(New Pachinko) Devil May Cry X Last Judgement

[Gel]

What I said was I wanted to see her and Dante interact more. The same could go for Lady, but even she's gotten more focus in that sense. The two just have a fun dynamic that I'd like to see more of.

They have in some media only released for Japan, like that CD drama, but as always we are the bastard children who never deserve anything, even if DMC fanbase is more solid here than Japan.

But - Once more - That does not explain why they originally had so much planned out for Dante.

Capcom cut out some money and members from DMC4 project to be used in Resident Evil.Other rumor was that Dante would become full demon and kill his two friends and a lot of other people, so Capcom decided it was two early for that.

About the time travel/ alternative dimensions: Kamiya had suggested that in the past as a solution for Vergil's case, but he wasn't taken seriously. Bayonetta allows that through "suspension of belief", but in DMC would be a kind of weird.

 

[Morgan]

Also, there are other members of the Order of the Sword, or at least I'm guessing more join now that Nero is the unofficial Demon Hunter of Fortuna now. That's an opportunity to introduce more characters, maybe establish a setting and formula for future games, and better, future plots.

We also have never seen Nero interact with Vergil in any way, alive or dead, and that alone has potential for epic narrative paths.

We can sum up the bolded with one word: Worldbuilding. We need worldbuilding in the DMC games.

It barely seems like Dante or Nero inhabit an actual world with people in it that react to things, so much as random set pieces floating in nothing. The locations are either "Dante's office" or "some remote island town", where coincidentally there are 0 people aside from Dante or Nero in the streets at any one time, unless it's a cutscene where they get slaughtered. And that's just humans I'm referring to. The devils and demonkind in general are another matter. Somehow we're supposed to believe that with the demon and human worlds interacting the way they have, not counting any demon character in the anime because of their one-off and inconsequential appearances, Sparda is the only devil that ever defected from Hell to mate with a human and produce halfbloods. DMC2 has the people in Dumary Island, but then only Matier and Lucia are there as "token non-Sparda partbloods", and Capcom is too busy half-disowning that game. Okay.

Still, there should be more characters aside from "Dante and the people he knows", whether they're also demon hunters or not. Complex characters showing the different reasons why a devil wouldn't want to align themselves with other demons or even why a human would want demonic power, but their respective reasons so far in four games in the classic series is "to be good/because they're good" for the former and "to be evil/because they're evil" for the latter. Like I said in another thread, Trish was the only real metric we had on how a devil born and raised in the Underworld could transition to human life and having a conscience, and we could use her to better grasp Sparda's character since he's mostly myth. But they blew it, so they better make good characters this time.

 

[LordOfDarkness]

@Morgan: The whole notion that the human world even exists in DMC is questionable at best, considering how a fudgin' tower manages to erupt from out of the ground and nobody seems to bat an eyelid. And demons running around the streets and nobody indoors thinking "This ain't right".

Humans (other than groups of people centred around worshipping or having known Sparda) don't exist in Devil May Cry. We have no actual proof that humanity is even a thing outside of those small islands of civilization that you mentioned. Yet the concept behind the entire games is "Bad demon turned good demon protects humankind", this goes from Sparda and then onto Dante, who assumes the role of "Earth's Protector". Despite the fact that we're never shown much of a world to begin with to even make any of the game's actual purpose seem relevant or believable.

 

[Foxtrot94]

@LordOfDarkness
Dunno what you're talking about. Of course humans and the human world exist in DMC.

Also, in the original series, human are aware of the demons' existance, since demons used to rule them before Sparda rebelled. Apparently there are accounts of those times, which Arkham studied for example, and despite most of it having turned into legend in present days, humans still believe in it, or others at least are "accustomed" to the notion of demons' possible existence. So the event of a giant tower jutting out of the ground or demonic outbreaks happening in a city ain't as much of a WTF to their eyes as much as say, the merging of the demon world with the human world in DmC, where humans don't believe in demons at all because contemporary society, nobody believes in the supernatural and all that yadda yadda.

