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A Serious Comparison

DragonMaster2010

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That's what I'm saying. The anime for example is SO important to me for the Devil May Cry universe. Besides tiny bits of DMC4 which had Trish and Lady in the same scenes, the anime showed Trish and Lady in the same universe, coexisting. Thus, the bridge between DMC1 and DMC3 was effectively made into one whole continuity. And the best part? It works! All of the characters play so well off one another. They all could exist effectively in the same universe and it's a pity Kamiya was never brought back, or hell, that writing a decent script wasn't an option for Capcom, apparently.

That I don't really agree with. The anime, in my eyes, wasn't the best thing in all of DMC. The story was okay, but just not what I'd expect from the same people who made DMC3. All in all the anime was a bit of touch and go with the Lady and Trish bridge as they just fought, became friends, and one was hardly seen until the last episode.

Was the series' overall story flawed? Yes. But it could've been fixed. Devil May Cry wasn't the sick dog that needed to be put down like Capcom and Ninja Theory and detractors keep making it out to be. I don't know what it's going to take now. Capcom is throwing everything into this reboot. They're even making the new Devil May Cry movie that was announced be based on the DmC reboot. If the reboot does well, this is the Devil May Cry that mainstream media will know. If it does terribly, the series will probably be left to die on it's own. Hopefully, DMC can pull a Prince of Persia and leapfrog over the ****ty reboot that they had and move on with the series. Even if the games that came after that werent nearly as good, Ubisoft wasn't stupid. They let the Prince of Persia reboot buried in the dust. Or sand, more appropriately. The same should happen to the DmC reboot, in my opinion. Either that, or rename it something else and change all the character's names. Because if there's one thing I know, it's not Devil May Cry

Whoa there.

The game isn't even out yet, and we don't even know if the reboot will be ****ty so that's to quick of judgement there. Secondly, I can actually see DmC as a movie because it takes a more darker cinema road from the original DmC. The only thing I worry about is the fact that the movie will be butchered up. Not because old Dante wasn't in it, but because they might pick the wrong directors for the movie itself. However, if DmC is handled by the resident evil people, then that can give them a chance to start from where DmC ended.

Also, say DmC wasn't being handled by NT or Capcom but Kamiya, and he decides to change Dante's look. Would most of the fans still be calling it ****ty if it was under Kamiya, the original creator's plan? Since some say "It's not NT, so they can't say bad things about it" . So what if Kamiya changed Dante's look and said himself that DMC was getting stale. Of course this is just an example not true event thinking.

I think the game will be fine, cause of new fans curious of the game, old fans giving it a shot, and people who were lured by controversy.

a new look, and director's words don't all ways break a game.

I mean look at TMNT's many remakes?
 

VoR-SaL

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Afterall we know quite a bit about this new Vergil. Even this DmC5... Cuz this game is completely different than others, isn't it? A Gothic-hair-emo Dante... An unknown girl... A completely different Vergil... Weird places... Strange imaginary platforms... Fighting in TV programm...Thousands of symbols... A rummy voice that always says "Come closer... oH I will kill you... F*** you.."
The only similarities are the GoD-DamNed comBos!! Stinger, Helm Breaker, Aerial Rave, Drive, Prop&Shredder, anD hell yeah Million Stab, ahhh yea sorry THE TRILLION STABS .. :)
On the other hand Dante's lifetime girlfriends: Ebony&Ivory!! Chargeshot... Rainstorm...
I missed you girls....
 

Agility

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hmm. so do you mean vergil in devil may cry 3(SE) used to have a good hearth?... goodwill..?:blink: or do you mean "Vergil should have been a generous and gracious man from the beginning; so, that new innocent image in DmC5 has fit to Vergil very good and better than he used to be in DmC3"? ?
If i misunderstood anything or made a grammar mistake, please make me notice.... English isn't my native language, I'm from Turkey ...

What I'm saying is this Vergil is more of a hero than Dante is coming off to be. Sure, we know Dante is our main protagonist but, Vergil seems to be much more into the role than his younger brother. Vergil gives Dante purpose for killing demons. Vergil seems ecstatic to have accomplished so much on his own and now that Dante is there, they can be heroes together. He is exactly how I envisioned him as a good guy.

