So I worked on DmC...

[Demi-fiend]

You do that.

 

[Loopy]

By "Devil Arms" they mean "The Melee Weapons".

They were referred to as "DA" because DMC3 called them that.

The deal with the devil arms (imho) is that they all came from Dante's body and Dante's connection to Limbo.

He had the tool to unlock them (his tattoo) but he needed to add the "Essence" of whatever demon he defeated to truly make it a part of his armory.

Take Bob the newscaster for example:

He most likely defeated an Angel, then took it's Angel Arm. Dante then received this arm when he defeated Bob in turn.

It's kind of like DMC3 where certain boss demons gave up their essence willingly (or not) after Dante defeated them in combat.
Same with DMC4 and Nero absorbing essence with his literal devil arm.

 

[Demi-fiend]

Yeah... pretty much that.

 

[D0NN1E]

Before I continue, let me just reiterate that I'm not associated with Ninja Theory nor Capcom. These posts represent my views and not theirs.

Thanks, Final Offer!

I was working on another project when the first trailer came out, but I saw the development and thought it looked cool. I anticipated some reaction due to his hair being black, but not to the extent we saw. When I joined the project I already knew what the reaction was and I felt the pressure to work harder and harder to make the best game possible.

Thing I would like to change? I think I would change many, many things on both the main game and DLC. Haha! For example, the Hunter would have no cutscenes during gameplay. His special attack intros would all be done in gameplay. Unfortunately we would need a new system to handle these transitions. Would have loved for him to teleport through smoke on harder difficulties! Would have added more attacks!! I would add more attacks for Poison, especially attacks you cannot parry at the back of the arena. In the final version you can get her into a loop if you stand there and keep parrying. I don't like that she has an obvious weakness like that. On DLC, I would like to change the cutscenes to 3D rendering, as these failed to communicate the story in the best light. I would've liked to have the Hollow Dante fight, which was planned but dropped. Anyway, many many things that I would've changed.

I would always choose to play Vergil!

Thank you for your words. I think the game is far from perfect, but you are right. Combat games like DmC are rare nowadays.

If a DmC movie would be great? Of course I think so.

I didn't get to meet Combichrist.

I love everything I did and love what I'm doing now, which is more writing and directing for film. But who knows, I might come back to videogames in the future. Right now I'm enjoying playing videogames instead of making them.


Frostmourne,

No hostility among us. I don't know who the other person his, but I have no interest in generating conflict.

Not everyone likes the coloured enemies, me being one of them. Did you noticed we removed them in Vergil's Downfall?

Regarding the difficulty, in all fairness, I think we needed a few more months to get the balance perfect. Balancing so many difficulty modes at once is very, very hard. There were also many elements of the team balancing their own parts, like different bosses, and it was tough testing all difficulties plus gathering and studying data in the timeframe we had.

Yes, I was responsible for giving the creative direction for Vergil's Downfall.

Ok, let me address the Bleach "references". In all honesty, I had never, never watched or read about Bleach. I wrote the story and half way through development someone on another team came over and said "I'm a massive Bleach fan, I can see that you made a lot of references!" I was like, no, I didn't.

So... the Hollow characters came upon reading this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hollow_Men
Which seems to make a lot of references to Dante's Inferno itself (the original inspiration for DMC).
The Hollow people in Vergil's hell represent parts of himself, not necessarily ties to someone, but parts of his personality. More on this below.

Maybe Bleach used the same references? Hard to tell, by the time I was made aware of this I was so committed to telling Vergil's story that I just followed through and didn't care about it.

Love Soul Reaver! One of my all time favourite games. Anyway, as I said above, there are things I would change about the DLC, but it was the best we could do with the time given.


mrrandomlulz,

Thanks! Haha!


TWOxACROSS,

Well, as I said above, these Hollow characters were meant to represent parts of Vergil's personality, not necessarily emotional ties. Hollow Kat represents humanity, not necessarily a connection to Kat. When he "kills" her, he is in fact killing part of himself. If you think about it, Vergil is the end is half dead because he killed all these parts of himself. It's never said out loud, but he becomes Nero Angelo, or the Angel of Death, the one that can walk among the dead and the living.

