Force Awakens SPOILER Discussion

[LordOfDarkness]

@Jak: I kind of want Vader's force ghost to show up, and I also want him to tell Kylo that he was wrong all along about the dark side and how he was just being used by Palpatine. It'd be something to drive Kylo into wanting to take Snoke out of the picture (if Snoke is controlling Ren, like Han claimed). But not only that, but if Ren wants to be more powerful than Vader then he'd have to become the master himself. I think he'd only take from the "force ghost conversation" the idea that he has to be the one completely in charge and pulling the strings, so it'd set up some confrontation leading into the events of Episode 9.

 

[nephlim god]

Id like to see anakon/vader return. Isnt he born from the force. If the force can re awaken then why cant the chosen one and the one most intuned with the force return.

 

[LordOfDarkness]

Okay, so I've made a couple of remarks about Kylo Ren not seeming as "scary" or "intimidating" as Darth Vader. And the responses I've received from @Jak and @Dark Drakan are right, and I could not agree more with them.

Kylo Ren isn't quite "there yet", he isn't ready to become a Sith Lord like

Spoiler

his grandfather.

He wants to see the ways of the dark side, and is still conflicted due to the pull of the light side; due to his own inner-demons he's battling, he consults

Spoiler

his grandfather's helmet (Darth Vader's),

almost as if seeking counselling from him. It's unclear if Kylo really "hears" anything in terms of a response from Vader (some connection still felt through the strength of the force, even after Vader's demise). Should we assume that he does, then maybe he feels the answer he seeks to resolve his dilemma was to kill someone close to him (someone unwilling to give into the dark side), and someone that if he was able to 'destroy' would mean he's capable of putting all feelings of love, care and compassion aside, and fully be committed and devoted to the dark side of the force. Even if we don't go along with the assumption that he was influenced by any so-called mute response by Vader, it's still obvious to say he was able to follow through with what he felt was right for his cause.

Spoiler

And clearly his actions of killing Han mimicked his grandfather's actions of killing those close to him

(Palpatine made Anakin believe he had killed Padme. He went on and then killed those Younglings, and he killed Obi-Wan Kenobi who was like a brother to him. He also killed Mace Windu, and many others before succumbing to the light side and helping his son, Luke).

Spoiler

Whether Kylo knows all of this is unknown, but since we know his grandfather is his inspiration and that he idolises him, it's unquestionable that he's aware of Darth Vader's past.

 

[Director Bison]

Stormtrooper TR-8R or Trey Tor (i don't think that his official name but that's what everyone is calling him)
was the best part of the movie for me

"sees someone with a light saber"

BRING IT ON!

and he was going to win the fight before he got shot
total badass

i really hope he survived i love this guy

 

[LordOfDarkness]

@Director Bison: As cool as that stormtrooper is, I think he was killed when Solo blasted him =/

Spoiler

That scene when Kylo is trying to pull the lightsabre towards himself, but Rey overpowers him and it comes to her instead. Kind of funny that it was originally Anakin Skywalker's, who we all know becomes Darth Vader, and Kylo's grandfather. It makes me think it was perhaps intentionally meant to symbolise something, which I think is that Kylo has some more learning to do before he can become anywhere close to what Vader was (And my guess is that he was not only physically wounded from that fight, but very mentally "wounded" as well). I mean, he'd just killed Han Solo, his father. Not to mention what Rey said to him when she was able to read his thoughts, briefly. He's afraid that he won't live up to his potential, a great potential within the force, and won't be as powerful (well, more powerful) than Vader. So if you take all of that into account, he had a great disadvantage when facing Rey. It was only because Rey had a clear conscience, and was in fine form when going up against Kylo, that made her "win"

 

[Director Bison]

@Director Bison: As cool as that stormtrooper is, I think he was killed when Solo blasted him =/

that probably is what really. happened

but now that he is becoming a fan favorite they could easily recon the scene and say he survived being shot
at least that's what i want to happen

 

[LordOfDarkness]

@Director Bison: Oh, didn't know he had gotten so popular. Though I've got to admit, he's a pretty ballsy character. No saying he definitely did die, but I wouldn't put it past them...yet on the other hand

Spoiler

Han Solo. Now that guy's dead. You've got to han it to him, he knows how to fall off a bridge in style. I'm guessing his "freefall" was a solo mission

 

[Chancey289]

Just got back from Star Wars, and I thought it was a solid flick. Enjoyable and I'm not even really a Star Wars person. Felt like they were retreading a lot of ground from the previous movies here which was pretty much my biggest problem with it. But I digress, I really liked Rey and Finn, and Kylo Ren was kinda cool. Visually it was exciting, and the action was fun. I actually wanna see what happens next in this trilogy.

 

[Demi-fiend]

bumped

 

[AgentRedgrave]

@Dark Drakan Well think about it.
If you were the grandson of one of the most prominent/powerful men in the galaxy, wouldn't you wanna live up to his legacy?