Vergil: "Come Dante, let us go-"
Dante: "**** some **** up."
Vergil: "Heh, after you."
Dante: "Damn right."
 
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KtWtWiS43

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Whoa there.

The game isn't even out yet, and we don't even know if the reboot will be ****ty so that's to quick of judgement there. Secondly, I can actually see DmC as a movie because it takes a more darker cinema road from the original DmC. The only thing I worry about is the fact that the movie will be butchered up. Not because old Dante wasn't in it, but because they might pick the wrong directors for the movie itself. However, if DmC is handled by the resident evil people, then that can give them a chance to start from where DmC ended.

Also, say DmC wasn't being handled by NT or Capcom but Kamiya, and he decides to change Dante's look. Would most of the fans still be calling it ****ty if it was under Kamiya, the original creator's plan? Since some say "It's not NT, so they can't say bad things about it" . So what if Kamiya changed Dante's look and said himself that DMC was getting stale. Of course this is just an example not true event thinking.

I think the game will be fine, cause of new fans curious of the game, old fans giving it a shot, and people who were lured by controversy.

a new look, and director's words don't all ways break a game.

I mean look at TMNT's many remakes?

Well I don't mean to put down the remake before I have a chance to play it (I do) but, when I say that the reboot is going to suck, it's because the core of the games, as set down by Kamiya and Itsuno's work, is no longer present. What made me originally like the series is utterly non-present. Which to me is such a terrible loss to squander such an amazing story and characters in place of ones I do not care about, nor am willing to trade in for the characters that I love. Especially when the new ones are being called "Dante" and "Vergil." These characters aren't made of the same stuff that brought me to the series in the first place, and Capcom/Ninja Theory made sure of that. They wanted to make the new game so much more radically different, and I for one do not see any of what I originally loved, so mission accomplished. When the entire series was remade in an effort to bank in on my money as well, that's just "beyond forgiveness," as Credo said. I don't support Capcom, and I don't support this new release. I'll rent it of course, and play it for myself, but I already know that the "Devil May Cry," title on the box of the game will be useless. They should've just renamed it.

As far as changing Dante in general, I wouldn't be in support of it no matter who was behind the chair. Besides the fact that Hideki Kamiya would've never in a million years made a reboot like this, it's already been stated that the reboot was made for the sake of money rather than artistic expression. As a Devil May Cry fan, and someone who buys and appreciates true artistic expression, Capcom/NT has offended me past the point of reason.

They will get my money for Resident Evil 6 and so far, nothing else. The reboot in the end, probably won't be terrible, but to award montary compensation to Capcom for it compromises my beliefs in self worth and my passion for quality in my videogames.

Ps. If the company behind Resident Evil gets the rights for a Devil May Cry movie (they did) then don't be surprised when the movies are about Project Dante fighting the evil Umbrella corporation .. and there's a room full of Dante clones! because ... his blood is the key to stopping the infection .. and .. desert full of zombies .. and K-MART! KAYYY MARTTTT!!! IS THAT WHAT YOU WANT!? MORE KMART!?!? WHYYYY!?!?!???!
 
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berto

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As far as changing Dante in general, I wouldn't be in support of it no matter who was behind the chair. Besides the fact that Hideki Kamiya would've never in a million years made a reboot like this, it's already been stated that the reboot was made for the sake of money rather than artistic expression. As a Devil May Cry fan, and someone who buys and appreciates true artistic expression, Capcom/NT has offended me past the point of reason.

Well, as one of the few people here whose actually played the demo I can testefy that the game plays well and it certainly feels like a DMC title in your hands so that's a none issue. But I do agree with you on this. It's a bit abstract when I think about what has been done and I get it, I know why they did it but I nether agree nor approve. They seemed to have worked very hard to keep everything intact, the gameplay, the feel, the writing, the characters, everything but the designs. Did it really bother people that much that Dante looked the way he did that they thought that if they changed it it would bring in more people? I suppose they did, and to some extent I suppose maybe it's true.
 

