The Fine Line of Change

[Demi-fiend]

I play DMC4 with default controls.

No calluses here, I can Star Rave, Lucifer Guard, and E&I Rave without many problems. If at all.

How do you do the "slide", then? Or do you do the "see-saw?"

Either way, when I do the "slide, the underside of my thumb hurts like hell afterwards and becomes all red.

I know about the "claw-grip" but it doesn't work quite as well as the slide.

I know a person who would put tape on their thumb, so that way it would slide without hurting.

Change a few names and voila new IP.

People would have just accused NT of ripping off DMC. Yes, it would have happened.

Edit:

I can't do the see-saw at all, so I've stopped trying.

 

[Terrutas]

We have a simple term for that. It's called "Thumb Acrobatics." :3

I slide with the lower part of my joint, and I understand why doing the see-saw can be hard, I had a hard time adjusting to it but I got it down. It's all a matter of determination.

 

[ChaserTech]

Learning to do JC alone is a achievement.

But once you've learned it the hard achievements should come which is what you described.

Uh...no offense but you aren't going to be doing much when you're just JCing one move over and over again. It's not much of a feat in terms of learning JCing. You're just learning the properties of one move as well as JCing it. However when you mix different moves together, you'll understand the properties of all of the attacks you use as well as being able to tie multiple attacks together correctly. That way, you are JCing "properly" without resorting to spamming one move over and over again.

You actually need to develop a callus on your right thumb if you want to JC on the default control scheme.

No calluses here. And I normally play games that require a lot of technical skill on a daily basis.

 

[VineBigBoss]

And I was...*counts on fingers*... 13. Good grief I'm old


You mean...we can't be friends? DAMN YOU SAUSAGE FINGERS OF INEPTITUDE!

No, you filthy casual! Get your hands made from genetic failure away from me, it disgusts me, ugh!

The only changes i make on the control scheme for DMC3 are DT in L2 and swaping shoot/gun change, i can't handle to hold lock-on, shoot (GL only), drive and DTE with the default controls.

 

[IncarnatedDemon]

Uh...no offense but you aren't going to be doing much when you're just JCing one move over and over again. It's not much of a feat in terms of learning JCing. You're just learning the properties of one move as well as JCing it. However when you mix different moves together, you'll understand the properties of all of the attacks you use as well as being able to tie multiple attacks together correctly. That way, you are JCing "properly" without resorting to spamming one move over and over again.

Learning it and mastering it is two different things.

Learn it: Be able to do it with relative ease
Master it: Mix it up with other moves

 

[Demi-fiend]

We have a simple term for that. It's called "Thumb Acrobatics." :3

I slide with the lower part of my joint, and I understand why doing the see-saw can be hard, I had a hard time adjusting to it but I got it down. It's all a matter of determination.

Wouldn't that burn though, with all the rubbing you're doing along the lower part of your joint? How do you prevent the pain and redness?

 

[Terrutas]

Wouldn't that burn though, with all the rubbing you're doing along the lower part of your joint? How do you prevent the pain and redness?

It never hurt, my hands are quite thick so it doesn't really bother me.

I guess you just get used to it.

 

[Demi-fiend]

It never hurt, my hands are quite thick so it doesn't really bother me.

I guess you just get used to it.

Looks like my dainty, feminine hands are just too sensitive.

 

[ChaserTech]

Learning it and mastering it is two different things.

Learn it: Be able to do it with relative ease
Master it: Mix it up with other moves

You're mastering it if you're able to Jump Cancel easily with other moves individually as well as being able to do it consistently with other moves. You aren't mastering JCing if you're doing it with one move. And switching in between weapons merely tests your timing in different situations. You're still learning how to JC when you mix it with different moves since you're relearning the different timings between weapon switching as well. The only way you know that you have mastered it is that if you are able to do it fairly consistently without messing up frequently.

​

If a person learns to JC Yamato Rave multiple times in succession, they are just learning how to JC one move. It is still considered to be learning how to JC but you aren't learning how to integrate it in your gameplay while using other moves. But if a person learns how to JC Yamato Rave, followed up by Lucifer and Pandora, they are learning how to JC more effectively because they are using different moves.

​

In the video above, I teach players how to integrate Jump Cancelling with multiple moves at a fairly slow pace in DMC4. Even if someone manages to master the combo that I taught them in the video (skip to 8:30) they aren't learning other elements of JCing with other moves that they haven't attempted to learn.​

 

[IncarnatedDemon]

^ Nice video.

