Why judge this game on it's own merits? : An editorial by Mrrandomlulz

[mrrandomlulz]

Long time no see Devilmaycry.org.

Let's cut to the chase, in every defense, in every last argument.. There is always one sentence that bothers me.

"Don't compare this game to previous Devil May Cry's, think of it as it's own game", my question is why?

I get that when you judge this as it's own game, it looks great, but it's not its own franchise. When you make a reboot, your KEY GOAL is to live up to the standard the original set. Few remakes ever reach this goal (The only ones I can name are Al Pacino's Scarface and the Dark Knight trilogy), which is why they are often disliked. To judge them on their own merits. the source materials standards must have been met, and it must have had added ORIGINAL IDEAS added to make it stand out from the source material.

DmC only did the latter, this is very evident by the fact that people are using "Judge it by it's own merits" as a DEFENSE against people saying it didn't meet the standard. Even it's 'original' ideas, were all stolen from famous movies and such. Though to be fair, DMC3 did borrow a few elements from Inuyasha and DMC4 was a straight up "BLEACH FEATURING DANTE!" . But DMC3 was an original story with a couple of borrowed elements. DmC was a straight up "They Live" rip off.

Back to the point, if it never reached the standards of the original. Why should DMC fans judge it by it's own merits? That would be merely MASKING the disappointment at the fact that it didn't meet the original.
I have both series, and they both have a special place on my shelf, but can we please drop this argument?

 

[aoshi]

Yeah, I have said this before, the point of making sequels or making reference to predecessors is to expect the current product in somewhat same lines as predecessors. Else , it has to be a new franchise.

EDIT:Like DMC 1 was originally a resident evil game but devs were smart enough to identify it as a new game and gave us DMC 1.

Assassins creed was originally prince of persia. Both assassins creed and prince of persia are platforming-driven heavily, use a lot of parkour. AC could have been next prince of persia but it didn't.

 

[Chancey289]

DmC is not a "straight up They Live ripoff." Trust me, I've seen They Live unlike most people who always make that comparison. I'm a John Carpenter fan and a total cinephile. I have my copy of They Live sitting on my goddamn shelf next to my other John Carpenter films.

And I view DmC being the reboot it is knowing that the entire intention was to be different which I think the most people like totally forget here. But I do also compare it to its predecessors because I played all those games that came before and it was the past that got me in to this series in the first place all those years ago.

There are things that I think DMC does better but, DMC doesn't do everything better.

That's all I'm saying and way to buck the trend again Lolz. Wait until some people get in here and there's sure to be a party and a headache. I think you know who I may be referring to.

 

[TWOxACROSS]

Because ultimately a game is a singular experience. Take away the title and its franchisal heritage, you're still left with the entire game. It's also trying to be different from its predecessors, so comparing it to what it's trying to be different from is completely missing the point.

Game declared as being different from others of the franchise, people complain how it's not the same as others of the franchise.

 

[MephistoCarnival]

I usually take DMC and DmC separately since they differ on a lot of topics.
This doesn't mean I don't enjoy both.
I can enjoy DMC because they were the first ones I played and I liked them and DmC because it's also fun to play.
I have my disappointment on a certain topic when it comes to both,but OVERALL I don't whine on how much one sucks at a certain something.
As long as I enjoyed it and I had a pleasing gaming experience.I won't become a critic of gaming since their purpose was achieved,and that one is that made someone have a good time.
If you look upon only to negative aspects,you'll miss the positive ones.Like in life.

Now,personally,in a subjective manner,I distinguish them because I can't accomodate with the characters and gameplay that DMC used to have.So I prefer to think it's a different game.And in its essence it is,because it's a reboot,something relatively different from the originals.

 

[EvilX-81]

The setting is definitely "They Live". Alien/Demons controlling the human population through consumerism and information (did they also use food? Don't remember....) but all this can also be found on any far enough out there conspiracy website, and the game practically hits most of those notes. I don't really see what's wrong with taking the backdrop and saying "what if you put this in it instead?" And basically any backdrop that uses "unseen forces secretly ruling the world" is basically going to get the same realization as making a superhero that can fly move fast and is superstrong. It's still going to be a "ripoff" of Superman, even if it's concept is "'Superman' in Star Trek", or "'Superman' in Dungeons and Dragons."

