But perhaps Devil trigger of Nero is a combo of Ichigo abilities and Komamuras Bankai appearnce?
Anyhow let's end talking about this as its not relevant
EllDawn
Well-known Member
I wish they would have, too. Plus made her lines better.
I tend to think he'd become so bitter about all the memories, it built up enough of a wall between him and his mother, that he just really couldn't feel anything about seeing her. Plus, since he was speaking to his father at the grave, I think he favored his father more.
TheNoHeartedBeing
Well-known Member
I see what you mean. It would have been better if they would have let Sparda speak to him but we all know its against the rules in a dmc game to show Sparda doing anything.
Loopy
Devil hunter in training
Don't know if the Vergil comic is cannon, but in that he calls Eva a whore, well, says he is the son of one. So he didn't have much respect for her. Plus he called Sparda a traitor. The again, I guess he could favour Sparda because he does introduce himself to Kat as the son of a demon, not as the son of a demon and an angel.
The guy is just messed up in the head. Probably blames Eva for taking Sparda away from his true path of ruling the humans with Mundus. Let's face it, the guy learns from an early age that when Sparda and Eva fall in love, they get killed. So in his mind, it probably turned into Love=Death. So love becomes a weakness to him, and so in turn he hates Eva for what she was and what she did, and tries to purge himself of love because he thinks it will make him weak and get him killed.
seraphmaycry
Well-known Member
BUT LOVE DOES EQUAL DEATH:troll:
EllDawn
Well-known Member
I actually kind like that they didn't have Sparda talk to him. Even if he didn't respect Eva, she was still his mother and represented something good in him. I also got kind of tired of hearing about how great and legendary Sparda was, making it almost impossible for Dante to live up to the name.
That would actually explain why he was supposed to have erased his and Kat's memories of loving each other. The only thing that makes me think he didn't erase his own memories is the looks he gives Kat in DmC.
Demi-fiend
Metempsychosis
You think so too, huh? :lol:
Noel
Well-known Member
I find it odd that Vergil who is calm and intelligent character, respond and indulge of what is basically a fever dream. Any average intelligent person will go like "where am I? Why is he here? Why my doppelganger talking? Why my heart is 50 feet high?"
My theory is before Mundus was defeated, he manage to corrupt Vergil and probably Dante too(thinking back the sequence where Dante deliver the finishing blow to Vergil before Kat stop him)but he manage snap-out.
Maybe Mundus "true form" lives in Vergil. Maybe that's why the demons follow Vergil. They didn't bow down to the "new" demon king but to "the" demon king. Also In the first DMC, Vergil was control by Mundus too. So it's possible that Ninja Theory writers decide to keep that story element.
My theory is before Mundus was defeated, he manage to corrupt Vergil and probably Dante too(thinking back the sequence where Dante deliver the finishing blow to Vergil before Kat stop him)but he manage snap-out.
Maybe Mundus "true form" lives in Vergil. Maybe that's why the demons follow Vergil. They didn't bow down to the "new" demon king but to "the" demon king. Also In the first DMC, Vergil was control by Mundus too. So it's possible that Ninja Theory writers decide to keep that story element.
DarkSlayer54
Well-known Member
That's the best theory I've read yet. That theory makes me want to ignore VD's story (even if Mundus corrupted Vergil, some cutscenes still wouldn't make sense to me), because it's so much easier to believe in Mundus's power to corrupt than Vergil just going crazy.
Zilla
The inFAAMous
You could be on to something there, if You recall, Vergil is sucked inside Monster Mundus during the final encounter, where He is struggling with Mundus' human body. Perhaps there, Mundus transfers the remainder of his soul into Vergil, essentially corrupting him.
Also, Vergil uses his Yamato to close the Hell Gate, maybe something latched onto him at that point as well.
Eh, it's a stretch I know, but fleshed out, it could be interesting.
OppressedWriter
SamD
Yeah, I'm pretty sure its all in his head, and the whole getting more powerful it seems its just him revealing his true power sort of like how Dante almost went to the dark side when he DTed and nearly killed him. If it wasn't for Kat at that moment, I think Dante could have had his own fall. Think of Vergil's Downfall as us playing Vergil's mental decision to permanently Devil trigger and give in to his dark side.
Sieghart
"Plough the lilies"
This is what i have been saying a long time ago that mundus may have transferred his soul to someone else. I find it unlikely that he would just die like that.
Dante47
Well-known Member
It would make sense.
This may be something touched upon in the next titles, and if so, should be pretty worthwhile, if done and explained correctly.
LysseC
Philosopher and fangirl. Worst. Combination. Ever.
Mh, even though the "Mundus corrupting Vergil" theory may seem interesting, I think it's overcomplicating things.
I'd go with the simpler theory that the events of VD are situated in a sort of "personal hell", an internal dimension similar to Dante's own one (that of the DT). Here, Vergil's fears become incarnated in the illusionary figures of Kat and Dante (I think so beacuse they act so out of character, and because they say exactly what hurts him most, what, deep inside, Vergil thinks of himself).
His mother, though, is not an illusion, just like it wasn't an illusion when he appeared to Dante (when he discovers his DT): Eva, infact, does not act on Vergil's fears like the illusionary Dante and Kat do, but tries, even if she fails, to tell him that she loves him.
I'd go with the simpler theory that the events of VD are situated in a sort of "personal hell", an internal dimension similar to Dante's own one (that of the DT). Here, Vergil's fears become incarnated in the illusionary figures of Kat and Dante (I think so beacuse they act so out of character, and because they say exactly what hurts him most, what, deep inside, Vergil thinks of himself).
His mother, though, is not an illusion, just like it wasn't an illusion when he appeared to Dante (when he discovers his DT): Eva, infact, does not act on Vergil's fears like the illusionary Dante and Kat do, but tries, even if she fails, to tell him that she loves him.