Can vergil be redeemed?

[darkdeamon92/dmc3/]

AS I'V SAID MANY TIMES OVER AND OVER HE ISN'T EVIL.......he just have been alot more than dante probably....but he just doesnt show it so it doesn't show as a weakness.... and as for the change.....i dont want him to change i want him to be understood ^_^

 

[V]

Arkham proposed himself to get rid of her. Vergil remained silent, like he was ignoring what Arkham told him.

Hmm. Well the dialogue does suggest Arkham takes initiative there, but then he finished that sentence with... "that is what you want" - as if the two of them had discussed before raising the tower that any strangers couldn't be allowed to interfere with their plan. I think it's fair to assume that Vergil researched Arkham's background thoroughly behind his back or he wouldn't have known who Lady was, or been quite so suspicious when Arkham didn't get rid of her properly. If I were him that's exactly what *I* would do to test Arkham's sincerity - see if he really did go down and kill his own daughter (later dialogue seems to imply that Arkham told Vergil he was happy to do anything to have Sparda's power brought back, including murder family members). I expect Vergil's silence in that scene was an indication of his distrust for Arkham, rather than ignoring him.

It's not like Vergil ordered the killing explicitly though, like you said... but he did expect it to be carried out if Arkham was faithful.

 

[D-Sparda]

Hmm. Well the dialogue does suggest Arkham takes initiative there, but then he finished that sentence with... "that is what you want" - as if the two of them had discussed before raising the tower that any strangers couldn't be allowed to interfere with their plan. I think it's fair to assume that Vergil researched Arkham's background thoroughly behind his back or he wouldn't have known who Lady was, or been quite so suspicious when Arkham didn't get rid of her properly. If I were him that's exactly what *I* would do to test Arkham's sincerity - see if he really did go down and kill his own daughter (later dialogue seems to imply that Arkham told Vergil he was happy to do anything to have Sparda's power brought back, including murder family members). I expect Vergil's silence in that scene was an indication of his distrust for Arkham, rather than ignoring him.

It's not like Vergil ordered the killing explicitly though, like you said... but he did expect it to be carried out if Arkham was faithful.

In this video(a badass one, if I may add), Vergil mentions some facts about Arkham, so it is true that he investigated the background of the bald and disgusting looking man.

Vergil could of kill Lady in the library, but like you said, she was more of way to find out where are the limits of Arkham's morality. In fact, she's was the one who tried to kill him first(technically), but Vergil walks away with no grudge against her.

 

[V]

Yea, rather than kill her the first time he chooses to mock her gullibility which makes her stop trying to fight him and think. That could be for any number of reasons, but does serve a couple of purposes - it shows that despite being a killing machine, he doesn't kill indiscriminately; and that he took the time/pleasure to hint at how much of a wretch her father really was, even in the middle of a serious fight. Evidently he never thought highly of Arkham, and none too hatefully of her.

I guess it's implied in the manga too that killing demons and humans that are weak is a waste of his time.

 

[ROCKMAN X]

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[D-Sparda]

Yea, rather than kill her the first time he chooses to mock her gullibility which makes her stop trying to fight him and think. That could be for any number of reasons, but does serve a couple of purposes - it shows that despite being a killing machine, he doesn't kill indiscriminately; and that he took the time/pleasure to hint at how much of a wretch her father really was, even in the middle of a serious fight. Evidently he never thought highly of Arkham, and none too hatefully of her.

I guess it's implied in the manga too that killing demons and humans that are weak is a waste of his time.

In the manga, he chopped the heads of some thugs with Yamato instead of giving them a severe beating because they stood in his way. I think they asked for it anyway.

 

[V]

In the manga, he chopped the heads of some thugs with Yamato instead of giving them a severe beating because they stood in his way. I think they asked for it anyway.

I thought someone would bring that up, as well as chopping the librarian up.

The thugs (although they couldn't really hurt him, let's face it) I can understand because they were asking for it. Not to mention they would be considered 'lowlives' anyway, even by normal humans, or parasites. I've a feeling Dante wouldn't have killed them, since he values humans more. In any case, those guys were predators upon other humans. Not so different from demons.

The librarian... hmm. Seemed a bit overly-vicious and unprovoked to me, and indeed, while the Special Edition of DMC3 seemed to lift the scene directly from the manga, they cut out the librarian and the killing. It seems the developers didn't want to make out that Vergil was this bloodthirsty either. It does seem to contradict his actions in the game which is to kill only those who could realistically get in his way/betray him.

 

[D-Sparda]

I thought someone would bring that up, as well as chopping the librarian up.

The thugs (although they couldn't really hurt him, let's face it) I can understand because they were asking for it. Not to mention they would be considered 'lowlives' anyway, even by normal humans, or parasites. I've a feeling Dante wouldn't have killed them, since he values humans more. In any case, those guys were predators upon other humans. Not so different from demons.

The librarian... hmm. Seemed a bit overly-vicious and unprovoked to me, and indeed, while the Special Edition of DMC3 seemed to lift the scene directly from the manga, they cut out the librarian and the killing. It seems the developers didn't want to make out that Vergil was this bloodthirsty either. It does seem to contradict his actions in the game which is to kill only those who could realistically get in his way/betray him.

