TWOxACROSS
Hot-blooded God of Guns
Let's lay it all out there. I think Dante's control scheme, as it is now (of DMC4), is old and busted. My point here is that I would hope that in DMC5 they finally update Dante's controls to be more updated and in line with the other characters.
Consider, when you start DMC4, you play several hours as a brand new character with a fairly logical control scheme, where combos are all on the same button (what a revelation!); Square is everything for your gun; and O is your Devil Bringer for grabs, pulls, and grapple-based specials. It's all very streamlined and intuitive - this is your button for this kind of ability: sword, gun, or demon arm, complete with proper inputs for special moves that use those elements of our character. Then we transfer to Dante, whose control scheme hearkens back to DMC3 and the use of Styles.
Suddenly, after several hours of jamming on Triangle for all my sword combo needs on the ground and in the air, I'm accidentally pulling out Helm Breakers, because Dante's Aerial Rave requires me to be in the proper Style and press a completely different button. If I want to do a rapid-fire Honeycomb, I have to mash O. It all leads back to O. Obviously the argument is "Wull, it makes sense once you get used to it," which is true. Of course I'll figure that some special abilities are tied to the Style button, but that doesn't make it intuitive. Like...at all. It's an archaic design, and one I hope Dante will explicitly move away from because it's just really dumb.
Disregarding the lack of improvement in controls to Dante in DMC4, the two most recent games carried with them some of the most intuitively designed control schemes with Nero and m!Dante. DmC reorganized a lot of the control scheme to be much more flexible, but even then it lacked a few inputs that could have added even more depth and abilities, primarily, things that we were given with Nero in DMC4, like back-to-forward inputs, and both Triangle+O and Square+X inputs, even combinations of those with R1 and directions. I'm not saying that DMC5's Dante should adhere to a DmC-oriented design, but the fact of the matter is that DmC's entire control scheme was another version of the already updated controls we had with Nero.
There is absolutely no reason for Dante to continue the use of a restrictive, convoluted Style mechanic, even on the fly, other than misguided, misplaced, and mistaken nostalgia. Even DMC2 offered Dante more moves over his predecessor without relegating them to a single button and being in a proper "stance."
If you're still with me, instead of already thinking I'm a know-nothing fool and jumping down to the replies to tell me so, let's take a look at how Dante could be updated without a loss of his core functionality...
Aerial Rave - Obviously, just put that dang ol' thing right on Triangle like Nero and m!Dante
Drive - Still just hold Triangle to let it loose
Helm Breaker - Similar to Nero, it's an R1+directional input
Danse Macabre - Could be placed on Triangle+O (or with an R1+directional input), or just...forget it because it's an auto-combo and I thought we didn't like DmC because it was "too easy to do things"
...this also opens up Dante to have his own pause combo in the air. Why didn't he ever get that until DmC...?
Dash, Sky Star, Mustang, and Wall Hike - Could literally, like DMC2, be placed on O as a proprietary dodge button
Gunslinger moves - DmC utilized Square+X for special gun moves, which were also used in DMC4 for different attacks. Rainstorm could easily be placed there. Honeycomb could be an R1+back+Square+X input. We can get the shotgun's Gunstinger in there with R1+forward+Square+X as well. Twosome Time is...well...I love this ability, but it's also kinda easy to forget. I didn't miss it in DmC, or it could still just be put on Square+X on the ground, as an auto-fire that plants you, and you point in a direction. We can bring back Wild Stomp, because that was cool, and Free Ride. Maybe forego Honeycomb altogether as a stationary rapid fire ability and simply place the concept back on jamming Square like in DMC3 for way more bullets than usual. Or better yet, make rapidly jamming Square activate a Crazy Combo-like effect to lead into Honeycomb, like Million Stabs used to.
That's three of the primary Styles placed intuitively around the face buttons, and utilizing input mechanics that were apparently entirely acceptable when used in DMC4(se). I all but ignored Royal Guard because it's...forgettable. DMC3, DMC4, and DmC allowed us to block and parry without needing a separate button, just perfectly-timed swings. Or, Bayonetta (another lauded action game) uses a simple forward input at the right time to parry. OR~ Metal Gear Rising (another lauded action game) uses parries by tilting at the incoming attack and pressing the attack key; Dante in DMC3 even had a weird back-kick he could to as a quick interrupt if you did a similar input to MGR's. It'd be like Table Hopper, buuuut for parrying.