 

[Terrutas]

^ Nice video.

Please read his post. The video is of little relevance.

 

[IncarnatedDemon]

Please read his post. The video is of little relevance.

I dont disagree with what he says.

I just think that when someone can JC consistently with all weapons then they have learned to JC.

But LEARNING and MASTERING

is two different thing.

And that is what Chaser seems to talk about. About Mastering JCing, and i agree with him.

 

[ChaserTech]

I dont disagree with what he says.

I just think that when someone can JC consistently with all weapons then they have learned to JC.

But LEARNING and MASTERING

is two different thing.

And that is what Chaser seems to talk about. About Mastering JCing, and i agree with him.

Uhhh, you kinda contradicted yourself.



What you've said a few posts ago.

Learning it and mastering it is two different things.

Learn it: Be able to do it with relative ease
Master it: Mix it up with other moves

What you've said now.

I just think that when someone can JC consistently with all weapons then they have learned to JC.

But LEARNING and MASTERING

is two different thing.

First, you said you're mastering JCing when you mix it up with different moves. Now you are saying that it's still considered learning? I'm confused.

 

[VineBigBoss]

Uhhh, you kinda contradicted yourself.



What you've said a few posts ago.



What you've said now.



First, you said you're mastering JCing when you mix it up with different moves. Now you are saying that it's still considered learning? I'm confused.

I think he's refering to the different timings for the different moves of the weapons, like: JCing a helm breaker has a very different timing compared to JCing a Killer Bee (i'm talking about DMC3 here, i do not have much experience on 4). And when you can use, let's say, 3 killer bee JCed followed up by a helm breaker JC and continue your combo from there is a signal that you're mastering that technique (that you once learned by practicing the timings individualy, which he is refering by "learning").

I think you both are saying quite the same thing.

 

[IncarnatedDemon]

Your getting on my nerve...

If someone can JC with all weapons and JC with 1 try with all weapons, then they have learned to JC.

But to master JCing is another thing. And you´ve mastered JCing.

I dont know how i can be clearer with this...

 

[MigsRZXAStylish]

*sigh* Man....I sure miss the days when people played games for fun.

Yeah; me too. Now they play games mostly for competition (to see who's the best player for one game) and to feed their over-obsession over one game like it's a religion, a dogma or even a way of life!

But in the end... every video game developed, regardless from what era, are just video games... -.-

 

[ChaserTech]

Yeah; me too. Now they play games mostly for competition (to see who's the best player for one game) and to feed their over-obsession over one game like it's a religion, a dogma or even a way of life!

If it's a one player game, some people just have inherited skill from playing other games and being good at them simply because they want to understand all the aspects about it (which makes the game fun for them). Which is why they seem "over obsessed" about it since they are playing a single game for a long time.

It's it is a multiplayer game, of course people will compete . . . because it is a multiplayer game.

 

[Domenic93]

How do you do the "slide", then? Or do you do the "see-saw?"

Either way, when I do the "slide, the underside of my thumb hurts like hell afterwards and becomes all red.

I know about the "claw-grip" but it doesn't work quite as well as the slide.

I know a person who would put tape on their thumb, so that way it would slide without hurting.



People would have just accused NT o ripping off DMC. Yes, it would have happened.

Edit:

I can't do the see-saw at all, so I've stopped trying.

they already ripped off God of War with Heavenly Sword, why stop there. and non of the reviewers call them out on it

 

[Demi-fiend]

they already ripped off God of War with Heavenly Sword, why stop there. and non of the reviewers call them out on it

You've read the ways I've said that DMC1 ripped off of other games, right?

I can post them later in PM, but not now.

However, even if I were to post them (yet again) you probably wouldn't agree with me anyway.

Before you claim that I'm biased -- I'm not a fan of either DMC series. I'm neutral now and am currently looking into other games.

 

[MigsRZXAStylish]

If it's a one player game, some people just have inherited skill from playing other games and being good at them simply because they want to understand all the aspects about it (which makes the game fun for them). Which is why they seem "over obsessed" about it since they are playing a single game for a long time.

It's it is a multiplayer game, of course people will compete . . . because it is a multiplayer game.

Question for that is:
How far can some gamers go with their over-obsession for gaming?
I ask this because I admit being a bit obsessive over gaming myself considering I've been playing games since I was a kid.