How Vergil can earn his own Devil Sword?

[Ronin]

The Rebellion being able to merge Devil Arm into the wielder is kinda wierd. We don't know if Dante can do it with another Devil Arm, if the Devil Sword Dante can still do this (since it's originally the Rebellion). I think DSD has been really poorly implemented (along with the Sin Devil trigger). There is no clear explanation of what the DSD can actually do beside summoning sword. And the fact that the Sparda had to be sacrificed to give a clunky new weapon is kinda disappointing.

And the DSD isn't like the Sparda. The DSD can be summoned at will, and we don't even know if someone else can wield it since Dante make it appear and disappear at will. The Sparda was physically always there, and anyone could wield it with enough strengh.

For Vergil, I won't mind giving the Yamato a new form, but he MUSN'T have the same treatment as Dante. The concept art posted by Ronin is really cool (not like the DSD which is meeh), but on how to give Vergil an improved Yamato... Maybe trough introspection and meditation he could actually bind his soul to the Yamato ? It would be a good way to end Vergil redemption arc, to have him at peace with himself and able to grasp the concept of the soul. But somehow, I feel it won't do because of what we saw in DMC 5... Because he haven't change so much after his resurection.

I hope next game he will get redemption for his actions: how he brought out Temen-ni-gru, the Qliphoth and for abandoning Nero & his mother behind.

His pursuit for power cost so many lives:

 

[Hungry Alien]

I hope next game he will get redemption for his actions: how he brought out Temen-ni-gru, the Qliphoth and for abandoning Nero & his mother behind.

His pursuit for power cost so many lives:

The problem with Vergil is that he is poorly handled in DMC 5, so starting a redemption arc will be hard to pull off right. The best way to do it imo is to do the Vergil DLC for DMC 5 with a Vergil campagn in hell and to have him and Dante think about what they've achieve. Maybe it would also cure Dante loss's of braincell too...

I think we first need to know what happened with Nero's mother (with a good story), and then have Vergil meet another person who could start his redemption arc. I think having an female demon having mixed feeling about humanity could do the trick, since Vergil would have someone with similar idee to discuss with (plus have Dante in the background giving good advice). I would not have Bingo write the scenario for it, he didn't do anything good for DMC 5, only fanservice and cluncky idee like Sin Devil Trigger or Devil Sword Dante.

 

[Foxtrot94]

And the fact that the Sparda had to be sacrificed to give a clunky new weapon is kinda disappointing.

Depends who you ask. For me, I rejoiced when that happened. First of all, I've always abhorred how Sparda looked, I just don't think it's a cool looking weapon at all and yes, I still consider it uglier than DSD, especially the "activated" version of DSD, where the blade opens up kinda like a scissor revealing it's lava-like core.

Second, functionally, DSD is ****ing awesome. The kind of mad combo extensions and enemy manipulation you can pull off with its SS feature is crazy and honestly it's one of the most satisfying weapons to use because of it. It's basically what Lucifer should have been, kinda.

 

[Hungry Alien]

Depends who you ask. For me, I rejoiced when that happened. First of all, I've always abhorred how Sparda looked, I just don't think it's a cool looking weapon at all and yes, I still consider it uglier than DSD, especially the "activated" version of DSD, where the blade opens up kinda like a scissor revealing it's lava-like core.

Second, functionally, DSD is ****ing awesome. The kind of mad combo extensions and enemy manipulation you can pull off with its SS feature is crazy and honestly it's one of the most satisfying weapons to use because of it. It's basically what Lucifer should have been, kinda.

I won't deny the combo potential of the DSD, but I have to say : for a sword presented as the culmination of Dante power, having only summoned swords feel disappointing, especially when you consider that Vergil already have this ability. But I can see how the sword can evolve into someone like what we saw in Babylon's Fall trailer

Or even beyond, like Dante being able to summons flying sword under his feet to "fly" or like a skateboard. Or others creations instead of sword. My only problems is that I feel like it doesn't define Dante and is just a robbery of Vergil gimick (but hey, everyone's been stealing Vergil gimmick since DMC 4).

