The turning point for the series

[Foxtrot94]

Vergil stabbing Dante with his own sword in DMC3 was a pretty cool story point, for a number of reasons.

Vergil inadvertently creates his own nemesis and the very being that will in the end defeat him.
Prior to the fight, it was clear as a thousand of suns that Vergil was the superior guy between the two. He beats Dante with seemingly no effort, even going as far as mocking him, with words and actions.
Stabbing him with his own sword was an act of haughtiness to humiliate Dante even in death, but it ended up unlocking Dante's potential and releasing his DT, thus beginning his path of gaining power.

Yep. That's another cool narrative point right there. I'm sure a lot of people have caught the irony of it: between the two brothers, Vergil is the one chasing power at all costs, yet he was also the one who allowed Dante to gain it, eventually denying it for himself.

Quite a nice result, considering that that could have been the end for Dante.

Obviously, being a prequel made after DMC1 and 2, we knew Dante was to survive, since he's alive in those two.

But anyway, ever thought about that? This moment is what allowed the other games's events to happen. Or to phrase it better, Vergil is the one who allowed the other games's events to happen. By creating his own nemesis and giving him the weapons to beat him, and to pull off all the feats Dante pulled off in the other titles.

 

[Gel]

Vergil was just a product of his own karma:
He was so blind in his searching for power that let himself to be manipulated and used.
It does not help he was always jealous of his mother's love for his brother and he wanted to compensate that ( his self loathing complex too) in acquiring more power( he even thought his bro's power was rightfully his).

 

[Foxtrot94]

Vergil was just a product of his own karma

Yes, that was basically the moral.

Chi di spada ferisce, di spada perisce.*





*He who lives by the sword, dies by the sword.

 

[Erian1Mortal]

If (and it's a big if) we count the DMC3 manga, then Dante was able to DT prior to being stabbed by Vergil.
Yes it wasn't controlled but it was a form of it.
The Mad Hatter even said that the blood of Sparda was flowing strong in one of the twins.

Outside of that, I pretty much agree with you (as I don't really count the material outside of the games themselves, not even the anime).

 

[Foxtrot94]

If (and it's a big if) we count the DMC3 manga, then Dante was able to DT prior to being stabbed by Vergil.
Yes it wasn't controlled but it was a form of it.
The Mad Hatter even said that the blood of Sparda was flowing strong in one of the twins.

One way or another, the point doesn't change: able to DT (even though uncontrollably) prior to the battle or not, it was still clear that Dante wasn't at Vergil's level then. Vergil himself made him so.

 

[Erian1Mortal]

One way or another, the point doesn't change: able to DT (even though uncontrollably) prior to the battle or not, it was still clear that Dante wasn't at Vergil's level then. Vergil himself made him so.

True, it was just something I wanted to add to your statement, never intendet to disprove the point that was being made. Besides, the manga was made after the games, and none of it was actually referenced (besides the twins meeting prior) in the game itself.
Dante might have put up an actual fight if he wasn't goofing around so much (which he only really stopped with after the Lady fight).

 

[berto]

I don't know if it was Vergil as much as Arkham manipulating the two. Vergil wasn't shocked or even a tad surprised at the reawakening Dante just had and he was ready to take him out while he was weak but Arkham is the one who made him leave so he wouldn't kill Dante before he became useless to his plot. Arkham was the one keeping all of them alive while setting up their confrontations.

I don't think Vergil was out to kill Dante in that fight. If anyone knew what it took to kill Dante it would be Vergil who had already awakened his demon blood and to pin him to the ground wasn't going to. I do think he did it out of hate but Dante awakening was an eventuality in his line of work, if not by Vergil then by others soon enough.

 

[Gel]

One way or another, the point doesn't change: able to DT (even though uncontrollably) prior to the battle or not, it was still clear that Dante wasn't at Vergil's level then. Vergil himself made him so.

