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Why doesn't DmC's story make any sense? [Spoilers within]

Slacri

Well-known Member
This post is incredibly long and spoiler filled and I apologize for its length but I'm not even touching up on all the holes within this game's narrative because it's so sloppily strung together.

I've been thinking and I've really been perplexed at how little sense DmC's story actually makes. So much things are just left unexplained or are just devoid of logic.

I mean let's start out with Limbo. Nothing about it makes any sense.

They give such a little explanation about how Limbo works in any way It really leaves me dumbfounded. The opening cut scene establishes that things that happen in Limbo influence physical objects in the human world. Dante's trailer is completely trashed as is the amusement park. However later in the game this is completely contradicted by characters in Limbo being unable to interact with real things. For example Vergil is unable to type in the self-destruct codes to his computer and has to guide Kat through it instead.

Apparently Kat can't be touched by Dante or interact with him when he's in Limbo and she's not as evidenced by the scene where she's taken and he attempts to grab her only to have her hand fade through his , but if he shoots her apparently she'll die according to her. So how does this Limbo non Limbo interaction even work?

How does dragging Dante into Limbo even work? Can the demons do this whenever they want or what? They never explain this, and nor do they explain Limbo itself. Apparently its a living city that can interact with Dante by making the ground spread apart and what not. But if this is the case why doesn't it just completely collapse its floor while Dante is standing on it? The narrative so vaguely explains how Limbo even functions.

How does getting out of Limbo work? I guess Hunter demons and cameras can do this? But if this is the case you'd think there would be camera everywhere, especially where one of their main factories of controlling the humans is. But Dante and Kat waltz into the factory and once in he's not dragged into Limbo at all until they're pretty deep in the factory. Considering how big of a deal they make out of the demons watching everything they're surprisingly not very watchful when it's not convenient to the plot. Even then there are points when there's no cameras or hunter demons that drag him into Limbo. It seems like being dragged into Limbo is just the plot deciding it needs an artificial way to ramp up tension.

Dante's backstory and character don't even make sense especially considering how familiar he is with Limbo. At the start of the game they act as if Dante is so familiar with Limbo and the demons. He says it's because as a kid he was surrounded by them at an orphanage or something, even though the story is so vague about this and for some reason the backstory is spliced in with concept art they had lying around that doesn't really have anything to do with what's happening.

But how did they even lose Dante? He isn't particularly subtle as his trailer sticks out like a sore thumb and I wouldn't expect a Dante in his early teens having the wisest ability to hide as the demons are supposedly "monitoring everything".

For that matter, how does Vergil know any of what he tells Dante? His mind was wiped too and there's nobody to explain this to him with long exposition complete with hamfisted graffiti in the background that conveniently tells his story in images. Man, Vergil really must have put Kat to work doing all of that for no real reason.

Also, apparently the pairing between a human and angel was unthinkable and unheard of. But according to Phineas they were an entire race of statue people that don't share any common physiology with Dante or Vergil.

Also, what are angels exactly? The game brings them up and apparently they fought demons, but where are they? They clearly still exist, but they don't do anything but be sluts with wings except for Eva. I guess the fact that their weapons can't even damage demons and vice-versa lead to a real stand still.

The universe of this game makes such little sense but what makes almost less sense are the characters. Vergil for example, he's painted as an intelligent and strategic guy. But he acts like a complete idiot. He never suggests Dante try to disguise himself while walking casually around the town sticking out like a sore thumb. ( I don't know too many people who walk around with Union Jacks on their arm in the U.S. ). Not to mention that Dante's face is apparently everywhere in the media as a terrorist but absolutely nobody recognizes him or freaks out when they see him. Why does Vergil even cover his face on TV if he's going to casually walk around with Dante unmasked? You know it's really not such a shock that the demons found his secret compound.