That is the real Eva, who's been doomed to a life in hell. Rejected by the angels, who saw her as a traitor after the relationship with Sparda, she was banished and placed there for all eternity. Vergil pays her a visit.

Someone else wrote the main game, so I can never be certain about this. In my view, Vergil had discovered his devil trigger very early on in his childhood. Dante awakened during the events of DmC.


Loopy,

Initially, the trade would take place on a bridge, with a train going under it. Lilith would transform right after the Trade and jump down on the moving train. Dante would chase her on the train and kill her. Incredibly, if you look at the new Bayonetta 2 trailer, you will see a boss train mission that is very similar in concept to what we wanted to do. Looks awesome!!


Vergil'sBitch,

Vergil is definitely not dead at the end of the DLC, he has been reborn. I always thought of him being half dead half alive, and with the unique ability to walk among both dead and living.

Hollow Vergil represents a personality trait of Vergil, SELF DOUBT, which he kills. Do you see how confident he becomes after killing Hollow Vergil? Anyway, Vergil becomes Nero Angelo (I refer to him as Nero Angelo because it translates better to Dark Angel, or Angel of Death) and returns to the world of the living. I actually wrote a possible opening for a sequel so I could write Vergil's Downfall and trace his future better.

Not sure that's an early concept for Vergil, but the face was tweaked to match the actor, David. So maybe that's why he looks a bit older?

Thanks for the nice comments, guys!

 

[Demi-fiend]

See? I told you guys that they didn't mean to "copy" Bleach.

Sorry, I'm being obnoxious.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Edit:

So, you got the idea from "The Hollow Men"? See, this is what we get for not being more culturally aware. *sigh*

I admit my blatant ignorance.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Good to see that you're a fellow Soul Reaver fan. True, that game is celebrated, but it's also seriously underrated as well, in my honest opinion.

I see that DmC also had a real-time Netherworld, just like SR did. I attributed Dante's appearance in the 2010 Tokyo Game Show to Raziel's looks (I say this because they both looked emaciated with black "bowl-ish" hair cuts).

Ah, I understand that balancing the issues would lead to more dev time. I get the fact that you couldn't make it harder in the time required.

Yeah, I noticed that you took out the colored enemies in the DLC. Thanks for that. Also, thanks for making it more difficult than the main DmC campaign. I noticed a lot of improvements over the original game.

Personally, I'd recommend the Persona 4 Arena, if you want to take a quick look at what that series is about --

-- but for now, I'd just say, play Darksiders II if you want a game that's similar to Soul Reaver.

I'm glad that there's no hostility. Anyone who likes DMC3, Soul Reaver, and just so happens to have been involved with DmC is pretty much solid, in my opinion.

Oh, and just out of curiosity, what did you think of Castlevania Lords of Shadow 2?

------------------------------------------------------------------------

I edited my original post, so you might want to take a look at that to see if there's anything you may have missed.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

I actually wrote a possible opening for a sequel so I could write Vergil's Downfall and trace his future better.

Not sure that's an early concept for Vergil, but the face was tweaked to match the actor, David. So maybe that's why he looks a bit older?

Thanks for the nice comments, guys!

I'm sorry but, would you mind sharing a few details on the opening scene? I really wanted to find out what happens afterwards.

Ok, I know you can't tell us anything, but maybe just a hint would be nice. Something for us to go on. Any sort of clue would be fine with us.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Wait, I have an idea:

I'll write a scenario, and you say "hot" or "cold".

Vergil escapes hell and is followed by the demons. He bides his time, slowly building up his new secret base while Dante takes care of The Order at the old one.

Then after about a few months or so, Vergil assaults The Order base, defeating Dante... but then says something like:

"I'm not going to finish you off now. I'll wait until the world is under my grasp, then when you realize that you've lost everything, then I'll send you to hell."

He then takes all of Dante's weapons and imprisons him.

Thus, the game starts, and Dante must escape a new "Limbo" prison (it'll be called, "The Ninth Circle" or something like that) and find new weapons to be able to confront a new and all-powerful Vergil, thus finishing him off for good.

