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New gameplay and new weapon reveal

chocolatepanda said:
It was also halfway through the game and u had to play as him to finish the game so it wouldnt make sense to make u start from scratch halfway through the game.
How is it lazy? You have to earn the moves in any dmc game.
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So people like starting out with limited move sets? I know all dmc games start off with almost no moves but 3/4 of the DMC games were on the PS2 where video ram reduced move sets (but not total amount of weapons you can get). With next gen I expected this to change because more ram and more disc space = tons of moves, but this was not the case with DMC4 at least (except for Dante). Developers do this on purpose so they don't have to make a ton of moves and up the ante throughout the game. So they are cheating us out, which is why I don't understand people arguing against this point. "More moves in my game? No thanks!"
 
Dominus said:
So people like starting out with limited move sets? I know all dmc games start off with almost no moves but 3/4 of the DMC games were on the PS2 where video ram reduced move sets (but not total amount of weapons you can get). With next gen I expected this to change because more ram and more disc space = tons of moves, but this was not the case with DMC4 at least (except for Dante). Developers do this on purpose so they don't have to make a ton of moves and up the ante throughout the game. So they are cheating us out, which is why I don't understand people arguing against this point. "More moves in my game? No thanks!"
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There are tons of moves in the game, you just have to unlock them. Just like previous entries.
 
Devil trigger
Unleash Dante's true power.
Unleashed power will engulf the world into chaos, and will blast all enemies into the air.

During DT Dante has total domination. Make multi-aerial combos!
By attacking or earning purple orbs, the DT guage will be filled.
During activation, Dante's attacking abilies will be boosted and you can attack enemies within a dimension under control by Dante's inner power.
Click to expand...

I like how u can extend DT by attacking but i wonder if the current style rank gives a bigger boost to how much time each attack extends it by.
 
Dominus said:
So people like starting out with limited move sets? I know all dmc games start off with almost no moves but 3/4 of the DMC games were on the PS2 where video ram reduced move sets (but not total amount of weapons you can get). With next gen I expected this to change because more ram and more disc space = tons of moves, but this was not the case with DMC4 at least (except for Dante). Developers do this on purpose so they don't have to make a ton of moves and up the ante throughout the game. So they are cheating us out, which is why I don't understand people arguing against this point. "More moves in my game? No thanks!"
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That's not what he meant. Giving you tons of toys but no build for you to play with will ruin the game feel. Just because you start out with a limited palette doesn't make the illustration less interesting.

You are rewarded for mastering the ones you have now so you can master the next and so on. It's called pacing and this game wants to do it within the constraints of the storyline for the first play through.

This is how a game teaches the player without the need of a heavy tutorial.
 
Paexie said:
That's not what he meant. Giving you tons of toys but no build for you to play with will ruin the game feel. Just because you start out with a limited palette doesn't make the illustration less interesting.

You are rewarded for mastering the ones you have now so you can master the next and so on. It's called pacing and this game wants to do it within the constraints of the storyline for the first play through.

This is how a game teaches the player without the need of a heavy tutorial.
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I'm not saying it will not mean there is more variety later in the game. It's that they limit the moves so people feel there's more in the game than there is. DMC did this like I said and it made sense for the PS2 era, but if I start out with the same amount of moves in this game I will rage. And I don't see how starting out a game with plenty of moves or options will deter players from learning what the general combat concepts are. Dodge, attack, launch aren't that hard to learn off the bat Both GOW2 and GOW3 start you off with a complete move list for your blades and that didn't deter people from learning the combat (which you then lose). This isn't a strategy game where you need to be walked through every step, its an action game that seems pretty straight forward, especially when you don't have hard lock on style moves (and looks like directional moves don't exist either). This limited options start is an old development style that has been carried on to this generation (yeah!), and like DMC4 it shouldn't be repeated. But it will because its easier to take away moves than to add more moves. Its probably why I enjoy playing games like Civ4 that even at the start the variety feels overwhelming.
 
I wonder how we will receive the grappling hook/demon pull. I mean, it's quite obvious that we'll get it from this boss, but still. Maybe he just touches his corpse and it changes just like when he gets the Arbiter? Hah. Pretty obvious, I know, this is just me being too excited to play the game.
 
Dominus said:
I'm not saying it will not mean there is more variety later in the game. It's that they limit the moves so people feel there's more in the game than there is. DMC did this like I said and it made sense for the PS2 era, but if I start out with the same amount of moves in this game I will rage. And I don't see how starting out a game with plenty of moves or options will deter players from learning what the general combat concepts are. Dodge, attack, launch aren't that hard to learn off the bat Both GOW2 and GOW3 start you off with a complete move list for your blades and that didn't deter people from learning the combat (which you then lose). This isn't a strategy game where you need to be walked through every step, its an action game that seems pretty straight forward, especially when you don't have hard lock on style moves (and looks like directional moves don't exist either). It's an old development style that has been carried on to this generation (yeah!), and like DMC4 it shouldn't be repeated. But it will because its easier to take away moves than to add more moves.
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How are they taking away moves though? They are only limiting moves at the beginning, they're not taking any moves out.
 
