Off-topic in threads.

[ZeroLove]

Everyone is so tight around here. Can't say a word about anything before everyone is shooting you down. And that's both on-topic and off-topic. Share your opinion and BAM, someone is surely going to be there to tell you it is wrong. I left the Capcom forums to avoid that, but it really isn't alot better here. There are just less users on here to do so.

I admit, I have a mind that wanders. I can easily go off-topic if something is mentioned that could relate to something not about the main topic. I have slight ADD, so that might be one of the reasons, but does it really have to be so strict around here? What's wrong with a bit off-topic chatter, as long it doesn't mean the main topic will be completely forgotten? Of course, if it goes too far, then a mod should go in and point people in the right direction, but it seems like just the itty bitty mentioning of something not directly part of the main topic is completely banned on here. And then again BAM, shutting down the thread. If a mod has to repeatedly going in and tell people to stop with the off-topic chatter, then I can understand it. But maybe give it a system, like, three strikes and you're out.

A mod can have a bad day, though, and be annoyed by the tiniest of things. They're only human, we're all humans here, we all make mistakes and we can all get grumpy from time to time, but being a mod takes a level of professionality. It's alot of work for those guys to police all us wild and crazy users, yelling at eachother in heated debates. So we all ought to respect them and I do. When I get a pointy finger from a mod, I get all "Uh-oh, I did something bad, sorry.", because it is never my intention to get on the mods' nerves. I don't intentionally go off-topic to tick people off.

For example with the ReRave/Donte issue in the "Changing Reactions" thread at the DmC section. I thought it was a bit unfair that ReRave got a pointy finger and Donte didn't, so I expressed that in a post. I didn't find it so personal that I had to IM Tony (the mod) about it, I didn't even think it was necessary. Really, it didn't cross my mind at all. And it certainly wasn't my intention to lead the thread off-topic and I'm sorry if it did. So I got a pointy finger too.

What is your thoughts about off-topic in threads? Is it necessary to be so strict about staying on the main topic of thread? Are the mods being too harsh? Are we users being too careless?

 

[ToCool74]

The only thing I would have to say on the matter is that I think this thread
http://devilmaycry.org/community/threads/should-capcom-have-approach-nt-to-reboot.10359/

Was closed to prematurely.

The little thing between myself and Tiran (which really was not all that serious IMO) was pretty much over and I asked him to agree to disagree and move on.

A certain member brought it back up and without warning the thread was closed.

I think the thread deserved at least 1 verbal warning before being closed down but instead it was closed outright.

Not sure if Tony may have been a little fed up after reading the reactions thread but I guess he had his reasons.

There is a reason why he is a moderator and you and I are not.

 

[Tony_Redgrave]

Before I go to the main subject "off topic" let me adress you personally Zwei for some stuff. So that we understand each other and make sure the conversation takes the right direction. Let's see.

Everyone is so tight around here. Can't say a word about anything before everyone is shooting you down. And that's both on-topic and off-topic. Share your opinion and BAM, someone is surely going to be there to tell you it is wrong. I left the Capcom forums to avoid that, but it really isn't alot better here. There are just less users on here to do so.

Not as tight as you might think. Personally, I the unforgiving moderator who shouts for off topic and locks threads, care not at all, about off topic unless the argument has reached a point that it might erupt into a flame something similar. Allow me to present you with examples using yourself. Please take no offense. I'm using you as an example since I know you are mature and would not rant at me for using you like that.

Let's see the last few times you were warned for off-topicness. Obviously I'm not talking about the thread "Should Capcom have approached NT for the reboot?" I mention it because I locked it earlier and I see you mentioned Tiran like you did in that post there. But I suppose that's a typo and you meant ReRave from the thread Changing Reactions, so let's adress that issue.

We have both Donte's and ReRave's posts that seem to emit some sort of ...not exactly hostility, but not exactly the feeling that a flower garden produces either. Anyway you get my point. However in their own way, they are on topic and they were not warned because of that, but because of their choice of words when expressing their opinions. I hope I made that clear when I said to tone down.

After I did that, and no more arguments/or discussions regarding that thread were taking place you appear and state your opinion about whether it's fair for only ReRave to receive a verbal warning. While you were right in pointing that out you were wrong of pointing that out in the thread. Not only do you prolong the subject which I tried to conclude when I intervened - something that we discussed together a few days ago and you seemed to accept to stop doing so - but you also become off topic. Now, do you think the problem was that you were off topic? No. It was mostly the fact that your post intentionally or not prolonged the discussion that I tried to end so that this won't become a flame. Did I say that what you say was wrong? No. I said that you could have told me in private. So in this situation, the off topic wasn't the real reason you were kinda told off.

Let's move on to a second recent example. Your disagreement with Meg in Gaming Discussion in the Final Fantasy thread.

