DmC Fair Criticism Thread

[Frazz]

Yeah, Snatch interrupts an enemy. But you would need to do that in midair in order to be safe, which requires jump cancelling (A mechanic in which Capcom probably still didn't test fully when playtesting it and not many people knew how to utilize in the beginning). You can do it on the ground all you can like but you'll eventually get hit by another enemy (unless you are multi-locking with Snatch). With the exploit that people found in DmC, you could do that by knocking an enemy in midair and do it without jump cancelling as many times as you'd like.
And if he's tired of responses like that then he shouldn't respond to them like that, otherwise his reputation will continue to get worse because of it. The least he can do is just completely ignore them.




First off, I'm not a pro player. I've been saying this for quite some time now.

I'm just decent when it comes to input execution.
It's why people think I'm extremely good because I pull off complex combos and maneuvers that require skill. In terms of dealing with multiple enemies while being stylish and smart, I'm sub par at best. You want pro players? Look at his1nightmare and brea.




The only reason why I say Demon Dodging is too easy is because the input window for you to do this is actually pretty huge. The fact I'm able to Demon Dodge almost any time I attempt to do it is just silly. I still even have problems using Nero's Table Hopper, which has a larger input frame window than Royal Guarding. And it's already sad enough that Demon dodging gives you a damage boost, granting an easy SSS.

In fact, I believe another problem lies with having the enemies telegraphs their attacks for a WHOLE second. Some enemies take even longer to execute their attacks. I definitely wouldn't be complaining if the enemies weren't always like:

"Oh, I'm gonna get ya. YOU BETTER MOVE OUT THE WAY NOW!!!!!"

As stated by Alarmhat: I never feel any sort of pressure, there's no fear of death.

Anyway, I still believe that Demon Dodge is too easy. Nothing is going to change that unless the devs change it themselves. And I know that DmC is different. But if it wants to stick to the core mechanics, it needs to be difficult at the least.




Well I'm sorry, but that's how the world works these days. A company/developer will receive bad reputation due to their actions. And I'm not asking the devs to completely change how they run things. All I am saying is that I'm tired of how Capcom/NT are treating the consumers as well as their practices to earn extra money. Especially with their DLC tactics. Do I think they are going to change the way they act? Most likely no, because at this point they are probably tired of their consumers act already. But it won't change the way I think about them unless they do something about it.[/quo
Edit: I misread the post

 

[Breaking8ad]

One thing that aggravates me is the extent people go to to hate. One guy said to me "boss healths are like 2/3 of the ones in DMC4" to which I promptly replied "in DmC you deplete the bar THREE TIMES SO THEREFORE IT IS MORE"

He then decided to block me...

Haters gonna hate

 

[TWOxACROSS]

My response to Alarmhat

Pretty good video. I left a comment to that you could probably annotate to the video - I leave it here, too.

"So he mentions how no enemies need a specific weapon, but I distinctly remember things like the Blood-goyles requiring gunshots in order to turned to stone and take damage from melee attacks. Likewise, Mephisto required gunfire (or Snatch) to remove their cloak.
While not exactly the same, it's in the same vain, so he's wrong about wrong about weapon-specific enemies :/"

Plus, it is rather funny to complain about "There's even cutscenes IN the combat!" and for you to then show off the exact same thing in DMC4 >_< And complaining about unskippable, five second cutscenes is really nitpicky, too.

Also complaining about this game having a greater emphasis on storytelling, and not just being straight action, when DmC was declared to be a more narrative-heavy game from the word go. You can be grumpy about longer cutscenes in a game, I don't really think you're allowed to fault the game for it - if you didn't want a game with longer cutscenes, you shouldn't have picked it up.

He should have done his homework first :/

 

[ChaserTech]

I've found 2 cutscene skips, puzzle skips and a boss cutscene glitch. But no sequence breaking, yet.

As the video states, this causes the second wave of enemies to not spawn at all. (I find this hilarious that this is possible)

I dunno man, I think you're falling into the problem of comparing DmC mechanics that vaguely resemble one in DMC, and you're getting too upset over their obvious differences.