Speaking of Table Hopper, as cool as that is...maybe...not? Being frank, side rolls are trash. You get two and a half directions for i-frame movement, which requires me to hold R1 and then ensure that when I push a direction, I'll actually dodge, given that I might lock-on to the wrong enemy and my tilt could be uselessly counted as a forward input. I'd love to be able to dodge forward, past an enemy's attack and start hitting their flank because, well hey, their business end is their front. Objectively, an omni-directional dodge that requires a direction and button input is better than DMC's "lock-on, pick a side, then move in one of two directions" side-roll. Bayonetta has it, Nier: Automata has it, DMC2 has it, all without sacrificing design. Table Hopper is nice, but getting a great dodge out of the games crap dodge mechanic is...not great.
Then, there's Dante's equipment. Cycling through more than two pieces of gear in a fast-paced action game is dumb. It's another layer to keep track of, and in DMC4, Dante's **** took two entire buttons for cycling, that's primo real estate guys! Let's at least cut this down to one button (saaaay, R2) by pulling a Bayonetta and having equipment templates of "gun and devil arm" that are swapped between. We can only use one weapon (sword or gun) at a time anyway, so tapping one button to switch to a desired weapon set isn't any different than switching specifically to a desired sword or gun. You might even save yourself a click if the next weapon you want to use is already part of a set you swapped to. Or...just put our weapons on the d-pad, because now they're freed up.
This leaves L2 open for something. Nero has Exceed on L2, but Dante can't rev his sword up, so that could still be used for some other proprietary actions, like maybe letting him use Royal Guard abilities to block and counter if you're so inclined, or as a "mode switch" like in DmC for more moves. I dunno, the world's is oyster.
Ultimately, I just think that Dante's control scheme is old and dumb and it should be shot into the sun. There's absolutely no reason why all of his badass abilities can't just be reorganized to logical places on the base scheme, not when Nero exists and proves its possible, or...y'know, that DmC Dante did the exact same thing without losing much substance. I hope beyond hope that they finally drag Dante kicking and screaming into 2018, instead of letting him party like its 2008. There's a better way.
Now you may commence telling me I'm wrong and that I need to git gud and that's the only reason why I care about the UX design.
ADDENDUM: I do not seriously feel that Dante's controls should be "shot into the sun," but I do find them subpar when compared to every other character's, and honestly every other action game's, intuitive controls. I get by just fine playing as Dante and getting those oh-so-important S ranks, I just can't fathom why the controls are so wonky, and wonder/worry if he'll control the same in DMC5, or if they'll update him given everything they've done since DMC4's initial release.
Consider, when you start DMC4, you play several hours as a brand new character with a fairly logical control scheme, where combos are all on the same button (what a revelation!); Square is everything for your gun; and O is your Devil Bringer for grabs, pulls, and grapple-based specials. It's all very streamlined and intuitive - this is your button for this kind of ability: sword, gun, or demon arm, complete with proper inputs for special moves that use those elements of our character. Then we transfer to Dante, whose control scheme hearkens back to DMC3 and the use of Styles.
Suddenly, after several hours of jamming on Triangle for all my sword combo needs on the ground and in the air, I'm accidentally pulling out Helm Breakers, because Dante's Aerial Rave requires me to be in the proper Style and press a completely different button. If I want to do a rapid-fire Honeycomb, I have to mash O. It all leads back to O. Obviously the argument is "Wull, it makes sense once you get used to it," which is true. Of course I'll figure that some special abilities are tied to the Style button, but that doesn't make it intuitive. Like...at all. It's an archaic design, and one I hope Dante will explicitly move away from because it's just really dumb.
Disregarding the lack of improvement in controls to Dante in DMC4, the two most recent games carried with them some of the most intuitively designed control schemes with Nero and m!Dante. DmC reorganized a lot of the control scheme to be much more flexible, but even then it lacked a few inputs that could have added even more depth and abilities, primarily, things that we were given with Nero in DMC4, like back-to-forward inputs, and both Triangle+O and Square+X inputs, even combinations of those with R1 and directions. I'm not saying that DMC5's Dante should adhere to a DmC-oriented design, but the fact of the matter is that DmC's entire control scheme was another version of the already updated controls we had with Nero.
There is absolutely no reason for Dante to continue the use of a restrictive, convoluted Style mechanic, even on the fly, other than misguided, misplaced, and mistaken nostalgia. Even DMC2 offered Dante more moves over his predecessor without relegating them to a single button and being in a proper "stance."
If you're still with me, instead of already thinking I'm a know-nothing fool and jumping down to the replies to tell me so, let's take a look at how Dante could be updated without a loss of his core functionality...