And DmC3 has the Order of the Sword introduce an Evil Nero.

(Nero was played by Johnny Yong Bosch, who also played the bad guy in this vid).

[SPOILER ALERT]

Yes... Nero MUST be Evil.

And then, Dante finishes Evil Nero off, thus insuring world peace and blah blah.

DmC4: Nero comes back from hell (or Heaven? and then Dante's the bad guy?) and blah blah fight then stalemate then peace agreement blah.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

BI would've liked to have the Hollow Dante fight, which was planned but dropped. Anyway, many many things that I would've changed.

 

[Loopy]

Loopy,

Initially, the trade would take place on a bridge, with a train going under it. Lilith would transform right after the Trade and jump down on the moving train. Dante would chase her on the train and kill her. Incredibly, if you look at the new Bayonetta 2 trailer, you will see a boss train mission that is very similar in concept to what we wanted to do. Looks awesome!!

That sounds like such a cool idea. I like what we had for that boss fight with her, and the final version for the trade scene, but that sort of train fight sounds pretty dynamic. It would've been cool to experience that. It's a shame that kind of thing was hard to make.

So, is that why designs like this are included on the in game gallery? Was this the form she was going to turn into for the train fight scenario?

 

[Demi-fiend]

Now children...

You're giving Mommy a headache.

 

[Loopy]

Now children...

You're giving Mommy a headache.

Hey! I made that :laugh:
This thing, right?

Anyway, it would've been cool to see those alternate boss designs of her in action. Somehow, they're more creepy to me than the baby thing that appeared in the final game. There's just something totally disturbing about being chased by a tentacle using, nearly naked, demon thing. Kinda gross too :vomit:

Also would've solved the mystery of if Lilith's form we see in the game is a borrowed human body like Mundus using Kyle Ryder as a vessel, or if it's her real form, or there's something more demonic underneath the human vessel.

Would've been both cool and freaky to see that alternate demon form ripping out of her human skin.

 

[Demi-fiend]

Yup, it was your idea.

------------------------------------------------

Anyway, I blame time constraints and production costs.

Either that, or the playtesters complained about having to see the nakedness.

 

[Loopy]

I blame time constraints and production costs.

Either that, or the playtesters complained about having to see the nakedness.

If playtesters were uneasy about that kind of thing, makes me wonder how they kept the Lilith and Mundus sex scene in. I guess it was able to be included because they had clothes on and it wasn't like there was a shot panning out to show exactly what they were doing.
Besides, that kind of action might be hard to rig and animate anyway without it looking like it had crossed the uncanny valley into even more weirdness. :tongue:

I do find it funny though that Mundus has his clothes on for that sex scene, but then he's got no clothes on when he's in the core of his final form. Weird. :tongue:

 

[Demi-fiend]

Yeah but "power naked" is different from "ugly naked".

 

[Loopy]

Yeah but "power naked" is different from "ugly naked".

I love that there's even a distinction between that kind of thing. Nudity is totally fine, but only if there is power glow obscuring the junk. And tits are fine, but no nipples. But nipples on guys is fine. :laugh: It's such a weird standard to have. Having said that...naked Mundus...no, just no. :tongue:

Speaking of Mundus, it was an interesting twist with him reacting to his child being killed. It did lead to one of my friends asking why I was playing as a character who killed a guy's child. Got to say, it is interesting to have a villain go through something so personal as that. Adds a new edge to the character.
Pretty good how that scene was acted, animated and scripted too. Mundus is calm, asking why, even when Dante is trying to wind him up, and then Mundus finally flips out when Dante describes in detail about the spawn being reduced to chunks and calls him a b!tch. Pretty good scene, imo.

 

[Demi-fiend]

A new edge... yeah, I also like the fact that Mundus wasn't some generic villain, either. They managed to give him a proper motivation in the little screen time that he actually had, instead of making him want to just "keep the world for himself".

 

[Loopy]

A new edge... yeah, I also like the fact that Mundus wasn't some generic villain, either. They managed to give him a proper motivation in the little screen time that he actually had, instead of making him want to just "keep the world for himself".