Your complaint would stand some ground if DMC humans were like DmC's humans, not accustomed to the idea of the supernatural and inhabiting a clearly contemporary and more grounded world. It's the same difference between me and my grandma. She, like most women of her generation, is VERY religious and very much believes in spirits and all that stuff, while I really don't. So when she tells me the story of that time the day after her sister's husband died, when she heard knocking outside the door and nobody was there a second after, I can see she believes it's a supernatural phenomenon and doesn't question it, whereas me, at the very least I raise an eyebrow. DMC humans are like my grandma, they know demons exist, they're part of their history and out of the ordinary phenomena ain't as much of a big deal (in terms of questioning them) as it would be for us.

 

[LordOfDarkness]

@Foxtrot94: So you're telling me that DMC 3 had no human presence because humans know about demons and that's all okay? Yeah it makes sense in DmC because they actually add weight to it, but in DMC (other than what I said about those particular groups of people) you could argue that humanity itself is practically nonexistent, because as @Morgan said, they don't do any world-building.

The point is not to say that humans don't exist in DMC, or that societies aren't a thing. The point was how it's so minutely touched upon that one could argue if it really is all that important of a thing. And as I said, considering that the idea behind the story is "Bad demon turns good to protect humankind", you'd expect them to emphasize that aspect of the story. Yet what we're left with is empty streets to roam with no human presence, except for anyone that knew of Sparda. I can't remember ever seeing any single human character in DMC that wasn't there because of the sole purpose of having known Dante's father.

In DmC they make a big point that the human world exists, because they actually show you people just walking the streets and stuff.

But anyway, I just wanted to expand upon Morgan's point because I thought it was interesting and I agree. However, I think we've unintentionally veered this topic off course.

 

[Foxtrot94]

So you're telling me that DMC 3 had no human presence because humans know about demons and that's all okay?

No, that (like DMC1 and 2 before it as well) was because of technological limitations. The engine didn't allow to have groups of demons for you to hack and slash alongside with people running around. Especially during cutscenes, they couldn't render more than three or four characters at once without massive performance hindering, hence why they went for prerendered scenes in most cases. DMC4 was the only game in the original series where the tech was up to the task.

And as I said, considering that the idea behind the story is "Bad demon turns good to protect humankind", you'd expect them to emphasize that aspect of the story.

They do. Humanity is not thought merely in terms of PHYSICAL human beings. Rather, those qualities that are usually considered human, such as compassion, love, empathy etc.

Having more humans run around the streets during gameplay wouldn't add anything story wise, rather what it would do is add more immersion but I don't think that's really a priority when you're focusing on pulling off a stylish combo fighting baddies, which is the point of a technical stylish hack and slash game like DMC by the way. Not to mention it would clutter the screen and hinder performance, which in fast paced games like these, ain't a preferable thing.

Also, the idea behind the series is not "demon turns good to protect humankind". That's just the incipit of the whole story. The idea is more "demons can be caring and humans can be as evil as devils". And they HAVE emphasized on that. In all 4 games. And you don't need people on the streets during gameplay to do it.

 

[LordOfDarkness]

I said I didn't want to discuss it further so you go and quote me point for point? It's not related to the topic, so I'm not going to continue to discuss it. Especially not when I have a different opinion in regards to the matter, and I've already said everything I wanted to say. I thought that was clear when I said I was merely adding onto Morgan's point.

Your opinion is yours, and I respect that. But that doesn't mean I agree.

 

[Foxtrot94]

I said I didn't want to discuss it further so you go and quote me point for point?

Well ain't that convenient though. What's that, hit and run tactics?

As a last point, I'd like to point out that no game has ever had human running around the streets during actual gameplay, not even DmC. Except the more disliked and annoying sections like the walking and talking one in the Order HQ for example. That's because it's a known design thing that having people running around while you're hacking and slashing is generally a bad idea, for reasons above. You rather do that in cutscenes, and incidentally, that's more of a thing in games from the last generation onwards, because of improved tech that allows it in the first place.

 

[DarkSlayerZero]

 

[Gel]

@Viper , did you see? DMC4: Woodstock is a real thing. You will have some LSD as bonus. :wink:

 

[Viper]

@Viper , did you see? DMC4: Woodstock is a real thing. You will have some LSD as bonus. :wink:

I was more reminded of this commercial:

... but that LSD part still stands. That's one hell of a trip. XD