Aerial Rave - Obviously, just put that dang ol' thing right on Triangle like Nero and m!Dante
Drive - Still just hold Triangle to let it loose
Helm Breaker - Similar to Nero, it's an R1+directional input
Danse Macabre - Could be placed on Triangle+O (or with an R1+directional input), or just...forget it because it's an auto-combo and I thought we didn't like DmC because it was "too easy to do things"
...this also opens up Dante to have his own pause combo in the air. Why didn't he ever get that until DmC...?
Dash, Sky Star, Mustang, and Wall Hike - Could literally, like DMC2, be placed on O as a proprietary dodge button
Gunslinger moves - DmC utilized Square+X for special gun moves, which were also used in DMC4 for different attacks. Rainstorm could easily be placed there. Honeycomb could be an R1+back+Square+X input. We can get the shotgun's Gunstinger in there with R1+forward+Square+X as well. Twosome Time is...well...I love this ability, but it's also kinda easy to forget. I didn't miss it in DmC, or it could still just be put on Square+X on the ground, as an auto-fire that plants you, and you point in a direction. We can bring back Wild Stomp, because that was cool, and Free Ride. Maybe forego Honeycomb altogether as a stationary rapid fire ability and simply place the concept back on jamming Square like in DMC3 for way more bullets than usual. Or better yet, make rapidly jamming Square activate a Crazy Combo-like effect to lead into Honeycomb, like Million Stabs used to.
That's three of the primary Styles placed intuitively around the face buttons, and utilizing input mechanics that were apparently entirely acceptable when used in DMC4(se). I all but ignored Royal Guard because it's...forgettable. DMC3, DMC4, and DmC allowed us to block and parry without needing a separate button, just perfectly-timed swings. Or, Bayonetta (another lauded action game) uses a simple forward input at the right time to parry. OR~ Metal Gear Rising (another lauded action game) uses parries by tilting at the incoming attack and pressing the attack key; Dante in DMC3 even had a weird back-kick he could to as a quick interrupt if you did a similar input to MGR's. It'd be like Table Hopper, buuuut for parrying.
Speaking of Table Hopper, as cool as that is...maybe...not? Being frank, side rolls are trash. You get two and a half directions for i-frame movement, which requires me to hold R1 and then ensure that when I push a direction, I'll actually dodge, given that I might lock-on to the wrong enemy and my tilt could be uselessly counted as a forward input. I'd love to be able to dodge forward, past an enemy's attack and start hitting their flank because, well hey, their business end is their front. Objectively, an omni-directional dodge that requires a direction and button input is better than DMC's "lock-on, pick a side, then move in one of two directions" side-roll. Bayonetta has it, Nier: Automata has it, DMC2 has it, all without sacrificing design. Table Hopper is nice, but getting a great dodge out of the games crap dodge mechanic is...not great.
Then, there's Dante's equipment. Cycling through more than two pieces of gear in a fast-paced action game is dumb. It's another layer to keep track of, and in DMC4, Dante's **** took two entire buttons for cycling, that's primo real estate guys! Let's at least cut this down to one button (saaaay, R2) by pulling a Bayonetta and having equipment templates of "gun and devil arm" that are swapped between. We can only use one weapon (sword or gun) at a time anyway, so tapping one button to switch to a desired weapon set isn't any different than switching specifically to a desired sword or gun. You might even save yourself a click if the next weapon you want to use is already part of a set you swapped to. Or...just put our weapons on the d-pad, because now they're freed up.
This leaves L2 open for something. Nero has Exceed on L2, but Dante can't rev his sword up, so that could still be used for some other proprietary actions, like maybe letting him use Royal Guard abilities to block and counter if you're so inclined, or as a "mode switch" like in DmC for more moves. I dunno, the world's is oyster.
Ultimately, I just think that Dante's control scheme is old and dumb and it should be shot into the sun. There's absolutely no reason why all of his badass abilities can't just be reorganized to logical places on the base scheme, not when Nero exists and proves its possible, or...y'know, that DmC Dante did the exact same thing without losing much substance. I hope beyond hope that they finally drag Dante kicking and screaming into 2018, instead of letting him party like its 2008. There's a better way.
Now you may commence telling me I'm wrong and that I need to git gud and that's the only reason why I care about the UX design.
ADDENDUM: I do not seriously feel that Dante's controls should be "shot into the sun," but I do find them subpar when compared to every other character's, and honestly every other action game's, intuitive controls. I get by just fine playing as Dante and getting those oh-so-important S ranks, I just can't fathom why the controls are so wonky, and wonder/worry if he'll control the same in DMC5, or if they'll update him given everything they've done since DMC4's initial release.
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