Whether it *succeeded* in it's attempt it a totally different and better subject.

But I think it's good to judge them from both points of perspective. If one can't enjoy a game for it's own successful merits because it's "not as good as the original", GTFO with that snobbery. But it can and should be also judged against it's original. They're both legit POV's to evaluate.

 

[mrrandomlulz]

DmC is not a "straight up They Live ripoff." Trust me, I've seen They Live unlike most people who always make that comparison. I'm a John Carpenter fan and a total cinephile. I have my copy of They Live sitting on my goddamn shelf next to my other John Carpenter films.

I've seen it too

 

[DragonMaster2010]

Oh boy, it's this kind of thread again! I can't wait for the Inncarnatedemon vs Chancy 289 battle!

But seriously though, I treat both as the same but also treat both differently.

When I want to have a good time mixing different weapon's technical combos and styles while giving a different variety of attacks onto my enemies while looking stylish in the process, I play DMC (presumably DMC3 and DMC4),

but when I just want to have some good, ol' fasion hacking and slashing in the most sadistic and grusome way while looking cool and smacking the demons without mercy, I play DmC.

It all depends on the mood I'm in, but all in all I treat both as the same, but I consider DmC a series in its own because it's very different from the originals and as such I judge it on its own merit. I don't need to be told I can't see it as such because I call it how I see it.

Also "They Live" and DmC have nothing in common except a higher evil power ruling behind the scenes. If you honestly think the two are the same, you should really pay attention.

 

[Chancey289]

I've seen it too

Then why are you saying it's a straight up rip off of that cheesy sh!t?

I can see a lot more inspiration from other things than just They Live. 1984 freaking is one of the first things that came to mind to me.

 

[aoshi]

If one can't enjoy a game for it's own successful merits because it's "not as good as the original", GTFO with that snobbery.

Discrediting a product SOLELY by comparing to its predecessors is not valid. But we have to face the music of comparison to originals , cuz its a derivative of predecessor.

I found Evil Dead 2013 to be a very good movie. Horror movies are mainly special-effects,atmosphere,sound effects driven. Their purpose is to scare us. I watched the original evil dead and at times laughed at some of the places, jus cuz it wasn't scary. That naked lady dancing with head in her hands. Or when characters were cut-up, i could clearly see its artifical. Speeding through the woods effect. Lighting was not even close to actually feel deserted in the forest. All of this could be cuz i watched special-effects in latest movies and seen technology improved so much that gives a more engaging experience than some time back. So Evil dead 2013 really had great special-effects and atmosphere. The woods was scary. Music was awesome. At places, i could see the artificial effects but most part , experience was great. I would greatly disagree if original evil dead has atmosphere,special effects and sound better than current one cuz lets face it, technology was not developed as it is today , and current one used same atmosphere but was more amplified(thanks to technology).EDIT:And watever chemical they used for blood and puking.

Current thread is when anyone refuses to face the music when comparing a sequel to original and not discrediting a product SOLELY by comparing to the originals.

 

[EvilX-81]

Discrediting a product SOLELY by comparing to its predecessors is not valid. But we have to face the music of comparison to originals , cuz its a derivative of predecessor.

I found Evil Dead 2013 to be a very good movie. Horror movies are mainly special-effects,atmosphere,sound effects driven. Their purpose is to scare us. I watched the original evil dead and at times laughed at some of the places, jus cuz it wasn't scary. That naked lady dancing with head in her hands. Or when characters were cut-up, i could clearly see its artifical. Speeding through the woods effect. Lighting was not even close to actually feel deserted in the forest. All of this could be cuz i watched special-effects in latest movies and seen technology improved so much that gives a more engaging experience than some time back. So Evil dead 2013 really had great special-effects and atmosphere. The woods was scary. Music was awesome. At places, i could see the artificial effects but most part , experience was great. I would greatly disagree if original evil dead has atmosphere,special effects and sound better than current one cuz lets face it, technology was not developed as it is today , and current one used same atmosphere but was more amplified(thanks to technology).EDIT:And watever chemical they used for blood and puking.

