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WTF Sony? Some bad news regarding Spider-Man

AgentRedgrave

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I have no words to describe, just read
 

Carlos

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*shrugs* Who cares.

Sony has been killing it with every single thing related to Spiderman. And it shows. Everything Sony touches with regards to Spiderman sold so ****ing well. Nobody has been able to do what Sony did with the films, and games. So, the fact that they pulled out of crossovers because Disney wants more of the revenue-share...? It's theirs for now, unless Disney buys the actual franchise back from Sony, but if that happens, everything that relates to Spiderman will go into a downward spiral.

It is in Disney's best interest to keep this relationship going until Disney's got their **** together.
 

Teal

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Yeah, I don't see this situation sticking for long. Spiderman is a lucrative property for both companies. Taking him out the MCU would be a disaster for Disney while Sony have shown time and time again that they have no idea what to do with him. They know Far from Home only grossed a billion dollars because it was in the MCU and they know they can't continue the franchise themselves without making mention to the MCU. If they reboot again, that would not go over well with the fans who are already hysterical. It would probably end up a box office disaster.

Basically, this is the James Gunn debacle all over again.
 

Foxtrot94

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Whatever. Both Sony's latest Spidey films and the MCU's have been such a cringe fest I don't even care who owns the property anymore. Both of them have handled it poorly.
 

Carlos

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Yeah, I don't see this situation sticking for long. Spiderman is a lucrative property for both companies. Taking him out the MCU would be a disaster for Disney while Sony have shown time and time again that they have no idea what to do with him. They know Far from Home only grossed a billion dollars because it was in the MCU and they know they can't continue the franchise themselves without making mention to the MCU. If they reboot again, that would not go over well with the fans who are already hysterical. It would probably end up a box office disaster.

Basically, this is the James Gunn debacle all over again.
Ummmm...... I'm sorry, but where have you been sleeping? Under a rock? Sony does know what they want to do with Spiderman. It follows close enough to the comics that most of the Sony films are ripped straight out of the comics, with little nitty gritty Sony touches. Venom is GORGEOUS under Sony. Keep that theme going. Under Disney, it would be a shadow of the former self. I'm sorry, but you guys don't realize how bad it would be if Sony let go Spiderman and let Disney run amok with Spiderman.

Me? I would not change a goddanmn thing. Let Sony keep it as long as they want, and let them take the franchise as far as they can take it.

I will be honest though, the Spiderman films aren't perfect, but they are also not as bad as it would be if it was under Disney (Marvel is now owned by Disney, soooo....)
Whatever. Both Sony's latest Spidey films and the MCU's have been such a cringe fest I don't even care who owns the property anymore. Both of them have handled it poorly.
I agree with this somewhat, especially the latter, but I would be cringy if it (Spiderman/Venom) was under Disney, because of the whole ****ing SJW trash going on in the MCU.
 

AgentRedgrave

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@Carlos I liked Venom, but can you honestly say it was as good as Homecoming or Far From Home? Look at Sony's last three live-action movies before the deal with Marvel. Spider-Man 3, and The Amazing Spider-Man movies. People still fight over The Amazing Spider-Man movies (They're basically Spider-Man's equivalent to The Last Jedi, only worse since it's two of them). After things fell through with The Amazing Spider-Man movies, Sony didn't even know what they were gonna be doing, if it wasn't for Disney saving their @$$e$ they'd still would probably be clueless
 

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I see it more as a pyrrhic victory for Sony. They got back Spidey but I'm not sure how salvageable Tom Holland's Spidey is without his ties to the MCU. I can see them trying to soft reboot it and keep it vague as to what happened before the next film starts.

I rather not sit through another hard reboot unless it's with an older/more experienced Peter like in the PS4 game.

I don't see it as a setback for the MCU as they have other characters to rely on. Spidey's probably the easiest character to replace as Marvel has a ton of teenage nerdy everyman-types waiting in the wings. It might affect the comic division more than the movies as some fans accused Marvel comics editorial of treating the X-men/the Fantastic Four poorly because Disney didn't own the full rights.
 