As for why he idolizes Darth Vader and not Anakin Skywalker. From what I heard Ben Solo (Yeah we only hear his name was Ben, they never say his surname.....But come on, it's Ben Solo) simply felt that he would have been too weak to live up to his grandfather's legacy as a Jedi. So he turned to the darkside feeling that was the only way he could measure up.

I don't think it's a simple, he idolizes Vader not Anakin, cause the second he spotted Anakin's lightsaber he wanted it.

Finn: *Activates Anakin's lightsaber*
Kylo: *Draws his lightsaber at Finn* That lightsaber. It belongs to me.
Finn: Come and get it *Charges*

and he tried to grab it after Finn dropped it.

@LordOfDarkness
I often hear people complain about Adam Driver not being as menacing without his mask. Which makes me go "Well duh, that's why his character wears it".

But seriously, under his mask, Darth Vader was a broken old man.

Under his mask, Kylo Ren was a young man who felt conflicted with his choices and unsure of himself.

@Vergilius Has that guy seen the other 6 Star Wars movies? I can respect if he just doesn't like it. But the prequels reused a lot of the same plot points from the originals.

Heck, George Lucas has come out and said that a lot of the plot is Anakin and Luke going through the same situations, and going down the same path. Something Luke realizes in Return Of The Jedi when he looks at his mechanical fist and then Vader's stump.

 

[Dark Drakan]

@Dark Drakan Well think about it.
If you were the grandson of one of the most prominent/powerful men in the galaxy, wouldn't you wanna live up to his legacy?

As for why he idolizes Darth Vader and not Anakin Skywalker. From what I heard Ben Solo (Yeah we only hear his name was Ben, they never say his surname.....But come on, it's Ben Solo) simply felt that he would have been too weak to live up to his grandfather's legacy as a Jedi. So he turned to the darkside feeling that was the only way he could measure up.

I don't think it's a simple, he idolizes Vader not Anakin, cause the second he spotted Anakin's lightsaber he wanted it.

Finn: *Activates Anakin's lightsaber*
Kylo: *Draws his lightsaber at Finn* That lightsaber. It belongs to me.
Finn: Come and get it *Charges*

and he tried to grab it after Finn dropped it.

Snoke has obviously manipulated the image of his Grandfather in some way as Vaders reason for turning to the dark side was originally so he could have the power to save Padmé. A power he was told couldnt be taught by a Jedi and the light side of the force. A couple of people have said that maybe Snoke is impersonating Vaders force ghost to manipulate Kylo to the dark side as there is a part in the movie where he is staring at Vaders helmet and says 'Show me 'again' the power of the dark side'.

Many theories floating around about Snoke too I have to say...

Spoiler

Actually being Darth Plagueis

I hope the end payoff is as good as some of these theories I have been reading about.

 

[Demi-fiend]

Felt like they were retreading a lot of ground from the previous movies here which was pretty much my biggest problem with it.

Too much ground, imo.

 

[berto]

Not Han. NOT HAAANNNNN! That bastard. I hope when it comes time to slice your limbs they start with your nuts, you ingrate!!!



Anyway:

 

[Sparda's rejected son]

Has anyone noticed how little of Rey we learned of. I mean yes, the next films will more than likely fill in her backstory and such. But her character felt very Son Goku like. "Ooooh! Machines and repairing them turns me on!"
Very one dimensional.

 

[Demi-fiend]

Very one-dimensional, indeed.

 

[berto]

Ewan McGregor had one line in the film, he whispered Ray's name during the vision she had when she touched the lightsaber. Some people are saying it's a hint as to her heritage.

In my opinion it she has more to do with Luke than with Obi-Wan. I think she's Luke's daughter. The lightsaber that went from father to son now seeks Ray and the way that line was delivered I think she was implying that it seeks her by birthright.

 

[LordOfDarkness]

I'm going to apologise beforehand if I offend anyone, but what do people expect? I mean, would it be cool to know everything about Rey, Kylo, Snoke, etc., right from the start? No.

Honestly, I get the criticisms. I just don't think it ruins the experience as much as some people are saying. Did they play it safe? Of course they did. Wouldn't you if you had that much responsibility? They've kept the story about the Skywalker family, mostly everything revolves around them in the Star Wars movies. Don't expect too much from Episode 7. It is the beginning of a new trilogy.

 

[berto]

Speaking of Snoke, am I the only one who thought that name was just the dumbest? Snoke... It's just so meh for being the new ultimate evil. It should be the name of a throw away stormtrooper not what can only be described as the allusion of the devil.

By the way, Daniel Craig was in this movie. He was the stormtrooper who was watching Rey and got mid tricked into letting her go and dropping the gun.

 

[Dark Drakan]

Speaking of Snoke, am I the only one who thought that name was just the dumbest? Snoke... It's just so meh for being the new ultimate evil. It should be the name of a throw away stormtrooper not what can only be described as the allusion of the devil.

By the way, Daniel Craig was in this movie. He was the stormtrooper who was watching Rey and got mid tricked into letting her go and dropping the gun.

I still believe that the name Snoke is a cover for who he really is, still the name isn't great & not sure of thought process behind it. :laugh:

 

[Demi-fiend]