 

[Carlos]

I think Vergil doesn't want to "upgrade" the Yamoto. He seems to fall in love with the sword, and make modifications to it like he did in DMC5 with the killing of Urizen.

 

[Hungry Alien]

I think Vergil doesn't want to "upgrade" the Yamoto. He seems to fall in love with the sword, and make modifications to it like he did in DMC5 with the killing of Urizen.

Urizen didn't really modified the Yamato, juste used it as a shield. And when I think about it... WTF where the scenarist thinking ? He got a sword that cut through dimension, let's just use it as a shield, and make it disappear at the last fight...

But I think Vergil would want to modify the Yamato after seeing the DSD from Dante. At the end of DMC, I think it is still safe to assume he still seek power (since he is the same as DMC 3 and doesn't mention anything about it). But when he saw Nero, he may have changed his mind about how to gain power.

 

[Carlos]

Urizen didn't really modified the Yamato, juste used it as a shield. And when I think about it... WTF where the scenarist thinking ? He got a sword that cut through dimension, let's just use it as a shield, and make it disappear at the last fight...

But I think Vergil would want to modify the Yamato after seeing the DSD from Dante. At the end of DMC, I think it is still safe to assume he still seek power (since he is the same as DMC 3 and doesn't mention anything about it). But when he saw Nero, he may have changed his mind about how to gain power.

What? Did you even play DMC5? Urizen was seen being absorbed into the sword. Urizen didn't disappear, it's in Yamato. The whole point of Vergil separating himself from Urizen was to change his attitude. Vergil already has DSD. Go back and play the last 2 missions starting with the battle with Urizen as Dante. We saw a little bit of the DSD from Vergil in the last battle, just not what it can do.

 

[Hungry Alien]

What? Did you even play DMC5? Urizen was seen being absorbed into the sword. Urizen didn't disappear, it's in Yamato. The whole point of Vergil separating himself from Urizen was to change his attitude. Vergil already has DSD. Go back and play the last 2 missions starting with the battle with Urizen as Dante. We saw a little bit of the DSD from Vergil in the last battle, just not what it can do.

??? Where did we saw Devil Sword Vergil (DSD stand for Devil Sword Dante btw, don't use it for Vergil) in the last fight ? When Vergil transform in SDT ? It isn't Devil Sword Vergil, as stated in the data file, just the Yamato who "fused" with Vergil or some bull**** like that (again thanks Bingo for another unexplained important thing). Vergil still use the Yamato in DT (it's easy to notice during Nero's Buster on DT Vergil)

And Urizen is Vergil dude. He is the embodiment of Vergil demonic nature. He disappear when V fused with him back into Vergil. He isn't in the Yamato or some wierd **** like that. He's gone, along with V.

You should really try to understand DMC story before posting. Because you obviously missed a lot of detail and made false conclusion.

 

[Carlos]

??? Where did we saw Devil Sword Vergil (DSD stand for Devil Sword Dante btw, don't use it for Vergil) in the last fight ? When Vergil transform in SDT ? It isn't Devil Sword Vergil, as stated in the data file, just the Yamato who "fused" with Vergil or some bullshit like that (again thanks Bingo for another unexplained important thing). Vergil still use the Yamato in DT (it's easy to notice during Nero's Buster on DT Vergil)

And Urizen is Vergil dude. He is the embodiment of Vergil demonic nature. He disappear when V fused with him back into Vergil. He isn't in the Yamato or some wierd **** like that. He's gone, along with V.

You should really try to understand DMC story before posting. Because you obviously missed a lot of detail and made false conclusion.

*closes eyes and looks at you* Are you trying to start an argument with me? Because you seem to have a problem with me. If you got a problem with me, best ignore my posts and get the **** of my way. If you don't, I'll start reporting your post(s) starting with this one. So, either you chill it, or discuss the topic without trying to be a dickhead about it.

First of all, you AGREE with me that Urizen is fused with Yamato with bolded. It's not Vergil, that Urizen merged with. IT'S YAMATO. The same way, that Rebellion merged with Sparda's sword to make Sin Devil Trigger for Dante.