Teal

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Into the Spiderverse - great movie, made 375 million on a 100 million budget. A soft flop.

Venom - critical failure but made a little more than 800 million on a 120 million budget.

Far from Home - first Spiderman film in history gross over a billion on a budget of 160 million.

But sure, I'm living under a rock here. You think all those 1.1 billion were grossed because people were enticed by the Sony logo slapped on it or maybe, just maybe, they went there to see the end of an era following the bombastic ending of Endgame?!

If Sony are adamant to keep the rights, they'll have to never make mention of the MCU and half-ass the rest of the story. They'll lose millions of dollars in tickets from people who aren't interested in that or who will boycott Sony just because they're MCU fanatics.

I give this a month or two before the two studios reach an agreement and things are back to normal. Both studios are interested in printing money and this deal wouldn't help their case.
 

Carlos

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@Carlos I liked Venom, but can you honestly say it was as good as Homecoming or Far From Home? Look at Sony's last three live-action movies before the deal with Marvel. Spider-Man 3, and The Amazing Spider-Man movies. People still fight over The Amazing Spider-Man movies (They're basically Spider-Man's equivalent to The Last Jedi, only worse since it's two of them). After things fell through with The Amazing Spider-Man movies, Sony didn't even know what they were gonna be doing, if it wasn't for Disney saving their @$$e$ they'd still would probably be clueless
I think the first one was eh... But the next 2 were getting better, and better. It seems like Sony got the knack for it, so when The Amazing Spiderman was released, it was eh, okay. But not as "Eh..." like the first one. I couldn't get over Parker in Spidey 1 & 2. They showed better story progression in the second half of 2, then into 3. Especially when Parker loses the symbiote. He was an @$$hole during the symbiote phase, which kinda gives him character. But once he loses it, he brings back the romantic side of Parker, that Mary Jane instantly loves again. The reason why i don't like the Parker in Spidey 1 through 3 is the portrayal of Parker as this geek. I mean, he was a geek, but for a film...? It was way over the top kind of "geek." Then you got the whole "nice guy" shtick - which makes guys like you and myself look weaker. You need to understand: Films are used as a tool on perceptions of us. So, if a writer wants you to be percieved as a geeky nobody in the basement playing video games all day, that's your brand. I just didn't like Parker then. Which is why I like the new actor playing Parker (Holland). He played the role of Spiderman better than the original Spiderman films. The issue with the new films is that story has holes in it. If you really try to drill down on the plot, you'll realize some dependencies.

I say the same for Smallville. I like the actor, I like the story, but the issue is that it's not really faithful to the story of the comics. Same concept, same idea. In my opinion, Sony had more freedom with Amazing and Far from home films (homecoming, etc). But if you're a comic fan, you'll poke at the plot holes with "why did he do this," and "what just happened?" So, as a casual Spidey fan, I don't realize the issues.

I am not saying that Venom is better than Homecoming and Far from home, but what I am saying is that Sony is doing a good job with those films than the original 3 films. It's because Marvel and Sony were collaborating from time to time, like Marvel gives Sony ideas on where to go with the story of 2 based on 1 (I'm using numbers as hypotheticals). So, if Homecoming has a cliffhanger of sorts, Far from home would have to leave off of that one, unless MCU is right in the middle. I get where Marvel is trying to go with the crossover, but from what I read there, it's more than just money. I mean, it has more to do with money, yes, but at the same time, Sony also realizes that the public's perception of MCU is not good, so Sony shrugs off the partnership and go like "see if I give a ****."

Disney didn't do ****. They just let the partnership go in directions where they may lay. Disney just swoops in and buys Marvel, and expects Spiderman to be in there. They don't even realize Spiderman is a Sony brand now. So, I'm siting here laughing at Disney because they probably bought Marvel with EVERYTHING included.

EDIT: While I posted this, @Teal rebutted me, so I'll edit here:
Venom - critical failure but made a little more than 800 million on a 120 million budget.

Far from Home - first Spiderman film in history gross over a billion on a budget of 160 million.