I think that's one of the first times I've ever thought that a villain actually made a logical argument about why they did what they did. :tongue:

I would've like to see more of him in the game, maybe more interaction with Lilith... that would've kicked the drama and tension of the trade scene up a notch if he'd actually cared about her. But, it's not in his character to care for anyone properly, and I suspect the reaction to the death of his child was more out of anger that his bloodline was so easily destroyed, and by a son of Sparda to boot, instead of a father's normal love for his child.

Just thought, before I go waaay off topic, but I wonder how long it takes on average to animate a cutscene with that kind of facial expression? I really loved how even subtle face movements were captured in that confrontation scene between Dante and Mundus. It really added to the believability of what the characters were saying.

 

[DragonMaster2010]

TWOxACROSS,

Well, as I said above, these Hollow characters were meant to represent parts of Vergil's personality, not necessarily emotional ties. Hollow Kat represents humanity, not necessarily a connection to Kat. When he "kills" her, he is in fact killing part of himself. If you think about it, Vergil is the end is half dead because he killed all these parts of himself. It's never said out loud, but he becomes Nero Angelo, or the Angel of Death, the one that can walk among the dead and the living.

That is the real Eva, who's been doomed to a life in hell. Rejected by the angels, who saw her as a traitor after the relationship with Sparda, she was banished and placed there for all eternity. Vergil pays her a visit.

This was the question I've always been curious about. So that really WAS Eva he saw and Vergil really was dead. So glad to get that cleared up finally.

Now for my questions:

1.) The design of yamato; Do you mind me asking how the choice to design it as such came to play if you can, because I've always been put off by the way the blade is formed.

2.) Just to be clear, The Devil Trigger we see in the main game is the same as Dante's and not an "incomplete form" right?

3.) I don't know if you can answer this, but during The Trade, time would suddenly stand still whenever Kat and Vergil were about to die, giving Dante time to prevent them from dying. Now was the time stopping from Mundus using his powers uncontrollably, Limbo itself messing up, or did Dante have some sort of control over the moments where time stopped before Vergil and Kat got killed?

4.) What scenes ended up getting taken out in the final product, and where there any special stages you guys had in mind?

5.) In your honest opinion do you think Dante in DmC was a good character? There's a lot of talk among fans about which Dante was better between new Dante vs old Dante. Which do you think was your favorite assuming you've played the classic DMC games.

6.) As a Hellblazer fan, was John Constantine a possible inspiration for Dante in DmC? Just a curious question, you don't need to answer.

Nice to have you here

 

[AgentRedgrave]

Whoa someone who actually worked on one of the games, that's cool. Only one question really comes to my mind. If you had the chance, this is strictly hypothetical, but if you had the chance to work on a sequel are their any elements, or features you would like to see added or story elements? Strictly hypothitical of course.

 

[DarkSlayerZero]

I actually wrote a possible opening for a sequel so I could write Vergil's Downfall and trace his future better.

I'm very interested in this.

Care to share?

EDIT

Since Vergil is basically pure evil which Vergil from the classic DMC would you say he identifies more with DMC3 Vergil or Gilver from the DMC1 novel?

 

[D0NN1E]

Frostmourne,

Dante's appearance in the 2010 TGS was a bit misunderstood. He wasn't that emaciated, it's just that people didn't realize the boy in chains was like 6-8 years old! I guess cutting between the more mature Dante and the boy gave the wrong impression and the trailer wasn't very clear about this. I think at some point you were meant to play a young Dante in the game but this was scrapped very early on.

Thanks! We decided to make Vergil's Downfall as hard as possible!

Oh, haven't played Darksiders yet! Must do that.

I played the Lords of Shadow 2 demo and was so disappointed. I loved the first one, despite the derivative elements, and was expecting a lot more. Didn't go near the second one. Did you like it?

More on the opening scene later, but your guess is very, very COLD. Haha!


Loopy,

That's correct, that was the form you were going to fight on the train. She would use long arms to smash parts of the train, latch onto buildings, etc.

I don't think it was the QA that complained about her being naked. The original concept evolved, like everything else on the project, and then she became pregnant with this baby and it became more about the baby and less about Lilith. That's why you fight the baby, and not her.