And he also shows no foresight. Why did he make the self-destruct sequence of his computers such a long and complicated process? Did he really think that if he had to resort to such a measure that he'd have such time? If he's too lazy to just encrypt his files then he should at least make the self-destruct a relatively easy process. I mean I guess you can say that he wants to make it so it's not so easy to lose his files but why would he let idiots work on his oh so valuable information or not just make a few prompts to prevent someone from accidentally doing it. If they were intentionally doing it its obvious they weren't on his side and were just going to find the information out anyway. Also, why is there no secret exit or escape route? You'd think if the information was the most important thing he'd make an exit route that's not dependent on Limbo.

What's even so important about this information? It doesn't help them at all later and the only thing that would be important that I can see is his existence. Why did he even bother putting his own bio in his files? Was he afraid he'd forget it?

His fight with Dante at the end makes no sense at all either, through out the entire game Dante is shown to be better at fighting than Vergil. From Vergil having trouble with enemies that Dante easily takes out, to getting instantly rendered useless in the Mundus fight, to him having Dante do all the physical work. He's apparently shown to be the intelligent one. But in the end when him and Dante disagree his immediate course of action is to try to kill Dante in a one on one fight. And then once defeated he claims he loved Dante despite just trying to murder him at the drop of a hat.

The ending also makes Dante look like stupid too. Through out the whole game Vergil being stupid and kind of a dick has been telegraphed to him and the audience but he's still so shocked when he turns out to be not such a nice guy. Hours ago ( or days, however this game's timeline works ) Vergil shot Lilith in the back putting them all in danger and provoking Mundus to destroy the city in a rage. He puts them all in such danger and at most all he does is say "What the f---?" as if Vergil had just spilled soda all over Dante's new shirt. Even then it's so clear Vergil barely cared about Kat and was only using her to suit his own ends and Dante is appalled when Vergil implies that's exactly what was doing.

I've also heard people claim that Dante is more "human" in this one despite him being changed to not be human at all. Even though making him half-angel really adds nothing to the story but making him more sueish than before. I mean the entire theme of these games even in the title was Dante embracing his human side as a strong point but Dante agrees with Vergil that humans are weak and can't really protect themselves he just disagrees on how to deal with the issue.

I also find it hilarious how at the end of the game they act as if they've saved the world by unleashing demons all over it. Slaughtering millions if not billions of people because the only person that can really fight back against it is Dante, and unless Dante uses his time-stopping powers ( that come out of nowhere at all and are never explained nor brought up again other than a lazy and convenient way of getting Vergil and Kat out of Mundus' rage explosion in the V-Mobile ) while traveling all over the world to kill every demon ever.

Mundus also makes no sense. Despite his obvious failing at tracking Dante. He's an all-powerful God and his way of going about world domination is economic control? Why? He can destroy entire cities in a second and nobody can even hurt him. What use does he even have to keep the humans around anyway? Why doesn't he just kill them all and let demons roam? Instead his plan revolves around manipulation and debt control.

I could go on but I've rambled enough about how full of holes this story is despite its baffling praise.

Thanks for reading this long ramble.
 

Valcorn

Well-known Member
Indeed, but don't bother because around here it's mostly full of pro-DmC fanboys/girls who see the game as perfect, despite it's gameplay being dumbed down and story making even less sense than the original series.
 

darkmanifest

Unleash the blood
A lot of the issues you have seem to be due to "idiot ball" writing, when parts of the story are dependent on the characters having moments of unusual stupidity - holding the idiot ball - in order for certain events to happen. The best example is, as you mentioned: Dante needs to fight Vergil at the end, hence, Vergil blurts out his nefarious intentions despite his observations during the entire game giving him every reason to know better. Another example: Vergil puts them all in great danger for no reason with that Lilith stunt, yet Dante still trusts him with his life when invading Mundus's tower. Another one: Mundus values his heir a great deal and already knows Dante's track record of picking off his favorite demons behind his back, yet he doesn't put any guards on Lilith's club with orders to notify him if Dante shows his face.

But how did they even lose Dante? He isn't particularly subtle as his trailer sticks out like a sore thumb and I wouldn't expect a Dante in his early teens having the wisest ability to hide as the demons are supposedly "monitoring everything".