There is also another contradiction surrounding the manga and the game.

In the manga, Vergil told Dante what he would done with their father's power, but in the game Dante asked Vergil what his going to do with all that power and Vergil doesn't respond. It seems like they never had this conversation in the first place.

 

[V]

(Incidentally, I did wonder if maybe the librarian was a demon of some kind. Arkham used them, or created illusions or whatever with them, such as "Rabi". And the librarian was wriggling about in a way that the thugs weren't. A pretty creepy way, I might add. Didn't look quite 'human' when dying either... who knows).

I guess they had to provide some indication of proper motivation for Vergil in the manga, since the point was to expand a bit on the game story; but you're right, it makes things jar. If you think of them as both true, then Dante's attitude doesn't add up in the game, since Vergil has already told him about his diabolical plan to rule the world and Dante doesn't seem to pay it much mind in the game, naturally because the game happened first. It's a more casual first meeting in the game than in the manga I'd say, which is a bit 'darker', as a lot of manga adaptations seem to be... so the 'explanation' is suitably dark, too, I suppose. But it would explain why Dante says it's perfectly justified in killing Vergil to stop him getting Sparda's power... more so than just a suspicion that it would corrupt him, or that he couldn't handle it, or that Sparda hadn't wanted it to be passed on.

 

[Vergil'sBitch]

I hope not.

*insert pervy laugh here*... me either *wink wink*

 

[Dante47]

Do you think that Nero is actually vergil in Devil may cry 4?

No. I think Nero is just possessed by Vergil.

 

[Lionheart]

About the question ''Is Nero actually Vergil in DMC4?'', I think he isn't. He gets help from part of Vergil's soul that was stored in Yamato. Nero heard Vergil's soul call out from Yamato ''From that day forth, my arm changed, and a voice echoed: Power. Give me more power!'' I don't think Vergil possesses him through his arm, since that doesn't make much sense. But then, it's Capcom we're talking about here.

I think Nero's DB arm is his own arm, as it's blue and red, which is Nero's color scheme. I think it has to do with Yamato only. Nero has a Devil Trigger that looks like a combination of his own and Vergil's: take a look at Nero's DT artwork (my avatar). It looks exactly like the blue apparition floating behind him. Add to that Vergil's blue color, and presto - you've got Nero's DT.

 

[ROCKMAN X]

About the question ''Is Nero actually Vergil in DMC4?'', I think he isn't. He gets help from part of Vergil's soul that was stored in Yamato. Nero heard Vergil's soul call out from Yamato ''From that day forth, my arm changed, and a voice echoed: Power. Give me more power!'' I don't think Vergil possesses him through his arm, since that doesn't make much sense. But then, it's Capcom we're talking about here.

I think Nero's DB arm is his own arm, as it's blue and red, which is Nero's color scheme. I think it has to do with Yamato only. Nero has a Devil Trigger that looks like a combination of his own and Vergil's: take a look at Nero's DT artwork (my avatar). It looks exactly like the blue apparition floating behind him. Add to that Vergil's blue color, and presto - you've got Nero's DT.

That doesn't make any sense to me since Nero was the one who repaired the broken yamato and as you know only way to repair sparda's devil arms you must "Possess his blood blah blah" how can vergil's soul reside in a broken yamato ?

And his DB's aura and his DT highly resembles the aura emitted by Nelo angelo so that means nero may have been a human who got possessed or became a random host to his soul

Can't resist myself i must say that nero looks like a Japanese cryboy IMO

 

[Lionheart]

That doesn't make any sense to me since Nero was the one who repaired the broken yamato and as you know only way to repair sparda's devil arms you must "Possess his blood blah blah" how can vergil's soul reside in a broken yamato ?

And his DB's aura and his DT highly resembles the aura emitted by Nelo angelo so that means nero may have been a human who got possessed or became a random host to his soul

Can't resist myself i must say that nero looks like a Japanese cryboy IMO

Well, Nero has Sparda's blood, so he's perfectly capable of restoring Yamato. It just took some DT power for it to work. The idea that a soul can reside in a weapon is also found in Japanese lore; Muramasa's sword was said to be evil like Muramasa himself.

I had noticed the color as well. I think it's just meant to show that Nero resembles Sparda, and that he's the modern day equivalent of him. Besides, it would look silly to make that aura red and blue instead of purple. Purple is red and blue combined, after all.

Symbolism is important in this game. Red and blue = Nero, Blue = Vergil, red = Dante. Sparda is all of them combined (purple).
Does this mean Nero has a part of Dante and Vergil in him (blue and red)? Possibly, but I don't see how that works. It would mean he could be an experiment instead of a descendant of Sparda. Maybe it was just a decision made by Capcom that fit Nero, since making the aura exclusively red or exclusively blue wouldn't seem right.

 

[ROCKMAN X]

Well, Nero has Sparda's blood, so he's perfectly capable of restoring Yamato. It just took some DT power for it to work. The idea that a soul can reside in a weapon is also found in Japanese lore; Muramasa's sword was said to be evil like Muramasa himself.

