DLC Ideas.........

[Gel]

We're digging to deep in those references. Kamiya just did that for the sake of fun.In those files he says too Cleopatra and Odete( a fictitious character from lake of swans) were witches too and we know that wasn't true, so...
Anyway, whatever Eva were to be in Kamiya's mind,she is no more.The story was retold and Kamiya himself said he doesn't want to be involved with DMC anymore.

 

[Kam]

We're digging to deep in those references. Kamiya just did that for the sake of fun.In those files he says too Cleopatra and Odete( a fictitious character from lake of swans) were witches too and we know that wasn't true, so...
Anyway, whatever Eva were to be in Kamiya's mind,she is no more.The story was retold and Kamiya himself said he doesn't want to be involved with DMC anymore.

it's not just for fun, it also made for a much more interesting story. Eva wasn't just some woman that birthed sparda's children and then got killed; she was a once powerful warrior that gave up her powers for the sake of humanity, and her reward for that was eternity in hell. Yes, this is all unofficial, but the fan theories and story suggestions I've seen so far are much less compelling than what is already hinted at by the title's creator.

 

[Sunaka Marién]

I'd just really want that thingy where you could re-watch all the cutscenes and enemy files. Srsly, why did they not make any enemy files??! I always loved those! I'd even pay for them, goddamnit! (;_; )
Apart from that, anything story related would be very welcome.
And a Suspenders!Dante costume. IT NEEDS TO BE DONE, OK?

it's not just for fun, it also made for a much more interesting story. Eva wasn't just some woman that birthed sparda's children and then got killed; she was a once powerful warrior that gave up her powers for the sake of humanity, and her reward for that was eternity in hell. Yes, this is all unofficial, but the fan theories and story suggestions I've seen so far are much less compelling than what is already hinted at by the title's creator.

So, are we also to assume that Bayonetta killed Dr. Eggman?:troll:
And in my opinion, it is much more compelling for Eva to have been just that, a simple woman that fell in love with a demon and gave her life so her sons could live.

 

[Stylish Nero]

in the bayo universe, witches have their power because they take out a contract with demons, and the contract obligates them to kill angels daily otherwise they lose their powers and the demons come to claim their souls. For a demon to kill a witch, all it would take is the demon lord who made the deal with that witch to void the contract, stripping that witch of all their powers. From that point on, they're an ordinary human.

The implication that Eva teamed up with Sparda to fight the demons is a pretty wild notion because it would have meant she'd become instantly helpless once the demons learned of her betrayal and revoked her powers. Or maybe she couldn't find the time to hunt and kill angels while defending humanity from the forces of hell? Either way, she's an ordinary human from then on.

She still could have supported sparda with alchemy and her ability to craft magical artifacts (in DMC it's never explained where all the alchemical items you use actually come from), but in a direct fight she'd be completely out of her league

But if Sparda was the demon Eva made a contract with then she should still have her powers by time the demons raided and I'm referring to fight back...she could've teleported away or something.

If only Sparda can revoke her powers then she wouldn't lose them too because well Sparda is.....

What alchemical items? You mean the sh*t Dante finds on his missions (well in Mallet Island). The only magical items Dante has with him are his sword and the amulet (which both belonged to his father).

Now your just contradicting yourself all for the sake of making something non-canon....canon.

 

[Gel]

Yes, it could be a compelling story if done right.But even Kamiya's ideas about Eva changed with time: in the first novel( non-canon for most of fans) , she died defenseless, as any human would do, in VJ she became an omnipresent potentia, strong enough to disturb Mundus plans and now she is described as an army of one woman.
While I've no problems about her had learnt somekind of arts or alchemy, it's the idea of omnipotence that more annoys me.
Suddently it seems to me that to be a simple human being is not enough to be badass ; funny enough all the story is about the virtues of being human, even a weak one. I'm not very pleased with the idea of Eva need to be a "goddesslike" to be Sparda's wife or even to impress him, so in this I agree with Sunaka.

 

[BLACKSWIPE]

But if Sparda was the demon Eva made a contract with then she should still have her powers by time the demons raided and I'm referring to fight back...she could've teleported away or something.

If only Sparda can revoke her powers then she wouldn't lose them too because well Sparda is.....

What alchemical items? You mean the sh*t Dante finds on his missions (well in Mallet Island). The only magical items Dante has with him are his sword and the amulet (which both belonged to his father).

Now your just contradicting yourself all for the sake of making something non-canon....canon.

By Alchemist items, I think he means by the weird 'crystallized angel wing', that you can find within Nero's story.

 

[Stylish Nero]

By Alchemist items, I think he means by the weird 'crystallized angel wing', that you can find within Nero's story.

But still that wasn't made by Eva, that item belonged to the Order of the Sword most likely.

My point still stands.

 

[Kam]

But if Sparda was the demon Eva made a contract with then she should still have her powers by time the demons raided and I'm referring to fight back...she could've teleported away or something.

If only Sparda can revoke her powers then she wouldn't lose them too because well Sparda is.....