VoR-SaL

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What I'm saying is this Vergil is more of a hero than Dante is coming off to be. Sure, we know Dante is our main protagonist but, Vergil seems to be much more into the role than his younger brother. Vergil gives Dante purpose for killing demons. Vergil seems ecstatic to have accomplished so much on his own and now that Dante is there, they can be heroes together. He is exactly how I envisioned him as a good guy.

Vergil: "Come Dante, let us go-"
Dante: "**** some **** up."
Vergil: "Heh, after you."
Dante: "Damn right."
Yea.Got it. Thanks... So do you know anything about voice sounders of our heroes? Are Reuben Langdon and Jonathan Mallen keeping their jobs? I can almost hear sound of Vergil :)
Might controls everything, and without strength you cannot protect anything, let alone yourself.

You must be registered for see images
 
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KtWtWiS43

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Well, as one of the few people here whose actually played the demo I can testefy that the game plays well and it certainly feels like a DMC title in your hands so that's a none issue. But I do agree with you on this. It's a bit abstract when I think about what has been done and I get it, I know why they did it but I nether agree nor approve. They seemed to have worked very hard to keep everything intact, the gameplay, the feel, the writing, the characters, everything but the designs. Did it really bother people that much that Dante looked the way he did that they thought that if they changed it it would bring in more people? I suppose they did, and to some extent I suppose maybe it's true.

I see what you're saying, but keep in mind that the physical design wasn't the only change made to the game. I feel like most of the arguments between supporters of the reboot, and loyalists of the old games comes from the cliched "Dante's hair isn't white," mentality. Totally false. The story, the characters, and driving themes of the original series are what brought me back to the Devil May Cry series, and their apparent non-presence in the reboot are what's leaving me with a bad taste in my mouth. Aside from that, I watched the 39 minute gameplay video from the demo's that I'm assuming you played. Under Watch and Secret Ingredient right? The Under Watch demo showed the new Dante's use of Angel and Demon powers, which seem lifted directly from the platforming genius of Nero's Devil Bringer arm. This was something I also noticed with Dante's scythe, which would grab enemies and pull them closer to him in the same fashion. Overall, the gameplay looked very similar to the old games with a focus on aerial combat, that's been a series staple since DMC1.

And then with Secret Ingredient, the "Poison," boss battle seemed almost carbon copied from the excellent Colossus of Rhodes boss fight from God of War 2. It just seems like Ninja Theory is taking everything from the old games they said was "outdated," without putting anything new in. They're even lifting off of God of War now, which used to be directly inspired by Devil May Cry, not the other way around. I mean, I'm trying to give DmC a chance, but it just feels like the only changes that were actually made to the reboot is the new story and physical design, which dropped a series worth of characters I really cared about. Speaking of "dropped," the 30fps switch is yet another disheartening fact that just tells me that the quality of the old games isn't there, be it graphics or story-wise. Is that worth your money?
 
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KtWtWiS43

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That I don't really agree with. The anime, in my eyes, wasn't the best thing in all of DMC. The story was okay, but just not what I'd expect from the same people who made DMC3. All in all the anime was a bit of touch and go with the Lady and Trish bridge as they just fought, became friends, and one was hardly seen until the last episode.

Oh just clarifying, but I didn't think the anime was THE BEST thing the series had to offer. It had alot of problems storywise and the premature ejaculation of every fight scene really got to me. But I do think that it's important because mainly, it shows how Kamiya and Itsuno's Devil May Cry games can exist coherently in the same universe. The point of this of course, is that a story set after DMC2 could've worked. Alot of people are freaked out by how non-linear the storyline is, but I just know looking at the anime that these characters could've worked on screen together.
 

berto

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I see what you're saying, but keep in mind that the physical design wasn't the only change made to the game. I feel like most of the arguments between supporters of the reboot, and loyalists of the old games comes from the cliched "Dante's hair isn't white," mentality. Totally false.
Well, the white hair is the most first and most noticible thing at first glance, which is why people were so poignant and adamant of the hair, because it's the first most obvious change so it's what people clinged to when they needed to vent. The issue's were broader and deeper than that but it was hard to articulate those issues so the white hair became the cry of the public. Like been at a loss for word and just pointing and saying 'Well, just look at it.'