Second of all, I know Urizen is Vergil, don't patronize me. He didn't merge into Vergil, IT'S IN YAMATO. His personality changed after getting Urizen. Pay attention to the scene. It didn't disappear into Vergil, but rather into YAMATO. Therefore, he has Sin Devil Trigger, which makes Yamato Devil Sword Vergil (DSV).

Third of all, don't dismiss my theory because you think you're better. I am not trying to make fake statements or any of your garbage diatribe.

 

[berto]

With the holidays upon us I don't have as much time as I'd like to read this whole thread and see what is going on so it will have to wait. Still, I will ask you all to stay civilized.
@Hungry Alien That was a very condescending post. Be respectful to others. There is no need to get that jeeringly patronizing.
@Carlos If you respond with equal disdain you are only adding to the fuel. Either ignore it or say your peace and slap them to your ignore list.
I don't have the time today to deal with this but I will get to it. Either I or someone else, but for the time being, respect one another.

 

[Carlos]

With the holidays upon us I don't have as much time as I'd like to read this whole thread and see what is going on so it will have to wait. Still, I will ask you all to stay civilized.
@Hungry Alien That was a very condescending post. Be respectful to others. There is no need to get that jeeringly patronizing.
@Carlos If you respond with equal disdain you are only adding to the fuel. Either ignore it or say your peace and slap them to your ignore list.
I don't have the time today to deal with this but I will get to it. Either I or someone else, but for the time being, respect one another.

That's basically what I said in another post, and he kept going at me. He did it with another member, straight up saying "Come at me bro." Like he wants arguments. I digress, I honestly want people to get it through their heads that I am not one for arguments, and I ask you to be civilized, and respectful. I haven't treated you like that, so like... chill. (I'm saying in general, not targeted at anyone, especially not you, @berto)

 

[Hungry Alien]

The "come at me bro" was a joke... It was a reference to Star Wars 7 since the message I answered was litterally "TRAITOR". I though the picture in the message made it clear.

And sorry if my post felt condescending, but when I see that Carlos post I was answering starts with "Did you even played DMC 5?", I kinda don't like it. And also, the way Carlos is trying to make me look like a toxic person by taking a joke out of context just because I disagree with him feel kinda wrong to me.

Also what is with me dismissing your theory because "I think I'm better" ? I just gave my opinion with facts to support it. Where did I established I'm better than anyone ?

 

[Carlos]

The "come at me bro" was a joke... It was a reference to Star Wars 7 since the message I answered was litterally "TRAITOR". I though the picture in the message made it clear.

And sorry if my post felt condescending, but when I see that Carlos post I was answering starts with "Did you even played DMC 5?", I kinda don't like it. And also, the way Carlos is trying to make me look like a toxic person by taking a joke out of context just because I disagree with him feel kinda wrong to me.

Also what is with me dismissing your theory because "I think I'm better" ? I just gave my opinion with facts to support it. Where did I established I'm better than anyone ?

Take the warning, @berto is a mod.

 

[Angel]

Oh for goodness sake, stahp it. It's almost Christmas and feathers are being unduly ruffled so let's not get personal and just chill.

I can see nothing of any issue worth reporting here, if anything there is something being lost in the translation as so often happens with the written word.

Let's get back on topic, the two of you can either ignore each other or just post as normal, and we'll have no more drama llamas.

Ta.

 

[Hungry Alien]

Well, I will ignore him from now on then. Kinda sad that it escalated so quickly for no reason.

 

[Carlos]

Well, I will ignore him from now on then. Kinda sad that it escalated so quickly for no reason.

That's a second mod who just told you to quit, so DO IT.

If you had just responded like this:

Well, yep, I disagree with some points. Vergil have until now being an antagonist and never a protagonist. But it doesn't mean that Vergil is evil. He don't do things to specifically harm others. He has a goal, and everything he does is a step toward it. Vergil is more of a neutral and misguided character. An evil character would be Mundus : when he kills Griffon out of disappointment, it was evil. There was no reason to kill one of his servant, but Mundus did it anyway. That's an evil character.