I had noticed the color as well. I think it's just meant to show that Nero resembles Sparda, and that he's the modern day equivalent of him. Besides, it would look silly to make that aura red and blue instead of purple. Purple is red and blue combined, after all.

Symbolism is important in this game. Red and blue = Nero, Blue = Vergil, red = Dante. Sparda is all of them combined (purple).
Does this mean Nero has a part of Dante and Vergil in him (blue and red)? Possibly, but I don't see how that works. It would mean he could be an experiment instead of a descendant of Sparda. Maybe it was just a decision made by Capcom that fit Nero, since making the aura exclusively red or exclusively blue wouldn't seem right.

Demonic eerie red color is just perfect purple just makes it look like a glowing light bulb i don't think color has anything to do with his lineage its just the dress code they choose

when its not glowing it actually looks more demonic

 

[Lionheart]

Demonic eerie red color is just perfect purple just makes it look like a glowing light bulb i don't think color has anything to do with his lineage its just the dress code they choose

when its not glowing it actually looks more demonic

In that picture, he's got a glove over his hand, and a sling covering his arm. Or does your last sentence have nothing to do with the picture?

The color is definitely a theme in the game series. There are blue demons (like the statues with the bows in DMC3), red demons (like the Lust demons in DMC3). Blue stands for the more demonic, emotionless side, and red stands for the human, emotional side. To refuse to acknowledge this seems a bit weird to me.

Even if they weren't red and blue, Dante and Vergil would still have different colors, as it illustrates the differences between them. Maybe black for Vergil and white for Dante (though white would look awful on him).

 

[ROCKMAN X]

In that picture, he's got a glove over his hand, and a sling covering his arm. Or does your last sentence have nothing to do with the picture?

The color is definitely a theme in the game series. There are blue demons (like the statues with the bows in DMC3), red demons (like the Lust demons in DMC3). Blue stands for the more demonic, emotionless side, and red stands for the human, emotional side. To refuse to acknowledge this seems a bit weird to me.

Well you're missing my point i just wanted to show you a picture in which he arm is not glowing it actually looks better when its more dark

Lol Red&purple always been the color of demonic representation blue more demonic ? tch....

 

[Lionheart]

Well you're missing my point i just wanted to show you a picture in which he arm is not glowing it actually looks better when its more dark

Lol Red&purple always been the color of demonic representation blue more demonic ? tch....

Well, alright, but that's your opinion.

Not sure what you're trying to say with that last sentence. In any case, Dante and Vergil don't have different colors simply because they chose to look like that. Do you think Sparda just chose to look purple? It's a reflection of what they look like when they're in their Devil Trigger forms, meaning that's what they look like organically. So no, it's not a wardrobe choice.

 

[ROCKMAN X]

Well, alright, but that's your opinion.

Not sure what you're trying to say with that last sentence. In any case, Dante and Vergil don't have different colors simply because they chose to look like that. Do you think Sparda just chose to look purple? It's a reflection of what they look like when they're in their Devil Trigger forms, meaning that's what they look like organically. So no, it's not a wardrobe choice.

Then why is vergil not blue when he's in Nelo angleo DT ?? because he's in his true demonic form

Why is Dante not red in his Majin DT ?? because he's also in his true form which resembles sparda

and the color thingy its just err fan-fic nothing to do with the game really

Color is just meant to differentiate them that's all about it it doesn't matter if they look a little bit different they're all in the same lineage of sparda

I meant to say that NERO'S ARM LOOKS MORE DEMONIC WHEN ITS NOT GLOWING LIKE A LIGHT BULB hope now that's clear to you and i don't get how nero being vergil's son and vergil's soul in yamato fits together it should be either one of them

 

[Lionheart]

Then why is vergil not blue when he's in Nelo angleo DT ?? because he's in his true demonic form

Why is Dante not red in his Majin DT ?? because he's also in his true form which resembles sparda

and the color thingy its just err fan-fic nothing to do with the game really

Color is just meant to differentiate them that's all about it it doesn't matter if they look a little bit different they're all in the same lineage of sparda

I meant to say that NERO'S ARM LOOKS MORE DEMONIC WHEN ITS NOT GLOWING LIKE A LIGHT BULB hope now that's clear to you and i don't get how nero being vergil's son and vergil's soul in yamato fits together it should be either one of them

In Majin form, he has a purple aura (DMC2).
Nero Angelo also has a distinctive blue aura, and he wears armor. Nero Angelo is not Vergil's true demonic form, so I don't know where you got that from.

It's pretty logical, really. When Dante and Vergil are in those forms, they're not quite themselves. Dante corrupts his body when he's almost dead, and Vergil's body is corrupted by Mundus - that's why they look black, but do have an aura. Actually, the Majin form body looks a bit purple.

Did I say something about Nero being Vergil's son? No. I don't believe Nero to be Vergil OR Vergil's son. I think he's related to Dante and Vergil, OR he's an experiment created by use of Dante and Vergil's blood.

Still think color has no symbolic meaning whatsoever?