The scene with Mundus is interesting to me because it questions what Dante is doing. If you think about it, Dante pretty much ruined the world we know by merging the demon and human worlds. More on that later.

Regarding facial motion capture, I'm not entirely sure. As far as I know, the motion data captured from the actor has to be cleaned and retargeted to the 3D model, and the performance is then tweaked, using the original footage as reference. It's very time consuming!!


DragonMaster2010,

Not sure about Yamato, to be honest.

Vergil's Devil trigger? It's definitely his version of the same ability.

I think it was more Mundus not having full control of his powers at that point and firing multiple waves of destruction at the city.

So much stuff it thought out and then later removed because it doesn't make sense or the project moves in a different direction. Lilith on a train, playing as young Dante are just two examples.

I like both Dantes! I love the classic Dante because he was funny and in a way he knew who he was and his place in the world. What I liked about the new one is that he's humanised and makes mistakes like all of us. He is forced to make some tough choices and goes from this selfish guy to a considerate hero.

Constantine? I'm not sure! What is it that you think looks similar or inspired by it?


AgentRedgrave,

Below!


DarkSlayerZero,

I would say Vergil at the end of Vergil's Downfall is between Vergil at the end of DMC3 and Nelo Angelo from DMC1. He's not quite Nelo Angelo yet, but he's evolving to become that.


Now, regarding the opening of a follow-up to Vergil's Downfall I had a few ideas, but since these were not written at Ninja Theory, nor were they written to support a sequel, just as a way for me to plan the character development for Vergil's Downfall, you can consider these fan fiction.

My idea for a follow-up starts with the world torn apart. Demons run freely on the streets so people try to barricade themselves in their homes. However this doesn't work long as the demons slowly corrupt the humans and the humans start to take on demonic traits. Basically humanity is starting to fall to the dark side. Right at the start, we follow Kat, as she tries to save a young girl from her mother, who has turned evil. They trap the mother and escape to the streets of the city, which has been destroyed after the events of DmC.

A demon kidnaps the little girl and Dante shows up to help Kat. Dante chases the demon and when he's about to deal the final blow, time freezes. The previously grey and barren landscape suddenly turns green and lush (the angelic plane of existence appears in a similar way to the Malice in DmC). An angel appears from above and introduces himself as Eva's brother, Dante's uncle. It is then that we learn that the events at the end of DmC, merging both demon and human worlds, threw the three dimensions (human, demon and angel) off balance. Dante is to blame for this.

With time frozen, only the angels or half angels can move freely. Kat and the little girl are frozen at this point, while Dante and his uncle have this discussion. The uncle severs the demon's head (the one Dante was chasing) and it is at this time that they hear someone approaching. The green plants and flowers start to die around them. The uncle becomes agitated and asks Dante to come to the angel world, leaving Kat and the girl behind. It is at this point that the other entity becomes visible: a man with black wings, the Angel of Death (or Nero Angelo if you pefer . Dante leaves Kat, who is shocked to see what Vergil has become.

So this is what I had planned for a possible opening, following the events of DmC and Vergil's Downfall. I also planned an ending for this, which would see Dante sacrifice himself and his brother to restore the balance between the three different worlds.

The angels would play a much larger part in this game and take the game in a totally different direction. Not all angels would be allies to Dante, as he is responsible for destroying the balance, and I thought at some point his uncle would have to betray the Angel Queen to help Dante, pitting the angels against Dante completely. Also the fact that Dante's mother was banished by the angels doesn't make Dante their best friend.

What do you think? Would this have been cool? Fire away!

 

[TWOxACROSS]

Not to shamelessly plug myself, but I'd be curious as to what you think of my theoretical DmC2 that I've been doing in my off-time. You can check it out by following this link. As someone who loved DmC as a whole, I wanted to expand on a lot of the details that didn't get a lot of mention, and do some of the older concepts justice.

I could also share other things that I have planned for it, as well. I wonder if someone who worked so closely on the game might find what I've been doing close to the mark.

 

[berto]

I got more than a few very varied questions, then too.

You may or may not know anything about this, worth a shot. I read that the original name for Dante was going to be Tony Redgrave. Were they thinking about doing something with that before they settled with the final draft of the script?