It still doesn't change the fact that Demon Dodge still is easy to pull off.

Likewise, Mephisto required gunfire (or Snatch) to remove their cloak.

You could still damage them without having to do so. It's still not limiting you to a certain weapon. Even with Nero you can do the same.

Skip to 3:43

 

[TWOxACROSS]

As the video states, this causes the second wave of enemies to not spawn at all. (I find this hilarious that this is possible)

Well that's all fine and dandy if you don't want to play the game. Seriously, great for speedruns but why would you play an action game to specifically skip the action :/

It certainly is funny, and I can see a bit of how it was coded - both eyes disabled and kill the last enemy to open passage, and it's just an exploit. That's also a very small sequence break

It still doesn't change the fact that Demon Dodge still is easy to pull off.

Yeah, it's easier than Royal Guard, but not by much. It also has a timed bonus, unlike Royal Guard, which can be completely wasted if you don't utilize it correctly. So you're not a pro-level player, you're still up there when it comes to split-second inputs and timing.

You could still damage them without having to do so. It's still not limiting you to a certain weapon. Even with Nero you can do the same.

Skip to 3:43

I said they were in the same vain, not exactly the same.

 

[LeoXCV]

Pulling the cameras out early was one of the first things I tried. I was partly expecting the exits to unseal straight away but NT saw that coming (+1 for NT!) Apparently they didn't see waves being skipped though, (-1 for NT!)
You may say that makes them equal but with all the glitch hunters ripping the demo apart successfully I would say their in the negatives right now

 

[Breaking8ad]

I heard unicorns are in this game, that isnt exactly my cup of tea. Im partial to dinosaurs and baby tears eating time machines.

 

[8BitHero]

Pulling the cameras out early was one of the first things I tried. I was partly expecting the exits to unseal straight away but NT saw that coming (+1 for NT!) Apparently they didn't see waves being skipped though, (-1 for NT!)
You may say that makes them equal but with all the glitch hunters ripping the demo apart successfully I would say their in the negatives right now

It's good for speedrunning yeah. I know plenty of games that have so many skips like this and I've been looking for them in the demo(small ones). It's only a matter of time till we get something else.

 

[mrrandomlulz]

But my point/comparison to DmC and Spiderman is the same. Two new personalities compared to the previous games/films. Spiderman retains his powers, Dante retains his fighting skills. But everything else is different. I'm saying, you can compare them but this is supposed to be different with references to the previous games. This IS DMC but a different DMC. What I don't understand is why DmC is being crapped on but no other reboots? Tomb Raider looks like Uncharted and Spiderman was far too cocky.

I dunno if I would consider SF a reboot, but I'm someone who played 3s to no end(and still do despite online being empty) and absolutely LOVED SSFIV. Like DmC, the mechanics are there but easier for new players, it has a new graphic style and is a different story.

OBJECTION!
Spiderman is not a COMPLETE Do-over of his character, Sam Raimi's Spiderman was a complete do-over of the character,

but anyone who read the comics knows that Spiderman has always been cocky and arrogant like that.

 

[Dante Redgrave]

OBJECTION!
Spiderman is not a COMPLETE Do-over of his character, Sam Raimi's Spiderman was a complete do-over of the character

I'm not gonn'a say was Raimi's revision of Spidey was, since I know it has it's fans...but the Mark Webb reboot with Andrew was more true to the character and personality of Peter Parker, fully agreed...ANYWAY...

 

[8BitHero]

OBJECTION!
Spiderman is not a COMPLETE Do-over of his character, Sam Raimi's Spiderman was a complete do-over of the character,

but anyone who read the comics knows that Spiderman has always been cocky and arrogant like that.

I do read Spiderman. But this Spiderman was on the Deadpool level of cocky. Peter Parker was far from a little nerd that Spiderman is supposed to be. Also, Spiderman never dated Gwen Stacey so there's an error in the film, nor does she EVER find out Peter is Spiderman. Nor did she secretly tutor Flash Thompson. Also she dated Flash Thompson. She never worked in a science lab and lastly, she was far more "girl next door" than she was shown in the film. So it's all wrong error there. She's killed before they do anything.