Current thread is when anyone refuses to face the music when comparing a sequel to original and not discrediting a product SOLELY by comparing to the originals.

The tone of your post seems to be disagreeing with me, eventhough it's basically agreeing with me...? I'm confused.

 

[LysseC]

I usually take DMC and DmC separately since they differ on a lot of topics.
This doesn't mean I don't enjoy both.
I can enjoy DMC because they were the first ones I played and I liked them and DmC because it's also fun to play.
I have my disappointment on a certain topic when it comes to both,but OVERALL I don't whine on how much one sucks at a certain something.
As long as I enjoyed it and I had a pleasing gaming experience.I won't become a critic of gaming since their purpose was achieved,and that one is that made someone have a good time.
If you look upon only to negative aspects,you'll miss the positive ones.Like in life.

Now,personally,in a subjective manner,I distinguish them because I can't accomodate with the characters and gameplay that DMC used to have.So I prefer to think it's a different game.And in its essence it is,because it's a reboot,something relatively different from the originals.

I completely agree with you here. However, I can understand the complaints of those hardcore fans who were expecting an experience that was more similar to the original series.
What I don't understand is the attitude some people have that since in general the game was different from the originals, then it's a complete failure. that's why I say the game should be judged for its own merits.

It's not like any game which isn't a DMC is complete rubbish, as I'm sure all of us think. Problem with DmC is, since this game was meant to be a Devil May Cry installment, many people disliked the fact that it didn't meet the expectations they held for a Devil May Cry game; moreover, this degenarated into the well-known fight between DmC fans and DmC antis, and thus everything went downhill from that.....

Oh boy, it's this kind of thread again! I can't wait for the Inncarnatedemon vs Chancy 289 battle!

Lol'ed at that. (Still, I'm quite fond of you both, Incarnated and Chancey, no disrespect meant at none of you... ^^)

 

[IncarnatedDemon]

Did anone say my name? My demon senses were tiggling

 

[aoshi]

The tone of your post seems to be disagreeing with me, eventhough it's basically agreeing with me...? I'm confused.

When someone compares a sequel/reboot to original, they are not exactly "Snobs".

 

[DragonMaster2010]

Lol'ed at that. (Still, I'm quite fond of you both, Incarnated and Chancey, no disrespect meant at none of you... ^^)

I've got popcorn ready and everything for a flame to proceed.

 

[IncarnatedDemon]

I've got popcorn ready and everything for a flame to proceed.

What we watching? And pass the popcorn.

 

[EvilX-81]

When someone compares a sequel/reboot to original, they are not exactly "Snobs".

Nah dude. The second half of my post was about how both comparing to the original AND on it's own merits should be done, and that people who turn up their noses to a sequel game *solely* because it doesn't meet or surpass the originals are annoying as bawls.

Like say, for in-obvious comparison, Earth Defense Force 2017 and Earth Defense Force Insect Armageddon. Yes, EDF IA is an substantially inferior successor to 2017, and the game gets dogged left and right by 2017 players, but I never hear anyone mention all the things that IA did right or better than the predecessor.

And don't get me started with the first two Saints Row series versus latter two. Sweet Jaysus.

 

[DragonMaster2010]

What we watching? And pass the popcorn.

The way I see it either chancy's gonna go straight for the DMC4 sux kill, but Either you or Stylish Nero wil lretaliate with a wel lresearched counter that will no doubt inflame either me or TWOXACROSS and finally Alittleacorn will possibly change the discussion with something cute to which Loopy or LysseC or me will go along with.

That's my prodiction to this battle. But I don't want much spoilers.

*nums on popcorn*

 

[IncarnatedDemon]

The way I see it either chancy's gonna go straight for the DMC4 sux kill, but Either you or Stylish Nero wil lretaliate with a wel lresearched counter that will no doubt inflame either me or TWOXACROSS and finally Alittleacorn will possibly change the discussion with something cute to which Loopy or LysseC or me will go along with.

That's my prodiction to this battle. But I don't want much spoilers.

*nums on popcorn*

Wtf? Noone sent me a memo. I cant argue on such short notice.

 

[DragonMaster2010]

Wtf? Noone sent me a memo. I cant argue on such short notice.

Then sit there, eat this popcorn, and watch.