The only thing who can beat a son of Sparda is... another son of Sparda?

[Foxtrot94]

What do you think about that? Throughout the series we get to know (or it's implied) that:
1. Demons can only reach the full extent of their power by embracing humanity, and love.
2. Dante and Vergil both have human blood in their veins.
3. Sparda was the most powerful demon, and his sons, as such, would inherit his power.

Putting these 3 points together, the logical result is that Dante and Vergil will always potentially be more powerful than any demon (since point 1's effect is amplified by point 2 and 3), even Sparda himself, which was a pure devil. This seems to be backed up by the implication, in DMC1, that Dante surpasses Sparda's power. So, this means that the only being in the DMC universe which can match Dante's power is Vergil himself (if he embraced humanity, which he didn't). I hope I was clear and that you followed my reasoning. What are your thoughts about this?

 

[ef9dante_oSsshea]

By DMC2 dante has already.become more powerful than sparda, vergil is his only.possible.equal but he has been gone years.

Even if.vergil got revived he.ould.have had years less training.and less power.boosts , so dante would.walk through him.

I believe by DMC2 and more so SMT dante would annihalate.mundus without.the sparda sword.

 

[Foxtrot94]

By DMC2 dante has already.become more powerful than sparda, vergil is his only.possible.equal but he has been gone years.

Even if.vergil got revived he.ould.have had years less training.and less power.boosts , so dante would.walk through him.

I believe by DMC2 and more so SMT dante would annihalate.mundus without.the sparda sword.

You don't have to count the experience or the training. Cause if you get it to that point, Vergil in DMC3 was already more experienced than Dante in swordmanship. And with time, like Dante, his skills would have increased even more.
Of course it's only speculation to say what Vergil's abilities would have been at the time of DMC2's events if he didn't die at all. I mean, it's not unrealistic to say that he could have been able to beat Dante, IF he reached his full potential by embracing his human side.

So, just consider an ideal situation where Vergil didn't vanish, and he and Dante have the same amount of training, experience, and power boosts, as you say. The question is: given the 3 points I listed, is it safe to say that Vergil would be the only being in the universe to be able to beat Dante?

 

[ef9dante_oSsshea]

They would be equals , even in DMC3 vergil only.beatdante once.as he had unlocked his dt and powers, there second fight was a draw and the last fight dante beat him.

They can never truly surpass one another if there.the same power.One will win one time and the other the next time, so basically there the only ones capable of defeating each other yes.

I believe though that dante would always come out on top more.due to his humanity and emotions.

 

[DanteTheJester]

It's never safe to assume unless the makers of DMC said Dante's the pimp of the DMC verse.

Until they stop and have no intention of making more material, then we never know who they might introduce. And besides, humanity is a subjective thing. Anyone can embrace humanity. Sparda probably became so powerful because he discovered the human side to his own essence.

 

[Foxtrot94]

there the only ones capable of defeating each other yes.

That's the answer I was looking for. The point is not "Vergil vs Dante, who's stronger", cause of course there would be that "one time I beat you, next time you beat me" situation. The point is trying to understand if the only being capable of defeating Dante is his own twin, at the condition that he accepts his human side.

 

[ef9dante_oSsshea]

Pretty much , but if vergil stays the way he was he will always be behind.

Although if.they sid bring him back , i can see him fightimg.nero as he will only be around his DMC1 strength or a little less, Dante would destroy him.Nero though i think would be a good fight but vergil would.most likely take back yamato and win.

 

[Foxtrot94]

Pretty much , but if vergil stays the way he was he will always be behind.

Although if.they sid bring him back , i can see him fightimg.nero as he will only be around his DMC1 strength or a little less, Dante would destroy him.Nero though i think would be a good fight but vergil would.most likely take back yamato and win.

Well of course Vergil would need more power to battle Dante at this point in the timeline. And the only way he can gain all that power is embracing humanity. Something he would not exactly willing to do, that's the point.

Against Nero is another story. No contest, I'd say. Vergil's superior swordmaship aside (he can be considered the best swordman in the DMC universe, except Sparda, maybe) Nero's greatest advantage, his arm, proved to be extremely vulnerable to Yamato. Put these 2 things together and there you go, Nero gets bitchslapped

 

[ef9dante_oSsshea]

I reckon Dante is close to vergil in swordsmanship, if not he wouldn't have matched or beat him. Think of it this way when it was vergil using force edge dante beat him as he was better with a broadsword, but when there power was equal in the second fight vergil had yamato and it was a draw.