Yeah, I was kind of...really confused by that. Dante is an adult at the start of the game, and Mundus has known about him since he was seven. He's been running around for over a decade getting an extensive rap sheet and landing in institutions, demons have been trying to kill him in Limbo since before the game, and he's done nothing to alter his appearance or his name since he was a child. How has a Hunter only JUST found him? They should have caught and eaten him at like age fourteen.

I also find it hilarious how at the end of the game they act as if they've saved the world by unleashing demons all over it. Slaughtering millions if not billions of people because the only person that can really fight back against it is Dante, and unless Dante uses his time-stopping powers ( that come out of nowhere at all and are never explained nor brought up again other than a lazy and convenient way of getting Vergil and Kat out of Mundus' rage explosion in the V-Mobile ) while traveling all over the world to kill every demon ever.

Dante's trigger is basically Quicksilver style from DMC3, just like Vergil's trigger is Doppelganger, so that's how he stops time. You have to be familiar with previous games to get that, though, and I thought this game was supposed to be unique from previous entries. Anyway, that's also the same part where Dante deliberately destroys a train when saving Vergil and Kat, and there's nothing to imply there weren't innocent people on that train. It's not Dante's fault that he's forced into such a position by demons trying to kill him, but a better story would deal with the consequences, especially since it's trying to frame Dante as a good person by the end.

Also, lmao, "V-Mobile", seriously, Vergil, don't monogram your ****, you are not Batman.

Mundus also makes no sense. Despite his obvious failing at tracking Dante. He's an all-powerful God and his way of going about world domination is economic control? Why? He can destroy entire cities in a second and nobody can even hurt him. What use does he even have to keep the humans around anyway? Why doesn't he just kill them all and let demons roam?

It's explained in the game that demons feed off human souls, so they keep them as domesticated livestock. However, I agree that Mundus is strangely inactive and incompetent for an all-powerful demon emperor. I also agree that there's no proper explanation for why demons choose to deal with humans incognito. Them going to so much trouble to hide from humans is like humans hiding from our cows and chickens. You OWN them already, who cares what they think about you having three eyes and a tail?

I think the story's problems were: Being more ambitious in its ideas than it could support in execution, a stunningly shallow approach to the presented themes of morality, anarchy, and government control, and too much repetition, exposition, and wasted scenes. The latter is something I never understand in a medium with very limited space and resources to devote to storytelling. For every second Dante spent repeating what Vergil just told him (why?!) or Mundus was banging his girlfriend (so we can better understand they're a couple who has sex? Was that in question?), something that contributed to the story could have been happening.

At its root, it had a ton of very good potential, and I think if the writers had a competent editor, they could have done something amazing. As it is, the story seems to be, as Mundus put it, "Too big for [its] f**king boots". Not worse than previous entries, not really. It's, essentially, a rewrite of DMC3, and it's more complex than DMC3's script, but less contained and less internally consistent because it didn't properly follow through with all that complexity.

This kind of thing drove me CRAZY in DMC4, which was also a very ambitious story that lacked consistency, and I was hoping DmC would avoid most of those pitfalls. At least the voice acting and design were really very good and grounded and made the story seem better than it was.
 

Slacri

Well-known Member
Dante's trigger is basically Quicksilver style from DMC3, just like Vergil's trigger is Doppelganger, so that's how he stops time. You have to be familiar with previous games to get that, though, and I thought this game was supposed to be unique from previous entries. Anyway, that's also the same part where Dante deliberately destroys a train when saving Vergil and Kat, and there's nothing to imply there weren't innocent people on that train. It's not Dante's fault that he's forced into such a position by demons trying to kill him, but a better story would deal with the consequences, especially since it's trying to frame Dante as a good person by the end.
Yeah, it was Quicksilver but it's very jarring because you never use Quicksilver in the game and DMC3 did it by having you fight a boss that used slow-motion against you, and then you take that bosses power after you beat it. I agree it just didn't really make sense.




It's explained in the game that demons feed off human souls, so they keep them as domesticated livestock. However, I agree that Mundus is strangely inactive and incompetent for an all-powerful demon emperor. I also agree that there's no proper explanation for why demons choose to deal with humans incognito. Them going to so much trouble to hide from humans is like humans hiding from our cows and chickens. You OWN them already, who cares what they think about you having three eyes and a tail?
Oh, they did? My bad, missed it. Still, I don't understand why they don't treat humans like we do cows.

