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Stan Lee defends Marvel making "Another White Spider-Man"

LordOfDarkness

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But who really cares? He basically needn't say any more than what he did say, having had just a quick glance at it. And he makes the greatest yet most simplest point of them all. The whole idea behind these 'super' heroes is to create the general impression that this kind of stuff just happens to normal, ordinary people. I'm not talking about Thor, Super-Man etc But these characters, like Peter Parker or Bruce Wayne to just give a couple of examples, grow up with a tough upbringing or a burden. Peter's being no parents and Uncle Ben being killed and Bruce's being something to a similar extent. They go through these rough childhoods to create this whole "with belief in yourself and strength you can conquer anything and better yourself" image, which in turn gives kids this broader imagination to try to 'do good' or 'be the hero'. This isn't limiting race or gender whatsoever. The whole anybody can be a hero mentality quite literally means anybody, whether black or white.
 

LordOfDarkness

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Ugh the whole race thing annoys me. People need to stop crying about characters skin color and just enjoy some super hero action.

I know right? I mean, a great majority of them wear masks/disguises anyway so you won't even be thinking about skin colour when all of the ass-kickin' comes in.
 

ToCool74

"Fair" DmC Skeptic
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I can see where he is coming from, I honestly would not want Jason Statham playing a known black character like Blade for instance, even though he is a terrific actor who would most likely nail the role.

But Blade is a known black character, if we must get a new actor to play him my bet would be on another black actor (Idris elba would be PERFECT).

I just think that its better to keep as is, if a character started out white than let him stay white and so on, certain fans have a set image of a super hero they know and love, it understandable why this would irk so many.

Got nothing to do with disliking another race.
 

LordOfDarkness

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@VampireWicked: Hey man, I wasn't really getting at anything in particular. I'm not massive on comic books, so I wouldn't really know. I was just forming my opinion based on what I have heard. I always thought that the whole thing was to be like "Hey, anyone can be a hero". I guess also because Batman keeps making that point in the Dark Knight films. But hey, if that's not how we should be looking at the characters then I guess I've just got the wrong idea from all of this. I don't know, now I'm confused lol
 

Demi-fiend

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@LordOfDarkness

Just use another IP.

For instance: The old vampire hunter from "The Strain" is pretty much Blade in almost every single way -- however, he's still different enough to be considered unique.

----------------------

Now that that's out of the way, I shall now use my hallucinogenic steroids while meditating on a pentagram to enter the gates of hell and exterminate my demonic foes.

My holy short-staff "Blind Faith" will protect and aid me in the annihilation of my immortal foe, Blingpin.

http://www.therpf.com/f78/my-daredevil-stick-real-metal-all-functional-143489/

[0:37 in the vid -- that's a short staff holding its own against two swords -- it's not the weapon, it's the wielder.]


That was my own personal fusion of DMC/Constantine/Daredevil in case you didn't notice. :p
 
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The Good Gentleman

S'all Part of a Miracle Masterpiece
Now that he mentions it; has Stan actually made any new characters recently?
He had a manga a while back ago?

You, technically we had a Japanese Spider-Man, too. Canonically!

Yea but not really ground breaking.
Like getting a different developer to create Halo.
Just a different view on the same title.
Wait. Waitwaitwaitwaitwait! You call this not really ground breaking!?


Boy, where be your head! This is like the single greatest thing after Johnnie Walker Blue!
 

LordOfDarkness

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I heard about that Japanese Spider-Man before. How does that work exactly? Since, I thought Spider-Man came from New York? I don't know, I mean isn't that trying to give another country the same hero? Maybe I'm missing the point.

@VampireWicked: Oh yeah mate, I completely see your point now. It was not long after I'd woken up that I read what you put, so I was still a little bit confused. But yeah, I'm with you on the whole notion of establishing the character first and foremost, definitely.
 

The Good Gentleman

S'all Part of a Miracle Masterpiece
Actually, it's not. :D You really, really have to see the Japanese Spider-Man show to believe it. The ONLY thing they have in common is the suit - that's literally IT. No mutated spider-bites. No manhattan rogues gallery. Nothing.

I mean, comon! He's got a freaking giant robot and fights kaijus! And Doc Ok isn't his nemesis, this dude is:
profmonster.jpg


I mean, comon rofl. The dudes who wrote Spider-Verse were obviously on shrooms when they decided to make all this canon.

I heard about that Japanese Spider-Man before. How does that work exactly? Since, I thought Spider-Man came from New York? I don't know, I mean isn't that trying to give another country the same hero? Maybe I'm missing the point.

It's like, a completely different universe, with different characters, origins, everything. It's literally Spider-Man in name-only.

The Spider-Verse storyline had all kinds of different Spider-Men from across time, space and dimensions join forces to fight off Morlun. One of the Spideys that was summoned was Toei's Spider-Man. Hence, he became canon - in a weird, alternate-universe non-canon sort of way.
 
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The Good Gentleman

S'all Part of a Miracle Masterpiece
@The Good Gentleman
Okay but in cases like that why not just be 100% original, why use something that's already recognisable.
Out of ideas lol? It was made during the Tokusatsu high of 1978. At that point, Toei was sitting pretty on stacks of cash made from Ultraman, the Kamen Rider franchise, and Himitsu Sentai Gorenger. It was around that time that Spider-Man really took off in the west, so Toei thought - why not combine the two in a freak experiment!? Marvel wasn't opposed either since they wanted to reach out internationally, so the two joined forces and worked on a compromise that would be the mad science project known as Toei's Spider-Man.