On that basis there sword skills are.even when using there trademark weapons. In DMC4 dante removes yamato and.does a few slashes and.a.dimension slash , then he puts yamato back in the sheath. You can barely see this even in slow mo wit pausing, so his speed is as high with yamato as vergils , it is just his technique isn't as good. It is kinda like how vergil isn't as good with a claymore sword as dante is.

 

[Foxtrot94]

I wouldn't say Dante is as fast as Vergil with Yamato. He's damn fast, but not as Vergil. Vergil was able to deliver several slashes to Beowulf while jumping on his head in less than half a second, and was able to swing his sword over his own head in even less time before striking the Hell Vanguard. He showed the same speed when he stabbed Arkham. On top of that, his technique is superior, like you said.
During their second fight, I rather think that it ended in a draw because Vergil used Beowulf first (with which he's probably not as good as with Yamato), giving Dante, who used his Rebellion, a slight advantage. Only towards the end of the fight he switched to Yamato again, but then he already got weakened.
And during their last fight, he was using Force Edge, which is a broadsword. And as you said, broadswords are Dante's specialty, so to speak.

 

[ef9dante_oSsshea]

All the same dant's speed with weapons is superior to vergils in DMC3 in DMC4 and by DMC2 he is way faster just look at his million stab in 4

 

[Foxtrot94]

All the same dant's speed with weapons is superior to vergils in DMC3 in DMC4 and by DMC2 he is way faster just look at his million stab in 4

The Million Stab? XD you look at Vergil's Rapid Slash. That move consists of lots of slashes executed in less than a second while moving towards. Compare Rapid Slash to Million Stab and see what arm is faster, Dante's or Vergil's.

 

[ef9dante_oSsshea]

Dante could have done.tht too if the game.developers wanted him to but he would have been too much like vergil then. Plus if vergil was so vastly.faster then dante then why is it he only beat him at the end of the first fight by using a disarm? if he was so much faster he should have taken him out in a second. And they were both tired in the second fight.and dante had.fouught multiple bosses by then so was probably.more.tired.

 

[DanteTheJester]

Dante could have done.tht too if the game.developers wanted him to but he would have been too much like vergil then. Plus if vergil was so vastly.faster then dante then why is it he only beat him at the end of the first fight by using a disarm? if he was so much faster he should have taken him out in a second. And they were both tired in the second fight.and dante had.fouught multiple bosses by then so was probably.more.tired.

There's degrees of speed. Not so much being THAT much faster. Just fast enough to surpass Dante's speed by specific degrees.

 

[ef9dante_oSsshea]

Maybe in DMC3 but in DMC4 dante has had growth in power.and speed and vergil is gone, so in a nutshell Dante continues to get faster and is faater than vergil by DMC4

Yamato has.a lot to do with verfils attack speed too , he is much slower.with rebellion im the arkham fight and witj force.edge in there last fight

 

[DanteTheJester]

Maybe in DMC3 but in DMC4 dante has had growth in power.and speed and vergil is gone, so in a nutshell Dante continues to get faster and is faater than vergil by DMC4

Yamato has.a lot to do with verfils attack speed too , he is much slower.with rebellion im the arkham fight and witj force.edge in there last fight

This is under the assumption that Vergil survived and is still training and getting stronger right?

 

[ef9dante_oSsshea]

Vergil is gone dude so we can only speculate what he might.be capable.of by the DMC2 era if he was still around.

 

[Foxtrot94]

Maybe in DMC3 but in DMC4 dante has had growth in power.and speed and vergil is gone, so in a nutshell Dante continues to get faster and is faater than vergil by DMC4

Yamato has.a lot to do with verfils attack speed too , he is much slower.with rebellion im the arkham fight and witj force.edge in there last fight

I already told you, Vergil is arguably less experienced and fast with weapons that are not Yamato, it's obvious. He chose Yamato as signature weapon, and he built his fighting style on that.
Fact is, Vergil with his signature weapon is faster than Dante with his signature weapon. And his techniques are superior. In fact, he only lost against Dante while not using Yamato: in the second fight he used Beowulf for most of the time, and in the final fight he used Force Edge.

 

[Foxtrot94]

Vergil is gone dude so we can only speculate what he might.be capable.of by the DMC2 era if he was still around.

That's true, so why were you comparing DMC3's Vergil with DMC4's Dante earlier? XD

 

[ef9dante_oSsshea]

regardless if he came.back he would only have the powee.he died with which is DMC1 nelo or a little less and if he fought Dante from DMC4 or DMC2 even with yamato and his speed he would still be mangled by dante.