You really hit the nail on the head for me with your post, bravo. I really only disagree on the voice acting. While most people gave fine performance's, Dante's really fell short. He's really phoning it in at some points I feel and his performance is kind of emotionless.

When Vergil is sucked into Mundus is a great example of my point. Once Vergil gets sucked in he lets out an "Ah!" and it sounded like a child who's mad at his parents for grounding him or something. It completely ripped me out of the scene.
 

meg5493

Praise the Sun!
I felt like DmC tried to be overly complex which in term made it confusing and left much to be explained. The environments were nice for the most part and the voice acting was okay nothing that made me go "WOW I'm going straight to youtube after this so i can watch this cutscene again and again" Kinda like what I did with Berial and Phantom
 

Slacri

Well-known Member
I felt like DmC tried to be overly complex which in term made it confusing and left much to be explained. The environments were nice for the most part and the voice acting was okay nothing that made me go "WOW I'm going straight to youtube after this so i can watch this cutscene again and again" Kinda like what I did with Berial and Phantom
Man, I still don't forget this scene.
5BVIeXx.gif
 

Martius

SSSmokin!
Bleh, all of that cleary show that NT did not have any writer outside from studio to work on script like in Heavenly Sword and Enslaved. Rhianna Pratchett and Alex Garland did great job with these titles, reboot looks like wasted chance.
 

AlchemistFromEden

Well-known Member
Bleh, all of that cleary show that NT did not have any writer outside from studio to work on script like in Heavenly Sword and Enslaved. Rhianna Pratchett and Alex Garland did great job with these titles, reboot looks like wasted chance.
alex garland was a supervisor on the story
 

Slacri

Well-known Member
alex garland was a supervisor on the story
He was a co-writer. His interview kind of explains how he stopped Ninja Theory's more questionable writing technique's while they weren't on a leash in DmC.
http://www.edge-online.com/features/interview-alex-garland-part-two/
Tameem and the level designers all sat down together. We got to a section where Monkey was walking down a walkway, and he sees an escaping slave trying to pull himself up to the walkway. And instead of helping the guy up, Monkey kicked him in the face and sent him to his death. They thought that projected the idea that Monkey was a badass. Whereas, to me, it projected the idea that Monkey was a bit of a ****.
Ultimately, if you want to be serious about narrative, you have to be serious about character too.
 

Drake

Well-known Member
Never really understood why Mundus would control the worlds though debt, he is a demon god, just enslave humanity. Why hide his true form, why go about it that way. Also is it stated that Dante is stronger than Sparda in this game? Just wanted to know.
 

Dante Redgrave

Son of Sparda
Never really understood why Mundus would control the worlds though debt, he is a demon god, just enslave humanity. Why hide his true form, why go about it that way. Also is it stated the Dante is stronger than Sparda in this game? Just wanted to know.

Mundus thinks of himself as a God, but apparently he likes breaking humanity down from behind, more sneaky that way. As for Dante, no, they never say he's more powerful than his father, just that nephilim had powers the other two races did not.
 

Drake

Well-known Member
Thanks, also did his father rebel aganist Mundus like in the orginal games, or did he just marry Eva
 

Loopy

Devil hunter in training
Mundus thinks of himself as a God, but apparently he likes breaking humanity down from behind, more sneaky that way. As for Dante, no, they never say he's more powerful than his father, just that nephilim had powers the other two races did not.
Maybe Mundus gets a kick out of doing it the sly way?
If he just came out and declared he was a demon and took humans by force, I'm betting he'd be pretty bored.
Then again, I'm not sure why he isn't bored anyway. He has humans under his control and they have no idea. He owns everything. It's like he has so much money and power and a sytem in place that he doesn't have to do anything.
It's like playing the sims game forever with all the cheats unlocked. :p Maybe that's what Mundus thinks life is. Life is a Sims game for him.
 
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