What alchemical items? You mean the sh*t Dante finds on his missions (well in Mallet Island). The only magical items Dante has with him are his sword and the amulet (which both belonged to his father).

Now your just contradicting yourself all for the sake of making something non-canon....canon.

sparda was most likely not the demon she contracted with for her powers, kamiya implies that only the lord of hell (mundus, in the case of DMC) is capable of making such contracts. Her contract with sparda was most likely made later involving humans, and could not preserve her powers as a witch. As far as items go, items like healing crystals and devil stars are all described as "made using mysterious alchemy" and are found all over the place. in bayonetta you actually use this alchemy to create items that restore health and mana when consumed, only bayonetta crafts them into star shaped candy instead of star shaped crystals, because that's how she rolls.

And no, I'm not trying to make this canon. I've actually said several times now that this is unofficial since kamiya no longer owns devil may cry. All I'm doing is pointing out that his explanation so far does not conflict with any lore that was already established in devil may cry or bayonetta

 

[Stylish Nero]

sparda was most likely not the demon she contracted with for her powers, kamiya implies that only the lord of hell (mundus, in the case of DMC) is capable of making such contracts. Her contract with sparda was most likely made later involving humans, and could not preserve her powers as a witch. As far as items go, items like healing crystals and devil stars are all described as "made using mysterious alchemy" and in bayonetta you actually use this alchemy to create items that restore health and mana when consumed, only bayonetta crafts them into star shaped candy instead of star shaped crystals, because that's how she rolls.

Yeah is not like Eva whipped up a bunch of devil stars for Dante (and Vergil) before death and if any magical being could make them it doesn't indicate Eva made them or was a witch.

And I QUOTE "Eva, a truly extraordinary witch, entered into CONTRACT with a LEGENDARY DARK KNIGHT"

Now your just contradicting yourself.

 

[Kam]

Yeah is not like Eva whipped up a bunch of devil stars for Dante (and Vergil) before death and if any magical being could make them it doesn't indicate Eva made them or was a witch.

And I QUOTE "Eva, a truly extraordinary witch, entered into CONTRACT with a LEGENDARY DARK KNIGHT"

Now your just contradicting yourself.

It's never explained exactly what kind of contract Eva takes with Sparda. In all likelyhood, it was not mundus's soul binding witch powers contract. Calm down, there's no need to get angry about this; I'm just pointing out the open ended possibility, I'm not saying that this is absolutely what happened.

If you play bayonetta, alchemy is a very standard thing for a witch to learn, and it's the only thing Eva would still be able to do once mundus revoked her contract. It doesn't mean that the ones dante and vergil are finding were made by eva, just that eva probably made similar items for sparda to use while holding off the forces of hell and mundus singlehandedly.

 

[Stylish Nero]

Because it's completely impossible that the contract was about something else, the only possible contract they could have made was mundus's soul binding witch contract? Why are you getting so angry about this?

If you play bayonetta, alchemy is a very standard thing for a witch to learn, and it's the only thing Eva would still be able to do once mundus revoked her contract (the one that gives her her powers). It doesn't mean that the ones dante and vergil are finding were made by eva, just that eva probably made similar items for sparda to use while holding off the forces of mundus and hell essentially singlehandedly.

There's more than one type of contract. What exactly do you find so hard to believe about this?

I'm not mad since I'm

Its hard to believe because its bullsh*t. For one in DMC3 it was stated that Sparda met Eva AFTER he sealed away the demon world and kicked Mundus's ass.

Why are you so dead set on proving something that is literally false true? I mean it was stated that Eva made a contract with Sparda (or a dark knight) and nobody else and it even said she faced the amass armies of Inferno (hell) meaning she was able to fight against demons despite making contracts with them proving another one of your points wrong.

 

[Kam]

I'm not mad since I'm

Its hard to believe because its bullsh*t. For one in DMC3 it was stated that Sparda met Eva AFTER he sealed away the demon world and kicked Mundus's ass.

Why are you so dead set on proving something that is literally false true? I mean it was stated that Eva made a contract with Sparda (or a dark knight) and nobody else and it even said she faced the amass armies of Inferno (hell) meaning she was able to fight against demons despite making contracts with them proving another one of your points wrong.

For the fifth time, I'm not trying to prove this is true, or make it canon, or say this is the only explanation. I'm just trying to say that it was a possibility since there's nothing in the lore from either game that contradicts it, and it makes for an interesting story. It is also certainly possible that Eva was just an ordinary woman without anything special about her; sparda's timeline and eva are only ever vaguely described, so it's open to a lot of interpretation.


DMC3 never mentions a timeline for when sparda meets eva, and where that fits into him closing the demon gate. If you think it does say that explicitly anywhere, show me, because it's not in the opening for DMC3, vergil's opening in the SE, nywhere in any of the in-game character descriptions, the books, the wiki, or anywhere else I've looked before. There is absolutely no contradiction involving when sparda meets eva and when he seals the demon gate.