But sure, I'm living under a rock here. You think all those 1.1 billion were grossed because people were enticed by the Sony logo slapped on it or maybe, just maybe, they went there to see the end of an era following the bombastic ending of Endgame?!
Even when Marvel was its own company, they never made money from films in theatres, their money was from the overall franchise. Films on DVD/BD, Shirts, Toys, Books, Games, Mobile Games. List goes on. Disney on the other hand doesn't make money from the films in theatres, either. Because their company is a global media giant. They also make money off franchises - books, films on DVD/BD, Toys, Shirts, Bedsheets, Mobile Games, crappy Video games (YES, CRAPPY), airing their films/shows on TV, and so on and on. The thing is, Disney also has theme parks - that's their entire business. So, yes, they can make money off those films regardless of if they fail at box office. They make money somewhere else. Companies don't worry about losses on films - kinda like the same way Microsoft, Sony, and Nintendo doesn't worry about losing money on every console sold. Why? Software.

You need to understand HOW Marvel operates, HOW Disney operates to really understand why these companies don't care about losses. The reason why LucasArts was sold, is simple. Lucas doesn't have the manpower to handle all of the business as it was. It was getting too much for him. Star Wars is big, but Lucas doesn't have the manpower to license it out to everyone who wants a piece of the pie. Disney does.
If Sony are adamant to keep the rights, they'll have to never make mention of the MCU and half-ass the rest of the story. They'll lose millions of dollars in tickets from people who aren't interested in that or who will boycott Sony just because they're MCU fanatics.
Nobody will care. I honestly don't care. Even in the MCU, Spidey had a little part in the series. He's just a cameo. Soooo.... That's where Sony is trying to go with this "let's just pull it out of there if they are not going to pay us."
I give this a month or two before the two studios reach an agreement and things are back to normal. Both studios are interested in printing money and this deal wouldn't help their case.
You're right, it's not going to help their case. I agree with you there.
 
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Carlos

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Shortly after this story broke out... Sony made an official statement about the issue...

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EDIT: The embedding feature is buggy on this site, but you can either click the link or go to your right click, and open in new window.
 

BrawlMan

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Goddamn it, Sony and Disney! You're dicking over your audience for stupid greed! I hope everythings turns out better, but I am not going to hold my breath. Spider-Verse 2 better not get f#cked over, because of this. I know Disney has no ownership over that one, but still.
 

Demi-fiend

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The video states this whole debacle may or may not be sorted out soon. We'll see.

So, if Spider-Man stays out of Marvel, does that mean that the next MvC won't have him (or Brock) as part of their roster?

For the record, I'm all for Sony's Venomverse. For now, I'm taking their side, despite Amy Pascal's (many) shenanigans. Enter the Spider-Verse proved that Sony can allow the people they've hired to create good movies without studio interference.

The finishing move here would be if Sony were to somehow acquire the rights to Daredevil through some legal loophole (won't happen of course, but still). That would leave Disney in an even worse position than they are now.
 

Carlos

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What meme?
@Ash's image is a meme. People post images like that like it's a joke. Therefore it's a meme.

Gifs are usually also memes, especially when it's accompanied by a word or sentence to describe a feeling, idea, action, etc.

EDIT: I understand now why @AgentRedgrave asked.
 
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Demi-fiend

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@Ash
Well, that was fast........ :whistle:

I'm neutral to the Venomverse as I need to see the other characters are handled first.
 

Demi-fiend

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I'm neutral to the Venomverse as I need to see the other characters are handled first.
The video did say that the problem might be handled "really soon."

I don't think there's going to be a venomverse anymore since, according to the more recent vid I posted, Marvel might be trying to absorb Venom (along with the rest of the venomverse characters like Morbius) into the MCU as well.
 

Carlos

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The video did say that the problem might be handled "really soon."

I don't think there's going to be a venomverse anymore since, according to the more recent vid I posted, Marvel might be trying to absorb Venom (along with the rest of the venomverse characters like Morbius) into the MCU as well.
It'll be fine. Spiderman is currently legally Sony's brand from the movie and games perspective. That includes Venom. This is a little spat, but journalists are writing about it because Spiderman is big. The issue with journalists is that they misconstrue certain details to make a story a bigger deal than what it actually is.
 
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