I also never did appretiate how people would underappreciate the white hair and how often they would put it down for whatever reason just to elevate their prefference. There was nothing about Dante's design that was meaningless and when I've tryed to explain that people have downplayed what I say and dismissed it, sometimes with contempt, sometimes with a disinterested brush off.

The story, the characters, and driving themes of the original series are what brought me back to the Devil May Cry series, and their apparent non-presence in the reboot are what's leaving me with a bad taste in my mouth.

Yeah, that is true, their driving themes and elements have changed. Poison, for example, would never be a boss fight design were it still part of the original franchise. The original E&I were weapons that were designed as part of a RE game and these look like they belong in a Final Fantasy game. The weapons strike me as designs that would never have been considered on the original franchise; Then again, I think that was the very point of it all.

Aside from that, I watched the 39 minute gameplay video from the demo's that I'm assuming you played. Under Watch and Secret Ingredient right?
Yarp. I made a thread on the DmC section, if you want the details of that whole experience.

The Under Watch demo showed the new Dante's use of Angel and Demon powers, which seem lifted directly from the platforming genius of Nero's Devil Bringer arm. This was something I also noticed with Dante's scythe, which would grab enemies and pull them closer to him in the same fashion. Overall, the gameplay looked very similar to the old games with a focus on aerial combat, that's been a series staple since DMC1.
Actually, I've mentioned that that aspect of the gameplay was very similar to Bayonetta's wip which both brings the enemy to you and takes you to them.


And then with Secret Ingredient, the "Poison," boss battle seemed almost carbon copied from the excellent Colossus of Rhodes boss fight from God of War 2. It just seems like Ninja Theory is taking everything from the old games they said was "outdated," without putting anything new in.
Well, Tam also said that something that was cool 12 years ago (Or was it 10?) is no longer cool, and yet that whole hiden/subliminal messege theme is from one of his favorite movies, They Live, which is from the 80's.

There are alot of contrasting things in this production. You will hear them say one thing and do another on the actual game. I think they were provably trying to calm the masses so they said what they thought was give them the best reactions.

They're even lifting off of God of War now, which used to be directly inspired by Devil May Cry, not the other way around.
Capcom isn't going for originality, they are going for sales and NT is provably looking at succesful games in the same genre as refrence to advance the development. Maybe they are trying to go for what sales rather than what's new.

I mean, I'm trying to give DmC a chance, but it just feels like the only changes that were actually made to the reboot is the new story and physical design, which dropped a series worth of characters I really cared about.
To a large degree, your right, that is what they did. I guess people will buy this over a game that looked closer to the original design. Alot of my friends poke fun at Dante's design and one of them is even more exited about the new look and descrived it as 'he got rid of that assh*&^ trenge coat.'

Why change it if your not going to change it? Because it will sell more if you do. Know your audience, and in this case this new look is designed to bring in a new and younger audience and there for you appeal to them. This game is more up my friend's alley because this look is the kind of thing that appeals to him.

Speaking of "dropped," the 30fps switch is yet another disheartening fact that just tells me that the quality of the old games isn't there, be it graphics or story-wise. Is that worth your money?
Well, don't be too concerned about the frame rate, the game was very responceive and played even faster than DMC4.

As for whether or not I'd pay for it? I don't know. I certainly don't think I'll be letting NT or Capcom have my money so I'm going to buy it used if I do buy it.
 

KtWtWiS43

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Well, the white hair is the most first and most noticible thing at first glance, which is why people were so poignant and adamant of the hair, because it's the first most obvious change so it's what people clinged to when they needed to vent. The issue's were broader and deeper than that but it was hard to articulate those issues so the white hair became the cry of the public. Like been at a loss for word and just pointing and saying 'Well, just look at it.'