The description of Eva in bayonetta never says that her contract with sparda was her only one, nor was it the one for her powers. In fact the description seems to imply she was already "a truly extraordinary witch" before she contracted with sparda. It also never says that she used her witch powers to battle the forces of hell. In fact, let's completely disregard DMC and make this only a discussion about Eva in bayonetta's timeline. It would be completely canon for a witch that turns her powers against hell to be stripped of her powers. You must serve hell with those powers, or you lose them and demons come to kill you. There's no contradiction here, either.

Got anything else?

 

[Stylish Nero]

The description of Eva in bayonetta never says that her contract with sparda was her only one, nor was it the one for her powers. In fact the description seems to imply she was already "a truly extraordinary witch" before she contracted with sparda. It also never says that she used her witch powers to battle the forces of hell. In fact, let's completely disregard DMC and make this only a discussion about Eva in bayonetta's timeline. It would be completely canon for a witch that turns her powers against hell to be stripped of her powers. You must serve hell with those powers, or you lose them and demons come to kill you. There's no contradiction here, either.

Got anything else?

Ignoring everything else it did say she faced the forces of Inferno.

What did she faced them in? A game of cricket? Pip pip cheerio.

 

[Kam]

Ignoring everything else it did say she faced the forces of Inferno.

What did she faced them in? A game of cricket? Pip pip cheerio.

even without her powers she's a very accomplished alchemist. She could have provided supplies, even weapons and items to boost sparda's abilities. She might have even been able to take part in some fights herself by wearing some of her own augments or weapons. Even interpreting this description as a completely isolated story with no relation to devil may cry, it is almost certain that Eva lost her powers as a result of fighting against hell; going against hell and losing your witch powers is a canon aspect of bayonetta. We just don't know the specifics.

It was a war between humans and demons, so I'd have to assume there were ordinary mortals fighting the demons despite having no special powers. Sure the odds would have been pretty bad, but it doesn't mean they didn't at least participate. Even if eva had no powers or no ways to make herself stand out (no alchemy, no items, no weapons) I don't see it as unreasonable that she jumped in anyway. Maybe that character trait is what attracted sparda to her in the first place, and led to her bearing his sons?

 

[Stylish Nero]

even without her powers she's a very accomplished alchemist. She could have provided supplies, even weapons and items to boost sparda's abilities. She might have even been able to take part in some fights herself by wearing some of her own augments or weapons. Even interpreting this description as a completely isolated story with no relation to devil may cry, it is almost certain that Eva lost her powers as a result of fighting against hell; going against hell and losing your witch powers is a canon aspect of bayonetta. We just don't know the specifics.

It was a war between humans and demons, so I'd have to assume there were ordinary mortals fighting the demons despite having no special powers. Sure the odds would have been pretty bad, but it doesn't mean they didn't at least participate. Even if eva had no powers or no ways to make herself stand out (no alchemy, no items, no weapons) I don't see it as unreasonable that she jumped in anyway

This is getting no where. Regardless to what one game that is not related to DMC in anyway, no matter how much Kamiya/Bayonetta/DMC fans wants it to be, nothing from it can be taken as seriously (You know this no?) if the original series (DMC) isn't backing up such claims. DMC said Eva was a normal human that fell in love with Sparda and died protecting her son unless if stated otherwise it so be.

Plus this Eva could be another Eva...its not like there is only one Eva in the DMC/Bayonetta world. Next your going to tell me Luka once dated Trish, Sylvia (from Viewtiful Joe), Claire Redfield, and a dog and that DMC, Bayonetta, Resident Evil, Viewtiful Joe, and Okami all takes place in the same universe.

 

[Kam]

This is getting no where. Regardless to what one game that is not related to DMC in anyway, no matter how much Kamiya/Bayonetta/DMC fans wants it to be, nothing from it can be taken as seriously (You know this no?) if the original series (DMC) isn't backing up such claims. DMC said Eva was a normal human that fell in love with Sparda and died protecting her son unless if stated otherwise it so be.

Plus this Eva could be another Eva...its not like there is only one Eva in the DMC/Bayonetta world. Next your going to tell me Luka once dated Trish, Sylvia (from Viewtiful Joe), Claire Redfield, and a dog and that DMC, Bayonetta, Resident Evil, Viewtiful Joe, and Okami all takes place in the same universe.

you act like I haven't already said 5 times previously that this isn't canon; it's just one open ended explanation the title's original creator left for us for what might have happened. There is nothing contradicting it in either series.

A witch is a human, especially after they lose their powers. The timeline would fit, the descriptions work. There's nothing that says this one explanation is impossible

 

[Stylish Nero]

you act like I haven't already said 5 times previously that this isn't canon; it's just one open ended explanation the title's original creator left for us for what might have happened. There is nothing contradicting it in either series.

Point but why don't we come to a truce that I win because

 

[Kam]

Point but why don't we come to a truce that I win because

usually I have to go to 4chan to see this kind of posting

 

[Jak]

no no. don't stop. this is getting interesting

 

[mrrandomlulz]

I don't care if he is a costume or a new character, just make him playable


....
Me, Pinkie and Godot... we see there is some kind of flame war going on. We'll just report and move away.