Needless to say, it would take three decades for Marvel to team up with Japan again...
 

Lain

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Toei's Spider-Man was awesome! Did you guys know that they tried to adapt Captain America into a Tokusatsu show that later became Battle Fever J, the third entry in Super Sentai (power rangers).

Back on topic, I believe that no creator should be pressured into changing a character's race, gender or whatever just because it would be "progressive".
 

Stylish Nero

We Dem Boys!!
Wait is Marvel making yet ANOTHER SpiderMan incarnation or is Stan Lee criticizing Miles?

Either way people shouldn't care about a black SpiderMan or a racial swapped superheroes for its MAINSTREAM WESTERN SUPERHERO COMIC BOOKS *cough*DC*cough*Marvel*cough*

They've been doing this crap for decades even before the time of SJWs and modern day pandering. We've had a black Green Lantern, Nick Fury was made black (shocker Nick Fury used to be white and Nick Fury isn't even a superhero moniker that is his real name), Captain America is now black (Falcon), Thor is a chick, and we have had a Japanese SpiderMan before which is canon and a Japanese Spawn which may or may not be canon. Frank Castle (Punisher) literally became black for a while.

2010-10-12_201423_punisher61.jpg


It was a story arc in which Frank had a surgery so he can go unnoticed but the surgeon went a bit extreme and made him black.....so he was a white guy with a black appearance and he had to deal with prejudice and bigotry.

If anything gender swapped heroes are usually more of a problem than racially swapped ones.

http://www.comicvine.com/profile/rawhidekid/lists/female-versions-of-male-characters/28895/

Because like 80% of male superheroes have one.

People here have been saying they should make a new original character and have him stand on their own feet as a new character beside the likes of Batman and Spiderman. You guys seem to forget this Marvel and DC were talking about.

A. They have universes like straight up multiple universes loaded with thousands of superheroes with a variety of powers. Anything NEW they do at this point would not be considered new for them for they've done everything at this point. These are the same guys who will reboot an entire universe and retell the same stories but with some alterations. Even some of the original superheroes aren't that original to begin with.



B. Due to the over saturation of superhero material in the west any new hero would just fizzle out with the Batmans, the Supermans, the Avengers, the X-Mens, the SpiderMens, etc. Also people need to stop comparing comic books to video games. Comic books is a completely different medium than video games and have been around far longer as a result as a completely socio-economic structure of how people consume them. There hasn't been a new major superhero in over a decade now. White, black, Asian, red or blue any new superhero will never reach Superman, Spiderman, Ironman, Batman, or whatever status of recognition no matter how original and creative they are or how amazing their story is unless its by another company or Marvel/DC decide to push that new character like really heavily.

My biggest issue is the fact people (that also means Stan Lee) have a problem with a black or non-white SpiderMan when we have MULTIPLE different versions of SpiderMan, SpiderMan from the future, noir SpiderMan, a Man-Spider SpiderMan, SpiderWoman, we even for a while we had FREAKING DOC OC as SpiderMan (DOCTOR OCTOPUS, ONE OF SPIDERMAN'S GREATEST NEMESIS, WAS SPIDERMAN FOR A WHILE), etc. This stuff is normal with Marvel and DC. We have multiple different people who were Batman (one of which was a freaking vampire), 4 Robins, 3 different guys who were Green Lantern (maybe more), 3 different Flashes, a female counterpart to every freaking male superhero, kid versions of the same heroes (Superboy, Kid Flash, and more), Iceman is now gay, also the Joker is now some type of demon/ghost, and this is how Superman and Batman looks now.


dc-costumes-2.jpg


Plus this is only one universe (I think its the Ultimate Universe) in which Peter is replaced with Miles, a black/latino kid, as SpiderMan so in every other universe especially the Spectacular universe SpiderMan is still white/Peter Parker (although it was Spectacular universe in which Doc Ock was SpiderMan for a while and he wanted to be a much better SpiderMan than Peter but it didn't last long.....for obvious reasons and Peter somehow came back and is now SpiderMan). Both the Spectacular and Ultimate universe are running at the same time so we still have white Peter Parker.

If a black Spiderman bothers you, if changing a superheroes race/gender bothers you, if multiple versions of the same character bothers you, if you don't like drinking stale milk than you shouldn't be reading Marvel and DC comics. Gender bending, race bending, whatever are practically tropes in the American superhero comic book industry at this point.

My main gripe is not the fact Spiderman is now black but how they did it. It would've been better if they followed the Robin or Batman Beyond route of having Peter want to quit vigilantism and settle down and have a normal life so he can marry Mary Jane, Gwen Stacy, or whatever bitch he is giving the D to at the time. So he finds or ends up finding some kid of the streets with the drive and potential to one day be is successor and help raise him to be the next SpiderMan or defender of New York City. Not freaking kill him off and completely replace him with Miles.

EDIT:

They can also go the Robin/Supergirl route in which Miles is SpiderMan or SpiderMan's apprentice (SpiderBoy or SpiderLing) for a while and eventually branch off to become his own hero like Nightwing (first Robin), Red Hood (third Robin), and PowerGirl (Supergirl)....like Black Widow (shame that is already taken would've worked really well with Miles character and his current costume design).
 
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