Since you probably think the problem there was you being off topic, let me clarify again. No. The fact that made post after you, was that even though Meg clearly stated she was gonna make a new thread about this little discussion you started, you couldn't wait and post there and simply prolonged the off-topicness again. It's not so much that you're off topic as the fact that when someone or something tries to stop it, you appear and ressurect the whole deal all over again.

With that much said, let's move on to the on-topic and let me share my thoughts about the off-topic issue.

In general, I do not care if you guys go off topic. As long as the conversation got there by itself, and everyone still discusses the thing in a civilized manner, not only I won't say anything but I might also take part in the conversation. Because it might be interesting.

However, especially in sleeping-volcanos-threads where an argument might erupt from one moment to another (in this case most threads in DmC section) many people will always take some offense (can't help it, it's the internet) and signs of flame will start to appear. Then, I'll intervene. And this has nothing to do with off topic. However, after I intervene (not only me, every member of the staff that might do the honors) I expect each of you to accept that and continue the previous conversation in a civilized manner. I don't want us discussing whether it's fair or unfair that someone got told off and someone else didn't in the thread. I'm perfectly open to discuss it in private. However doing so in the thread will only make things worse in the long run. I hope you all understand why. And then you'll be told off for off topicness, no matter who you are.

Been writing this for some time while doing other stuff as well so I'm probably ninjaed, so I might edit later.

But for now.

Tony out.

EDIT: Let me adress ToCool as well.

The only thing I would have to say on the matter is that I think this thread
http://devilmaycry.org/community/threads/should-capcom-have-approach-nt-to-reboot.10359/

Was closed to prematurely.

The little thing between myself and Tiran (which really was not all that serious IMO) was pretty much over and I asked him to agree to disagree and move on.

A certain member brought it back up and without warning the thread was closed.

I think the thread deserved at least 1 verbal warning before being closed down but instead it was closed outright.

Not sure if Tony may have been a little fed up after reading the reactions thread but I guess he had his reasons.

There is a reason why he is a moderator and you and I are not.

The thread's closure was used mostly as warning against the fact that even though some arguments end one way or another, some people tend to bring them back (not only in that thread) these days which could kinda create chaos with all this repeat.

It wasn't locked because of you and Tiran, or because of something being done in this thread only.

However if you guys (I speak in general)are willing to continue the normal conversation and avoid unburrying the arguments I'm more than willing to unlock it.

 

[ZeroLove]

Oh, right, yeah, I meant ReRave. *facepalm*
Going to edit that now in the OP. XD

Also, I read what you wrote, Tony, and I will try not to repeat my mistakes. ^^

 

[Angel]

It's like this. Someone makes a thread about, say, enemies in the DMC series. The discussion goes well, there's some good info being floated around, and then one person posts something that's heading off on a tangent although still loosely related to the topic at hand. The next poster carries on in that vein, leading further and further away from the whole point of the original topic and then we end up with (mostly) two members either rowing about something dumb or start talking innuendo/nonsense.

So what do we have? 4 pages of "no u!" or "how you doin'?" - neither of which pertain to the thread topic and so when someone new jumps on board to check out a topic that interests them, all they see is page after page of nonsense which could have easily been put on profile messaging. Then that same new person makes a thread about enemies in DMC and gets shot down by everyone else because the topic already exists, even though people have cluttered said thread with rubbish and so the answer the new person wants was never found.

Ok, sure, they could have posted in the original thread. But often people don't because it's intimidating to jump in, as a new person, into a conversation that lost the point pages ago. Or because no one has said "enough with the off-topic please", they figure that the thread has no intention of ever reverting back to its original purpose so why not just save time and make a new one?

Off-topic in moderation is fine - I do it and so do other staff members. It's just part of conversation sometimes to lighten the mood with a picture or a meme. But when it goes on and on and on and on for ages without stopping in what could be considered an otherwise valid thread, it's annoying to see. And annoying to sift through. Or someone coming in with something that continues an off-topic conversation AFTER it's been pulled back on track - that's just rude. Take it to PM's if it's that important but if a thread has been taken back to the original point, keep it there.

Staff also tend to be stricter with repeat offenders, as it were. If someone is in the habit of getting threads off track then yeah, for the sake of everyone's sanity, someone will step in and push it back on track. But if staff have to repeatedly remind people to keep to the subject at hand then naturally it won't end well which is a shame for everyone.

tl;dr - at the end of the day, there are plenty of forums out there. If this is too strict for some people then they are not being forced into remaining here at all. Despite what we'd have you believe, you don't actually sign your life away when you join up here

 

[Dark Drakan]

Sharon and Tony have both pretty much summed up what I was going to say. We dont mind off topic comments here and there as we are a community of people communicating and it happens in conversations. However when 1 starts another follows before the thread is flood with posts that just bury the original topic. The staff aim to discourage that happening and also anticipate trouble and close threads to prevent it. As im at work on my phone I havent covered everything I wanted to but you hopefully get my point.