Kat Useless or Not

[TerrorA]

That's tight and outta sight.

 

[EllDawn]

On the topic of Lady, she seemed to be passionate, hotheaded, whatever you want to say until Dante beat her and told her she couldn't win. Then the next time you see her she's on the floor with her knees to her chest and her head on her knees. She really wasn't that strong a character. Physically, yes. In other ways, not really. She was gullible and a little too willing to give up.

To tie this in with whether or not she could defeat any of the boss demons, she'd have to have the strength of mind to do it. Everything was pretty much handed to her in the game with Dante clearing the way and inadvertently dropping Arkham at her feet. Physical strength could get her only so far. She'd have to have the heart and mind to keep fighting no matter what the odds. And that's what she seemed to lack.

 

[darkslayer13]

On the topic of Lady, she seemed to be passionate, hotheaded, whatever you want to say until Dante beat her and told her she couldn't win. Then the next time you see her she's on the floor with her knees to her chest and her head on her knees. She really wasn't that strong a character. Physically, yes. In other ways, not really. She was gullible and a little too willing to give up.

To tie this in with whether or not she could defeat any of the boss demons, she'd have to have the strength of mind to do it. Everything was pretty much handed to her in the game with Dante clearing the way and inadvertently dropping Arkham at her feet. Physical strength could get her only so far. She'd have to have the heart and mind to keep fighting no matter what the odds. And that's what she seemed to lack.

she seemed to be able to ignore physical pain and risk of death without problems. it's only when it became absolutely clear that she couldn't beat Dante and didn't have a reason to that she stopped fighting. demons she could beat with her level of ability and weapons would not beat her for psychological reasons, they would just die from a missile (or 50) to the face.

@ everybody for the last few pages: isn't this thread supposed to be about Kat. how did it turn into a discussion of Lady's power ( btw the answer is above the limit of what real humans can do, below the power of a Son of Sparda.)

 

[TWOxACROSS]

On the topic of Lady, she seemed to be passionate, hotheaded, whatever you want to say until Dante beat her and told her she couldn't win. Then the next time you see her she's on the floor with her knees to her chest and her head on her knees. She really wasn't that strong a character. Physically, yes. In other ways, not really. She was gullible and a little too willing to give up.

To tie this in with whether or not she could defeat any of the boss demons, she'd have to have the strength of mind to do it. Everything was pretty much handed to her in the game with Dante clearing the way and inadvertently dropping Arkham at her feet. Physical strength could get her only so far. She'd have to have the heart and mind to keep fighting no matter what the odds. And that's what she seemed to lack.

Yeah. It was some nice character development on her part. It's always nice to see when a determined character is really driven by that fire, because without it they would really lose nearly everything that they've become. Lady was driven to destroy Arkham, but in seeing how truly powerless she was to stop what was coming, she regressed to your average person. It had become such a big part of who she was that without her drive, without her conviction to kill her father, what was she? Dante's win over her was more than just a battle of strength, it was almost a battle of convictions, and upon her defeat, she had to find a way to completely change her way of thinking in order to keep going. It's that blind determination that did her no good - the "I'm the only one who can do this" which ultimately led to her having such an emotional breakdown. If she had accepted Dante's help earlier, and realized that he wasn't some evil guy, she might have been a bit better off. Of course, the rocky interactions she and Dante had were entertaining :3

But you're right EllDawn, it's hard for me to think of her as an insanely strong person when she'd been pretty much following after Dante for most of the game, passing through areas he's cleared, and even literally dropping Arkham at her feet >.< She didn't even stand a chance against Jester when siding with the (fatigued) Sons of Sparda :ermm:

 

[EllDawn]

she seemed to be able to ignore physical pain and risk of death without problems. it's only when it became absolutely clear that she couldn't beat Dante and didn't have a reason to that she stopped fighting. demons she could beat with her level of ability and weapons would not beat her for psychological reasons, they would just die from a missile (or 50) to the face.

@ everybody for the last few pages: isn't this thread supposed to be about Kat. how did it turn into a discussion of Lady's power ( btw the answer is above the limit of what real humans can do, below the power of a Son of Sparda.)

If I remember right (it's been a while since I played the game) there were things she could have at least helped with. If she fought with Dante until it came to going into the underworld then she would have at least not entirely given up. Then again if she had thought things through earlier she could have done that anyway.

And I don't get it either, how this became about Lady. Then again some keep comparing her and Kat.

Yeah. It was some nice character development on her part. It's always nice to see when a determined character is really driven by that fire, because without it they would really lose nearly everything that they've become. Lady was driven to destroy Arkham, but in seeing how truly powerless she was to stop what was coming, she regressed to your average person. It had become such a big part of who she was that without her drive, without her conviction to kill her father, what was she? Dante's win over her was more than just a battle of strength, it was almost a battle of convictions, and upon her defeat, she had to find a way to completely change her way of thinking in order to keep going. It's that blind determination that did her no good - the "I'm the only one who can do this" which ultimately led to her having such an emotional breakdown. If she had accepted Dante's help earlier, and realized that he wasn't some evil guy, she might have been a bit better off. Of course, the rocky interactions she and Dante had were entertaining :3

But you're right EllDawn, it's hard for me to think of her as an insanely strong person when she'd been pretty much following after Dante for most of the game, passing through areas he's cleared, and even literally dropping Arkham at her feet >_< She didn't even stand a chance against Jester when siding with the (fatigued) Sons of Sparda :ermm:

It's actually kind of annoying to me to see a character act so strong only to just give up when there's still something that could be done. I agree with you on the character development. And I did have fun with her meetings with Dante. If they fought together they might have still fought each other. They did seem to disagree on a lot.

I just thought of something. When she went after Vergil, wouldn't his actions have been enough to show her that she's not as strong as she thinks? He really didn't have to do much to push her down.