Also, yes Dante have empathy for Lady in DMC 3, but it come from a similar situation (disfonctional family), not her being a human. What Lady teached to Dante is the importance of family. At the end of DMC 3, Dante understand that family matters, while in the beginning, he doesn't care and doesn't even acknowledge his father when Vergil mentions him.

And Dante's actions in DMC 4 don't show him wanting to protect humans at all cost. IF so, he would have stopped the Savior before he escaped, destroyed the hell gates right away and joined efforts with Nero to push back the demons unleashed upon Fortuna. What he wanted was more likely to save Nero and give him a chance to save the one he loves, because Nero is part of his family and the son of Vergil.

And for Vergil at the end of DMC, I didn't saw him show empathy for humans. He questionned if he would have Dante's life if his mother saved him on the day of her death, but nothing more after that. He then only fight Dante, the Nero come, slap them both and Vergil give his book to Nero before going in hell to close the portal. He then proceed to have a sparring with Dante in hell since they can't come back. I don't see where he showed empathy for humans in here.

I wouldn't have had a problem with you, but you got off on the wrong foot by posting like this...

Dude I don't get what you're trying to say. Temen Ni Gru is a tower builded by demons during Sparda's time. Arkham clearly state that the Temen Ni Gru was a place where sacrifice were made and ritual were conducted by demons and their cultists. And the Devil Arms you get in DMC are the souls of the boss made into a weapon. Each boss is a demon, and most of the time not related to Sparda. Only in DMC 3 are the demons related to Sparda, and that's because he trapped them to guard the Temen Ni Gru for some (namely, Beowulf, Geryon and Doppelganger), and for the rest, he either made them submit and assigned them to guard the tower or the demons help Sparda in high regards, enough to willingly guard the tower for him (Agni and Rudra, Nevan, and probably Cerberus since he seems to respect strengh).

Also, Vergil isn't "evil" and Dante "good". That's just a very limited view. Both are in a grey area (like most character tbh). Vergil seek power, so he will never feel helpless like when his mother died and he was alone. And Dante is FAR from your average boring "good" guy. He doesn't give a **** about human lives if he isn't around to witness a threat. In Fortuna, he basically let the Order open the Hell Gate and cause a massacre in the city. He could have stopped them easily. Dante don't really do his job to help others. It's mostly because he enjoy it personally. Else he would be far more active as a demon hunter and far more responsible.

For the rest, you will need to explain youself in a clear way, because I can't understand anything you say.

You see the difference between the two posts? You were civil in the first example. But in the second example, you were so dismissive, so condescending, that I reported it.

Then you continue here:

??? Where did we saw Devil Sword Vergil (DSD stand for Devil Sword Dante btw, don't use it for Vergil) in the last fight ? When Vergil transform in SDT ? It isn't Devil Sword Vergil, as stated in the data file, just the Yamato who "fused" with Vergil or some bull**** like that (again thanks Bingo for another unexplained important thing). Vergil still use the Yamato in DT (it's easy to notice during Nero's Buster on DT Vergil)

And Urizen is Vergil dude. He is the embodiment of Vergil demonic nature. He disappear when V fused with him back into Vergil. He isn't in the Yamato or some wierd **** like that. He's gone, along with V.

You should really try to understand DMC story before posting. Because you obviously missed a lot of detail and made false conclusion.

I'm not stupid, so don't treat me like I am.

So, once again: Dial it back. Cool? Then chill it.

We can disagree, agree to disagree, or whatever... but what you did wasn't nice. You even went so far to being patronizing me.

 

[Angel]

@Carlos you really need to stop. You're actually being the antagonist here and it's not ok.

I don't want any more discussion about this because I was crystal clear the first time.

Carry on.

 

[Carlos]

@Carlos you really need to stop. You're actually being the antagonist here and it's not ok.

I don't want any more discussion about this because I was crystal clear the first time.

Carry on.

Oh, great, you're on his side. But I will go ahead and move on.

 

[Ronin]

What if Mundus' soul becomes Vergil's own Devil Sword? Once Mundus is defeated.