So, from what you saw, how did people around the office feel about the design? I read that a lot of the staff were big on DMC so some of the, I'm sure, had opinions. Were they happy with it, or were some not so happy but did they not want to say do to not wanting to risk their job, or were they just too excited to be working on a DMC game to care about all that?

Fan reaction couldn't have felt too good, how did you guys deal with it to keep moving forward? Did you have to stay away from the internet for a while?
(On that note it must've been very demoralizing to get those sorts of reactions, varying in range, creativity and intensity. I'm sorry for that. I know I over reacted for the first, what, 6 months? Yeah. Anyway, way to stay strong.)

The game had it's fair share of glitches at release, was this a side effect of the time restrictions? I know you said there were a lot of things that frustrated you but do to deadlines they couldn't be helped.

How big was the team for the VD DLC?

Was there a scenario where the the story involved more angels that just in cutscenes?

Alot of the moves are passed down from previous DMC games but did you guys have to animate and and code them from scratch?

I'm assuming his hair turning white at the end was always the idea, since that how I remember the game was pitched to the public, how Dante became the Dante we know, but were there any heavy design periods for that version, too, or was that a far simpler thing to pull off?

If you had the money, time, and power, what would you change from the final product? I mean, besides the train sequence and all the other things that you already mentioned.

Were there plans for a sequel or was this always a stand alone concept?

Did you guys play some of the originals during development or, like the actors, were you encouraged to stay away from those to keep from shifting too much out of the new look to the old?

 

[Vergil'sBitch]

Thanks! We decided to make Vergil's Downfall as hard as possible!

You certainly did that. :laugh: I'm still trying to get past mission 6

Vergil'sBitch,

Vergil is definitely not dead at the end of the DLC, he has been reborn. I always thought of him being half dead half alive, and with the unique ability to walk among both dead and living.

Hollow Vergil represents a personality trait of Vergil, SELF DOUBT, which he kills. Do you see how confident he becomes after killing Hollow Vergil? Anyway, Vergil becomes Nero Angelo (I refer to him as Nero Angelo because it translates better to Dark Angel, or Angel of Death) and returns to the world of the living. I actually wrote a possible opening for a sequel so I could write Vergil's Downfall and trace his future better.

Not sure that's an early concept for Vergil, but the face was tweaked to match the actor, David. So maybe that's why he looks a bit older?

Thanks for the nice comments, guys!

So are you a 'freelancer' in the work that you do? (Apologies if that isn't the word).

I do remember that (I wish I could kill my self doubt in the same way). It's a great representation.
And thanks for clearing up the ending (and the difference between the picture and final version).

I've just read your idea for a sequel and I think it would be great to see a relation of Dante's (and Vergil's). Even with the original series, I (and probably some other fans) wondered if they had relations.

 

[Dante's Stalker]

Hey guys,

I had a few people contact me via email and youtube, maybe because they saw my photo with the DmC logo at the back, so I thought I would post here for people who have questions. First of all, I would like to say that I am no longer with Ninja Theory and I won't be sharing any corporate or confidential information.

I have been secretly coming to this website for the past few years to read what you have to say about the franchise, old and new games. I always respected everyone's opinion and learnt a lot about the fanbase through these forums, which was my intention.

I guess the reason I'm here is to share my experience in building DmC with all of you, as opposed to answering a couple of individual requests. As long as your questions focus on the game making process itself and not the companies and confidential stuff. I also wrote and directed the Vergil DLC, so feel free to ask about that too!

I'll answer all constructive posts and ignore anything that's offensive (I get it why this would be tempting, lol, but I read many posts like that already, plus I don't think you can learn anything new from that).

Hi, welcome to the forum!!
I'm totally giddy right now but...erm...
..... to the questions!

1. Is DmC AU, reboot, or both?
I don't know why nobody has asked this yet as this is the biggest question that came up from the first interview with NT.

2. Where was the mocap- no, nope, never mind.

3. Was Reub-okay can't ask that either.

4.ummmmm.....hmmm.....were you contracted by.....shoot, nope.


Aaaarggghhhhnever mind, just question number one then please @.@