Paexie said:
I wonder how we will receive the grappling hook/demon pull. I mean, it's quite obvious that we'll get it from this boss, but still. Maybe he just touches his corpse and it changes just like when he gets the Arbiter? Hah. Pretty obvious, I know, this is just me being too excited to play the game.
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Rebellion probably consumes the grappling hook in some way just like it consumed demonic energy for Arbiter.
 
Dominus said:
I'm not saying it will not mean there is more variety later in the game. It's that they limit the moves so people feel there's more in the game than there is. DMC did this like I said and it made sense for the PS2 era, but if I start out with the same amount of moves in this game I will rage. And I don't see how starting out a game with plenty of moves or options will deter players from learning what the general combat concepts are. Dodge, attack, launch aren't that hard to learn off the bat Both GOW2 and GOW3 start you off with a complete move list for your blades and that didn't deter people from learning the combat (which you then lose). This isn't a strategy game where you need to be walked through every step, its an action game that seems pretty straight forward, especially when you don't have hard lock on style moves (and looks like directional moves don't exist either). It's an old development style that has been carried on to this generation (yeah!), and like DMC4 it shouldn't be repeated. But it will because its easier to take away moves than to add more moves.
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You still had to learn moves by upgrading your blades in GOW games.

Anyway, you're in the minority who want almost all the moves to be unlocked early on. You want to get straight to the main course, skipping the appetizer. If you expect to be given plenty of moves early on in this game, you'll be sorely disappointed.
 
Dominus said:
I'm not saying it will not mean there is more variety later in the game. It's that they limit the moves so people feel there's more in the game than there is. DMC did this like I said and it made sense for the PS2 era, but if I start out with the same amount of moves in this game I will rage. And I don't see how starting out a game with plenty of moves or options will deter players from learning what the general combat concepts are. Dodge, attack, launch aren't that hard to learn off the bat Both GOW2 and GOW3 start you off with a complete move list for your blades and that didn't deter people from learning the combat (which you then lose). This isn't a strategy game where you need to be walked through every step, its an action game that seems pretty straight forward, especially when you don't have hard lock on style moves (and looks like directional moves don't exist either). This limited options start is an old development style that has been carried on to this generation (yeah!), and like DMC4 it shouldn't be repeated. But it will because its easier to take away moves than to add more moves. Its probably why I enjoy playing games like Civ4 that even at the start the variety feels overwhelming.
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Add that to actually balancing out the enemies for your current move sets. If it's built around with what it has, the game should flow fine. Try playing Hagane; billions of moves at your disposal but no learning curve to set you in = dying... a lot.
But if it was easy with all those moves = cheap and boring.
It's all about feel. So yeah, that's just what you'd prefer, but it may not be the angle this design would work in.
Also GOW isn't that heavy on the whole combo thing so that might not be the best example for this.

Remember, this game that wants new comers to get into combo reliant hack n' slash, not overwhelm them and possibly shun them from the complexity.
 
Paexie said:
I wonder how we will receive the grappling hook/demon pull. I mean, it's quite obvious that we'll get it from this boss, but still. Maybe he just touches his corpse and it changes just like when he gets the Arbiter? Hah. Pretty obvious, I know, this is just me being too excited to play the game.
Click to expand...

Ophion (Angel Lift) was gained simply from entering the "Secret Area" with the Blue Rose in Dante's home. The Hunter also makes a reappearance at the mansion, and probably gets himself killed there, and Dante takes his grappling hook for "Demon Pull."
 
TWOxACROSS said:
Ophion (Angel Lift) was gained simply from entering the "Secret Area" with the Blue Rose in Dante's home. The Hunter also makes a reappearance at the mansion, and probably gets himself killed there, and Dante takes his grappling hook for "Demon Pull."
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Oh yeah I forgot the Hunter appears at the mansion.
 
TWOxACROSS said:
Ophion (Angel Lift) was gained simply from entering the "Secret Area" with the Blue Rose in Dante's home. The Hunter also makes a reappearance at the mansion, and probably gets himself killed there, and Dante takes his grappling hook for "Demon Pull."
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You'll have a re-match with hunter? I always thought it was strange they were fighting indoors in the TGS exclusive gameplay demo...
 
CheeseKao said:
Wrong. You still had to learn moves by upgrading your blades in GOW.
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Not wrong, you had close to a full move set FOR THE BLADES in GOW2 when you start off as the God of War. In GOW3 you start off with your BLADE's full moveset from the previous game. Both games you lose those after the "first chaper", but my point was that you can have a robust moveset for a game and still learn the basics in the beginning.
CheeseKao said:
Anyway, you're in the minority who want almost all the moves to be unlocked early on. You want to get straight to the main course, skipping the appetizer. If you expect to be given plenty of moves early on in this game, you'll be sorely disappointed.
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A lot of you seem to miss the point. I'm not arguing for you to have the full moveset in the beginning. I'm arguing for a good amount of moves in the beginning that doesnt make you feel cheated like in a lot of action games (like DMC4). GOW was probably the worst because you lost all the moves for your blades after being teased with them. Like they could have offered those moves + a ton of others (but nope), or allowed your blades to be upgraded to a completely different style later. Like I said most developers take out moves in the beginning (that you could easily have) so they don't have to up the ante in the total amount of moves in the game or the variety of moves offered.
 
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