Any christian's comments on this?

[aka958]

That actually brings yet another question. Didn't Eve eat from apples on that tree of whatever it was when god told that Adam and Eve should not?
Wasn't those apples the fruit of knowledge? Was god trying to supress humans from intelligence and knowledge according to the bible?

Sin has always existed though. It's just another word for actions that displeases the majority of people in the world. Sin can't be created, it's just there as a consequence of free will. Ever since man has come to existence, sin has always been there.

But according to the bible Adam and Eve were the two first humans in the world, their sons being Kain and Abel, who got into a feud, were forced apart from god, went their own paths, found other women out of nowhere with no explanation and started settlements. But that is the newest translations I've read though, maybe the older ones had an explanation.

 

[V]

I'm wondering though, what made you think I were trying to "move" christians?

Because rather than the discussion beginning with a statement like "I'm interested to know Christian members' thoughts on various aspects of their religion", it starts with an article that is firstly and essentially hostile to their views, and doesn't give room for them. I see that with this topic you're trying to make room for them, but really it's like asking someone who feels strongly about a subject to come in and justify it rather than discuss. It starts the discussion off on a slightly belligerent and challenging foot, and this is usually how non-Christians start attacking Christians elsewhere on the internet that I've seen, or trying to convince them that their faith is dumb.

That is, the article, does... not you of course. I can see it's as valid a discussion topic as any - I'm just surprised you posted it here.

What you're going to get in response as well is personal interpretations of the questions, but no tangible facts, so it's not really an argument that can go anywhere. =/

 

[aka958]

Because rather than the discussion beginning with a statement like "I'm interested to know Christian members' thoughts on various aspects of their religion", it starts with an article that is firstly and essentially hostile to their views, and doesn't give room for them. I see that with this topic you're trying to make room for them, but really it's like asking someone who feels strongly about a subject to come in and justify it rather than discuss. It starts the discussion off on a slightly belligerent and challenging foot, and this is usually how non-Christians start attacking Christians elsewhere on the internet that I've seen, or trying to convince them that their faith is dumb.

That is, the article, does... not you of course. I can see it's as valid a discussion topic as any - I'm just surprised you posted it here.

What you're going to get in response as well is personal interpretations of the questions, but no tangible facts, so it's not really an argument that can go anywhere. =/

I saw the article, I couldn't agree more to it for the most part. Then I wondered, how do christians think? What is their logic based on? What is their explanation? I don't really care about disproving anyone, I just want to know how christians, which the article is about, thinks about it. And no, I don't want to read a short comment like Meg's. That won't help me think any better towards christians. Clair is a prime example of a nice argument and what I want, her opinion and view on the things stated.

As a person I want to learn how other people think or else I'll judge their ways and I could judge wrong. To understand other people's view on things has been one of my primary goals since I was a kid.

 

[V]

Kudos.

 

[Dante's Stalker]

That actually brings yet another question. Didn't Eve eat from apples on that tree of whatever it was when god told that Adam and Eve should not?

Yep, that's right.

Wasn't those apples the fruit of knowledge?

Yep, it was the fruit from the tree of knowledge.

Was god trying to supress humans from intelligence and knowledge according to the bible?

I doubt humans were entirely stupid so they didn't need to eat from that tree to gain 'knowledge'. I interpret that story as, humans already had knowledge and intellect - before Adam and Eve ate from the tree, they were given the responsibility to name the animals of the earth. You can't do something like that if you don't have brains to think with. What happened is that when they ate from the tree, they realised their mistake for disobeying God, and realised that they'd been tricked. There is no evil or bad in heaven/paradise/Eden, and this is the knowledge they gained when eating from the tree God specifically told them not to. I guess God would have let it slide but there was also another tree, the tree of eternal life, which humans were forbidden to eat from as well. They disobeyed Him once so He gave them the boot before they could REALLY go awol.

Sin has always existed though. It's just another word for actions that displeases the majority of people in the world.

Sin came into being when Lucifer disobeyed God. Sin is basically anything that goes against the will of God. It's not another word for things that make most of the people in this world see red, because sin specifically pertains to religion. For example, for me it is a really big sin to use/listen to others use the Lord's name in vain. It's slander. But a friend of mine, who has a different religion than I do, doesn't see it as a sin because in her religion, they are encouraged to use the name of the Lord as often as they can.

Sin can't be created, it's just there as a consequence of free will. Ever since man has come to existence, sin has always been there.

But according to the bible Adam and Eve were the two first humans in the world, their sons being Kain and Abel, who got into a feud, were forced apart from god, went their own paths, found other women out of nowhere with no explanation and started settlements. But that is the newest translations I've read though, maybe the older ones had an explanation.

Yeah, that's pretty much accurate. But look, the focus is on Adam and Eve because they are the ones who set the ball rolling. It wasn't someone else who ate from the tree, it was Eve. Of course they couldn't have been the only people around. God created many animals of each species, logically He would have created more than just a couple of people to reproduce and populate the earth, but the focus is specifically aimed on these two because of their actions and the consequences mankind now bears for those actions.

Anyway, I thought I'd give you the benefit of the doubt with this topic aka. I thought it was coming off as a bit 'in your face Christian suckers!' too, but then most discussions like this have that quality and I think it's just the way you look at it and what mindset you have going into a discussion like it. For the most part Christians won't get involved with these discussions/debates because they either feel like their being bated or they go in guns blazing without considering that the other person might have a genuine interest and curiosity. And for the record, I've had a lot more positive discussions with atheists and other religious followers, that made me come out stronger in my faith afterward and more sure of my religion, than I have with my fellow Christians. Everyone who is a Christian has their own set of beliefs, whatnot with the different denominations there are out there. I'm protestant, but I recon if I voiced half the stuff I believe is right, I'd get a few odd looks and head shakes from my peers.

 

[aka958]

Anyway, I thought I'd give you the benefit of the doubt with this topic aka. I thought it was coming off as a bit 'in your face Christian suckers!' too, but then most discussions like this have that quality and I think it's just the way you look at it and what mindset you have going into a discussion like it. For the most part Christians won't get involved with these discussions/debates because they either feel like their being bated or they go in guns blazing without considering that the other person might have a genuine interest and curiosity. And for the record, I've had a lot more positive discussions with atheists and other religious followers, that made me come out stronger in my faith afterward and more sure of my religion, than I have with my fellow Christians. Everyone who is a Christian has their own set of beliefs, whatnot with the different denominations there are out there. I'm protestant, but I recon if I voiced half the stuff I believe is right, I'd get a few odd looks and head shakes from my peers.

Well... how should I approach it then? If I want to know then I ask. Curisosity drives me as well. If I want to see a christians view on things on these arguments I ask for them. I did not put anything offensive in the actual topic, I just asked for an opinion. If people are to doubt my ways it is their own fault and not mine. I expressed this in a kindly manner, to be claimed trying to argue just makes me confused. How should I've asked for your opinion on things like these? The only thing lower than just asking nicely is begging. I won't beg for hearing the words of others.

Did you find my last approaches offensive as well? They were just mere questions that I needed an answer for. I have yet to actually counter or argue on any of your points or perspectives. Send me a pm if you think that I did and explain how so I can avoid it in future conversations.

I've got my questions answered though. This topic serves no more purpose.

 

[Dark Drakan]

Closed at thread creators request.