 

[Dante Redgrave]

...you're thinking Felicia Hardy, not Gwen Stacey, and Yes, Peter IS that level of cocky, it's where the writers got teh idea for Wade after Rob Leifield was thrown out. Peter was going to propose to Gwen before she died in the comics. Also, consider the culture difference between the 1960s perception of nerd and the 21st century perception. They have changed. Andrew's Peter IS peter parker...right now to eye and hair color no less, which was actually kind'a creepy in a fangasm good way.

 

[neccowells]

Yes. I'm putting myself out there. I'm most likely going to get hated by both sides for this, but, whatever.

Anyway, to loosen up the tension in this room, allow me to put up a (very) politically incorrect video:

Did we all get the awkwardness out of our system (due to the fact that I replaced it with something even more awkward)? Good.

I'm going to point out only the criticisms in this game for two reasons:

1) For every negative point I come up with, someone else will come up with a counterargument for that point, thus saving me from doing twice the work.

2) We've already discussed the positive points repeatedly. This is just a gathering so that they can all be in one convenient place when coming up with counterarguments.

I would also like to point out that I'm not going to point out these negative points in any particular chronological order. I'm merely doing so from memory.

Dante's Hair:

No, not the color-- it's the fact that it's a fauxhawk. I dislike this hairstyle severely and when I saw it on Dante in E3 2011, I shook my head. I liked the 2010 style better. It looked like he cut it himself, which was the entire point. He's a man on the run, he's not going to have time to go to Supercuts along the way.

Seriously, I literally have to avert my gaze whenever I see this style on someone. Unless he's in line ahead of me, I have no reason to look.

To be fair, however, the 2010 look was also bad. But, that was the point. And I honestly didn't mind.

I got used to this hairstyle, however, because it looks good from the front and sides. So, two out of three ain't bad.

Dante's physique:

Yup, physical shallowness coming through, yet again. I thought it would make more sense to go with the 2010 look, seeing as how he was kept prisoner and interrogated as a child. But, fans didn't like it, so they decided to go with the Joe Sixpack look. It's as if Dante had time to go to the gym and a stylist. How convenient.

Once again, the starved look is terrible, but that was part of the storytelling element. Besides, he doesn't look like that anymore, so the point is moot.

I didn't know Dante had protein shakes in his trailer to along with his flat screen tv. Next.

30 frames-per-second:

For some reason, the "Beating a Dead Horse" picture wouldn't load into the post.

Let's talk about this for a second, shall we?

The Unreal 3 Engine was great for Batman: Arkham Asylum. However, that does not mean it's the best choice for every action game out there. Especially one that cannot perform "Limbo Effects" and keep up a steady 60 frames. While the PC version is 60 frames, that kind of technical wizardry really isn't available for consoles... especially not this late in development.

But then again, I honestly don't think any engine could. No, MT Frameworks would crash immediately under the strain -- at least U3 was able to chug along. However, since the game was built around 30 frames, it's not a problem, right? Well, yes and no. It's not a problem for most people, but it's always a problem for those who don't like forgiving "open windows" to perform "split-second dodges" and whatnot. It takes away that sense of challenge for them. Why do I mention the dodges and not guarding? Well...

No Royalguard:

No, the "Weapon Parry System" doesn't count. Especially since it was introduced all the way back in DMC1. It's like they're moving backwards when it comes to this mechanic. With Royalguard, you could launch multiple enemies with "Perfect Release". Not to mention it made you feel like a beast when you successfully parried all of Vergil's attacks in DMC3. In between"Ultimate Judgement Cut" and "Helm Breaker Chase", it served as an immense lifesaver when things got tough and you needed to find some way to deflect an enemy's attack.

No Hard Lock-On:

While I have seen videos of people working their way around this problem, I don't think it should be a problem to begin with. If there had been a proper lock-on, then people would be able to decide whether to attack the Fire Demon-thing or the Ice Demon-thing first -- and then be able to stay on that target without any problems at all.