 

[TWOxACROSS]

I've always thought of it as going from fairly one-dimensional and getting more depth through learning that their determination isn't the be all end all of them.

When did Lady go after Vergil, though...?

 

[EllDawn]

I've always thought of it as going from fairly one-dimensional and getting more depth through learning that their determination isn't the be all end all of them.

When did Lady go after Vergil, though...?

It is more of a change for both Dante and Lady. Dante becomes more serious about what he's doing, and Lady learns she's been overcome by the idea of revenge. It's just too sudden for her.

After Arkham tells her Vergil was controlling him. She believed he was dying and had finally become her father again before he died. That's why she interfered with the second fight between Dante and Vergil.

 

[TWOxACROSS]

Ooooooooooh yeah.

 

[EvilX-81]

Saying Trish can't beat high leveled demons or demons above generic mook level because we haven't seen her fought any is saying that Trish is the same since she hasn't fought any either despite her being playable in DMC2 (and with her you can f*ck up Argosax/Despair Embodied far better than you can with Dante and Lucia)....granted she has the Sword of Sparda....but you must have Sparda's blood to be able to fully utilize it anyway.

I'm not saying she can fight demons as the ones Dante faces most of the times...well the important ones that is but I'm saying she isn't as WEAK as people claim she is or the fact that she can still overpower pretty strong demons granted she is at her weakest in DMC3 and is far more efficient and skilled in materials afterwards.

Yea, I wouldn't be above putting her and Trish on somewhat a similar level, considering that.

Trish seemed like a threat to Dante, though maybe a weak one at the end of the day, considering how he shrugged off her attacks both times. But she does manage that much. Lady was less than that in how she was depicted in DMC3, for as badass as she was. Lady in DMC3 is my gripe. Not whatever she could become later, but here.

Yea, she's pretty tough and strong.... for a human, which doesn't paint a good picture for humans in this universe if she is one of the tops, but that's not surprising, the point of the DMC stories is that humans suck combat-wise but have significance in other ways.

I'm not going to get into the gameplay thing since that's rather subjective. Playing by those rules, Lady could take down Cerberus after a gajillion shots and take strikes from Dante, eventhough she was laid low with a stab to the leg later from Arkham in story. Yea she got back up from it, but it underlines another thing she doesn't have; a healing factor (though like TxA mentioned, maybe a slight one since she seemed okay enough to fight Dante later). I can't see her getting past any of the guardians, not if she isn't even able to *phase* Dante, and she'd have to be perfect to get through most of those things to make up for the lack of durability or demonic-level healing factor. In any case, we can't say she couldn't take out the top level demons since she never meets any, but all we have to go by is being completely ineffective against Dante, and taking out low level mooks, which doesn't paint a high picture of her in this game, and ultimately led me to disappointment in how powerful Lady really was to the situation, despite being armed to the teeth, carrying a bazooka, willing to kill anything that gets in her way, doing crazy acrobatics, using explosions for extra propulsion.

 

[GF9000000Returns]

Useful, period!

 

[SugarMoon]

That was way more entertaining then I thought it would be.

 

[TWOxACROSS]

I liked the casual shotgun to the face for the kill at 0:42.

 

[V's patron]

On topic- in a fight she cant really defend herself outside of running away so in the field she's useless.

But then again we dont really know if humanity can stand a chance against demons without Dante's interference nor if she has offensive magicso its anyones guess.

 

[>>Yamato<<]

Kat is useful and useless. Sure she helps Dante out but she can't protect herself even though she stated "He tought me how to deal with demons literally and figuratively." She's helpless. She can help Dante out of limbo but even Dante can do that by himself. And Dante's sudden love interest in Kat gives me a headache to think she'll be the main female character instead of someone who actually HELPS Dante like Trish, Lady, or even Lucia in a way. With the new DmC coming in a couple years I'm seeing if they can make Kat a better character atleast in general or in personality. In conclusion... "Kat was useful but..."

 

[DisappointedSparda]

Kat is not useless. As a matter of fact she was vital to the missions and without her the Twins would've had a tough time not only in finding each other but getting to Mundus. Kat had an ability the Twins lacked and without her they would've been either imprisoned with Sparda somewhere to parts unknown or dead.

 

[Bazilican]

More useful then money grubbing Lady, and alpha bitch mode Trish.

 

[V's patron]

well look guys. the thing is there are other ways you can contribute in a fight outside of combat skills so just because Kat cant be on the front-lines like Dante doesnt mean she is useless.

you guys are confusing the question with "is Kat Defensless?".

 

[Loopy]

well look guys. the thing is there are other ways you can contribute in a fight outside of combat skills so just because Kat cant be on the front-lines like Dante doesnt mean she is useless.

you guys are confusing the question with "is Kat Defensless?".

Kat is able to help in a fight, but it's in a more indirect way. For example throwing that molotov at the hunter demon to weaken it for Dante's attacks.
She also creates markers for Dante to manipulate the world during the Order HQ raid.

Also, if it wasn't for Kat, Dante wouldn't have woken up and maybe that hunter demon would have killed him.

So she's not exactly useless.

 

[Demi-fiend]

Is that...a DMC4 skin for DMC3 Dante...?

Wish there was a DmC Dante mod for DMC3 Dante... the game would be perfect for me, then.

 

[LysseC]

Nope, not useless at all. You guys already explained why and how she makes herself useful in the story, so I just add this little bit: In terms of plot, Kat being captured and tortured is the sparkle that ignites the first conflict between the twins, becoming the first explicit revealing sign of Vergil's nature and way of thinking. This role is quite pivotal to the whole plot.
So no, she is not here just to serve as Dante's romantic interest, or eye candy for male players...