I also never did appretiate how people would underappreciate the white hair and how often they would put it down for whatever reason just to elevate their prefference. There was nothing about Dante's design that was meaningless and when I've tryed to explain that people have downplayed what I say and dismissed it, sometimes with contempt, sometimes with a disinterested brush off.



Yeah, that is true, their driving themes and elements have changed. Poison, for example, would never be a boss fight design were it still part of the original franchise. The original E&I were weapons that were designed as part of a RE game and these look like they belong in a Final Fantasy game. The weapons strike me as designs that would never have been considered on the original franchise; Then again, I think that was the very point of it all.


Yarp. I made a thread on the DmC section, if you want the details of that whole experience.


Actually, I've mentioned that that aspect of the gameplay was very similar to Bayonetta's wip which both brings the enemy to you and takes you to them.



Well, Tam also said that something that was cool 12 years ago (Or was it 10?) is no longer cool, and yet that whole hiden/subliminal messege theme is from one of his favorite movies, They Live, which is from the 80's.

There are alot of contrasting things in this production. You will hear them say one thing and do another on the actual game. I think they were provably trying to calm the masses so they said what they thought was give them the best reactions.


Capcom isn't going for originality, they are going for sales and NT is provably looking at succesful games in the same genre as refrence to advance the development. Maybe they are trying to go for what sales rather than what's new.


To a large degree, your right, that is what they did. I guess people will buy this over a game that looked closer to the original design. Alot of my friends poke fun at Dante's design and one of them is even more exited about the new look and descrived it as 'he got rid of that assh*&^ trenge coat.'

Why change it if your not going to change it? Because it will sell more if you do. Know your audience, and in this case this new look is designed to bring in a new and younger audience and there for you appeal to them. This game is more up my friend's alley because this look is the kind of thing that appeals to him.


Well, don't be too concerned about the frame rate, the game was very responceive and played even faster than DMC4.

As for whether or not I'd pay for it? I don't know. I certainly don't think I'll be letting NT or Capcom have my money so I'm going to buy it used if I do buy it.

Yah I totally agree, it sounds like we're on the same page. Arguably though, you could go all the way back to Scorpian from Mortal Kombat, who was the first videogame character to have a grapple move to bring the enemy closer, so the connection you made with Bayonetta doesn't seem to be Devil May Cry 4 inspired to me. At least to the depth that Nero's Devil Bringer brought to the gameplay in terms of grabbing and flying through the air. The reboot does however seem very, very similar to the point where it seems ripped off.

But I could talk about the reboot forever, as evident by this thread ha. I think we can agree that it's a shame that Capcom rebooted the series, despite that they will probably get some new fans
 
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V's patron

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Yea.Got it. Thanks... So do you know anything about voice sounders of our heroes? Are Reuben Langdon and Jonathan Mallen keeping their jobs? I can almost hear sound of Vergil :)
Might controls everything, and without strength you cannot protect anything, let alone yourself.

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Vergil in dmc3 is voiced by Dan south worth not John Mallen.
 

berto

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Arguably though, you could go all the way back to Scorpian from Mortal Kombat, who was the first videogame character to have a grapple move to bring the enemy closer, so the connection you made with Bayonetta doesn't seem to be Devil May Cry 4 inspired to me.
No, that's not what I mean. Kulshedra, Bayonetta's whip has a function that is exactly the same as the demon and angel pulls. Hold the attack botton to grapple your enemies to you and hold attack button + directional button to go to them.
 

DevilsAdvocate1234

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No, that's not what I mean. Kulshedra, Bayonetta's whip has a function that is exactly the same as the demon and angel pulls. Hold the attack botton to grapple your enemies to you and hold attack button + directional button to go to them.

Ha, well it wouldn't be the first time Tameem and Co. ripped off of material they labeled uncool.
 
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TheDarkSlayer

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Yea.Got it. Thanks... So do you know anything about voice sounders of our heroes? Are Reuben Langdon and Jonathan Mallen keeping their jobs? I can almost hear sound of Vergil :)
Might controls everything, and without strength you cannot protect anything, let alone yourself.

You must be registered for see images

Did you just say DmC Vergil sounds like DMC3 Vergil?