Obscenely Large Hit-Boxes:

Because there's no hard lock-on, the hit boxes had to increase dramatically (in game terms) in size. As a result, the combat really isn't as tight as it was before. In the end, while this may prove to be a benefit for some (beginners and pros alike) it will most likely feel not as polished nor as responsive as it was in the previous DMC games.

Vergil's Hair:

Seriously, how much grease did Vergil put in his hair? He's just as bad as Dante, except:

There's a reason why my avi's hair is down. It's because it looks better that way. I made the argument that Dante's hair looks good at least on the front and sides -- Vergil has the opposite problem; it only looks good from the back. Which is ok, I guess, since that's all I'm going to see when playing as him. Whereas with Dante, unfortunately, I'm stuck looking at the 'hawk. CAW!

At least he's fast. :/

Vergil's Slacks:

Pinstriped Purple Pants (say that five times fast) with a frock: Yeah, I'm still getting used to that one. To be fair, I like the outfit when I saw it in the E3 2012 trailer, but that's because they showed it from the waist up! I didn't know he was wearing... that below the camera. That's why the they never zoomed out during the video -- people wouldn't have been taking his threats seriously anymore.

No Mask:

Seriously?? The coolest part of the game, and NT (reportedly) doesn't let us wear it during Vergil's Downfall. Weak.

No Revelation of Vergil's Original Design:

At the veeeeeery end of the TGS 2010 trailer, you saw something blue with a sliver of silver (again, five times fast).

Look! Up in the sky!! It's a etc...

I'm starting to think Vergil is a strange visitor from another planet...

Ninja Theory will most likely never reveal what they originally had in store for Vergil, which is a crying shame, because anything would have been better than those all-too-tight leather pants he wore that freely outlined his ring-a-ding-ding in DMC3.

I guess I can get used to whatever Vergil's outfit would look like in the TGS 2010 trailer as well, because NT obviously had originally made him a "part-of-the-one-percent" establishment bad guy who was working for Mundus and chasing Dante in the original take of 2010 DmC. With black hair, most likely.

But, due to fan backlash, they most likely changed the story to give the trailers themselves more mystery. While that may be a kind of a shame, it also may have made the story better in the end. But now we'll never know. They did this most likely because they wanted to space out the fan rage and knew that no matter what Vergil looked like, he would still get hate regardless.

Katana Length:

Whoo! All this talking about rings and tra-la-las and purple pants has got me all hot n' bothered. I do hope his blade is as long as Dante's (like it was in DMC3) because I'm going to compare sizes when they finally cross swords.

Hat:

That stupid hat. Please tell me he only wears it in that one cutscene. I can get used to the pants. I can get used to the 'hawk. I can even get used to the greasy hair. But I cannot get used to that hat.

Not even when used to cover said greasy hair.

Eryx Gauntlets:

Big, stupid flaming gloves but no big, stupid flaming greaves. Why does Dante only have one kicking move? The Angel Pull Kick doesn't count as a melee combo if it's just one hit. Which leads me to...

No Angel Mercury Winged Greaves for Vergil (so far):

You give Vergil all these cool moves for Yamato, but don't bother giving him at least one more weapon? I know the DLC's free, but first of all, it's not free for everyone -- and second, it should already be on the disc in the first place.

I can wait a few more months for the whole game if it meant not having to put up with downloads. I'm sorry, but I just cannot support DLC at all, in any form. I hated them when they called them "Expansion Packs" back then, and I certainly don't see any reason for them to exist in the first place.

Game content will always end up on the cutting room floor, even with DLC. If people can wait six years at a time for Zelda, then surely we can wait another few months for this, can't we?

I saw that Yamato now had the "Rising Sun" move. This will most likely mean that there won't be any reason to bring it over to the greaves, even if they do make an appearance.

And notice how Vergil was the only DLC? This is because if there was anything else, even the supporters would throw a fit. I don't think I'm alone when I say I absolutely want DLC to be erased from existence.