In a way, Vergil was king and lord in that situation, even killing Beowulf, when Dante was only able to blind one of his eyes.
The funny thing is Dante got the power of Sparda Vergil wanted so bad and Vergil fell for a weak human, thing we only thought Dante would do.

 

[Foxtrot94]

Dante might have put up an actual fight if he wasn't goofing around so much (which he only really stopped with after the Lady fight).

He wasn't goofing around in the cutscene following the battle though. He looked actually pretty focused while he was fighting.

Vergil wasn't shocked or even a tad surprised at the reawakening Dante just had and he was ready to take him out while he was weak

Arkham is the one who made him leave so he wouldn't kill Dante

I don't think Vergil was out to kill Dante

I'm seeing a contradiction there.

 

[LordOfDarkness]

I've always seen it this way. Or better yet, I have more points to add.

Everybody goes on about how Vergil blindly goes after power. Well, wasn't the power he was seeking technically his anyway by right?

Think about it. He asks Dante why he denies gaining the power of their father, Sparda. Dante believes in himself and is confident of his abilities. He doesn't need to chase power. Vergil sees things differently. It's more a case of 'well these swords were left by my father', so his power and anything else of his should belong to me too.

He was probably pleased that he helped Dante awaken his devil trigger. If you'd like an example of why I think so, here's my reasoning.

Vergil doesn't want anyone unworthy to wield his father's power. He doesn't see Dante as unworthy. For him, Dante is his equal. When it was a matter of Arkham holding their father's power, that was enough for him to join forces with his brother. He's really not the big bad guy most make him out to be.

 

[Gel]

Everybody goes on about how Vergil blindly goes after power.

It's official material which says that:

 

[LordOfDarkness]

@Gel: That wasn't my point. I know that he does, but he tries to justify it with reasons. I don't see it as him being blinded, more so misguided.

 

[Gel]

@Gel: That wasn't my point. I know that he does, but he tries to justify it with reasons. I don't see it as him being blinded, more so misguided.

Well, his reasons seem to be right, but the way he acts is wrong. more or less like a chaotic good turned evil due to the collateral damage.
Shame Capcom never went further into characters.

 

[berto]

I'm seeing a contradiction there.

It's not complicated. Vergil pinned Dante to the ground through the center of his chest. If he wanted him dead it would've been through his heart. Once Dante awakened the situation changed. That's when when putting him down had become more difficult. I still don't know if Vergil would've killed Dante after that but Arkham seemed like he didn't want to risk losing one of his sacrifices and Vergil, been as methodical as he is, might've just be willing to at that point.

 

[Foxtrot94]

Vergil pinned Dante to the ground through the center of his chest. If he wanted him dead it would've been through his heart.

I think at this point you're reading too much into it, analyzing the position of the sword.

 

[berto]

I think at this point you're reading too much into it, analyzing the position of the sword.

If anyone knows how to kill Dante it's Vergil.

 

[Foxtrot94]

wasn't the power he was seeking technically his anyway by right?

Think about it. He asks Dante why he denies gaining the power of their father, Sparda. Dante believes in himself and is confident of his abilities. He doesn't need to chase power.

Oh, Vergil sure sees it that way too. He knows Dante is not after Sparda's power:

"Why do yo refuse to gain power? The power of our father, Sparda?"

And yeah to him it's one reason more to have it all for himself.

 

[DragonMaster2010]

It's official material which says that:

So THIS is where that whole "Mother likes Dante more then me" complex in DmC: VD came from.

 

[Gel]

So THIS is where that whole "Mother likes Dante more then me" complex in DmC: VD came from.

Yes and it is fallacious as DmC Vergil's beliefs: Dante was more clingy to mama while Vergil was more mature and well behaved.
While an adult would only shrug it off, in the eyes of a child his mama really loves his brother more, even if it's only to scream at his clingy brother.
Vergil and Dante are not so opposite as people want to believe.After all they were once one person.