Even if the whole game was just a downloadable, I don't want to pay anything extra for anything else. Ever.

The Control Scheme:

I know some people think it's clever to change the entire setup by holding a shoulder button, but if the D-Pad is already being used to change weapons, then why not use that instead? This would allow the R2 and L2 buttons to be freed up for something else (don't worry, I wasn't going to say lock-on; I was going to say Twosome Time, which is not available in the game).

Edit:

Lack of Enemy Variety:

So far, most of what I've seen are the Silent Hill dolls, the Ice and Fire Demons, The Tank, and The Beast Creatures. I honestly think there should be more. A lot more.


Glitches, Bugs, and Game-Breakers:

This is probably the biggest concern on anyone's list. Even for the pro-fans. If this game has an overabundance of bugs like Enslaved did, then DmC is finished. Done. This is another very important reason as to why I think this game should be held back. Waiting is a pain, but it's worth it if the game doesn't break on you.

And that's my rant against DmC. I will still buy it, I will still support it, but the flaws are clearly there for everyone to see. Flaws that can be fixed when given more time.

Thank you.

Damn bro, you really thought all of that through. I agree with most of what you said. You've said too much to counter argue over(not in a bad way). I can tell your criticism is legit, unlike other people who hate the entire game for the simplest reasons. I respect what you've said, but next time please make it short and sweet.

 

[KenKen]

That stupid hat. Please tell me he only wears it in that one cutscene. I can get used to the pants. I can get used to the 'hawk. I can even get used to the greasy hair. But I cannot get used to that hat.

Not even when used to cover said greasy hair.

OH GOD.

YES.

A THOUSAND, THOUSAND TIMES YES.

I love this re-imagining of Vergil. I love the fact that he will be more human and we'll actually understand his motives.
But I hate that fedora.

Let him wear any other kind of hat. A flat cap or maybe a beanie, for instance. But the fedora looks douchey and dumb on him and it was the weirdest thing NT has done in this re-imagining so far.

Unless it was supposed to look horrible on him, in which case they are a flock of geniuses over there.

 

[TWOxACROSS]

OH GOD.

YES.

A THOUSAND, THOUSAND TIMES YES.

I love this re-imagining of Vergil. I love the fact that he will be more human and we'll actually understand his motives.
But I hate that fedora.

Let him wear any other kind of hat. A flat cap or maybe a beanie, for instance. But the fedora looks douchey and dumb on him and it was the weirdest thing NT has done in this re-imagining so far.

Unless it was supposed to look horrible on him, in which case they are a flock of geniuses over there.

Little have we seen the full scene where he wears it...

Dante - "Y'know...you look like a tool in that hat..."
Vergil - "I do...?"

 

[ChaserTech]

OH GOD.

YES.

A THOUSAND, THOUSAND TIMES YES.

I love this re-imagining of Vergil. I love the fact that he will be more human and we'll actually understand his motives.
But I hate that fedora.

Let him wear any other kind of hat. A flat cap or maybe a beanie, for instance. But the fedora looks douchey and dumb on him and it was the weirdest thing NT has done in this re-imagining so far.

Unless it was supposed to look horrible on him, in which case they are a flock of geniuses over there.

lol That hat looks wonky on him. I also don't like his collar for some reason. It needs to be like his DMC3 one. Kinda straight and whatnot.

 

[neccowells]

lol That hat looks wonky on him. I also don't like his collar for some reason. It needs to be like his DMC3 one. Kinda straight and whatnot.

Dante has the British Flag on one of his jacket sleeves, while Vergil has like a British Hat. NT wanted fans to know it wasn't the Americans nor the Japanese who made their Dante and Vergil, it was the British.

 

[Devilmaydie]

I personally think that dmc devil maycry is going to be good. The combat is awesome, it feels like dmc4 but it reminds me of the fun i had playing through DMC3. The idea of the story is awesome. And i dont care what dante looks lie. Tey brought back stinger, Trillion stab, Prop shredder, tons of my old favorite moves